I Can't Belive It's Not Butter...

[tcm]

Sealine build quality

aha. So are there specific areas where the build quality is evidently poor? And/or is it a series of issues where the materials chosen aren't up to the mark, like here? After all, they get a hull, plop in some volvos and eventually screw in some raytheon dials, just like all the rest. So it must be down to the plastics, woodowrk and "general feel"? Give examples from your mates boat?

 

[hlb]

Re: Sealine build quality

Daft Duck Billed Front. For a start!!

<font color=red> No one can force me to come here-----------
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Haydn

 

[msimms]

Re: But you said it ISN\'T fair enough

Is Sealine quality that suspect?

After looking around the various offerings for the past eighteen months we decided that a second-hand S34 seemed to meet our requirements and planned to start looking seriously towards the end part of next year to purchase.

Should we re-think? I'd be interested to hear comments from any S34 owners.

Cheers

Mark

 

[hlb]

Re: But you said it ISN\'T fair enough

Not sure. No personal experience. But whilst over in france earlier this summer. Met up with some one in a Sealine 30ish. Same year as my P35. 1989. My P35 is still like new. Except for the carpets and upholstery which just gets repaced now and then. But the Sealine was knackered. Cracks in the fibreglass. Bits broke off. Looked realy tatty. Course it might just have been bad owners??

<font color=red> No one can force me to come here-----------
----- I'm a Volunteer! /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

Haydn

 

[nicho]

Re: Ooh. An audience with Sealine.

If Sealine have any sense, they'll get their information from market sources, and not from people with engineering degrees - marketing led by engineers usually leads to bankruptcy.

 

[markc]

Re: Sealine build quality

Some examples of poor quality and things I don't like that I have seen on a range of Sealines (not all evident on all) would include

cracked internal mouldings
one piece 'drop in' heads that you can get access to a leaking pipe
de-laminating teak ply
cheap fastnings
cheap spring hinges
plastic hinges
pretend wood
nasty carpet
lighweight feel
poor finishing


but all IMHO of course!

M

http://www.geocities.com/jinto100/Jintopics.html

 

[tcm]

Re: Ouch!

But isn't that the problem?

UK tendency is to have each person pigeonholed into being an "engineer" or "marketing person" or "bean counter" and so on, all (usually) in separate building aruond the plant, each building their empire.

What's needed are accoutants who have an appreciation of manufacturing constraints and that forward orders have been placed so that costs can't actually be cut "today" for example. They need engneers who'll make sure everything works but not so beautifully that it costs a fortune or is too heavy. And so on, all on the same side. Lots of japanese engineering shows this sort of mentality and note that the Lexus was their first punt at making a Mercedes without seven or eight previous models and without 50 years experience.

Sadly, Sealine aren't alone in being poor at listening to others from a wide variety of sources - who wish them well and actually want to help. It would be a shame if they went and spent a load of money on "marketing" types when the obvious things are staring them in the face, written about in the mags and informally here. We know what crap carpet feels like underfoot, and the saving is small. We know what fake leather is and the saving has been small - they've lost customers today and reinforced markc's feelings because of it, so how much did that save then?

I'm all in favour of talking to the marketing types, but guess who'l they'll ask? First off they'll do a customer survey, total waste of time anbd mopney but sounds scientific. Ferrari did this when I had one: long blimmin questionnaire asking me to rate the performance on a scale of 1-10 which i can't believe told them very much. Of course, I gave it a 6 to keepem on their toes...

 

[halcyon]

Re: Ooh. An audience with Sealine.

If you knew the hours I spent telling them that walnut helm and switch panels were cheap, and if Tom wanted to follow Princess and Failine and go wood instead of leading, then a totally new approach was required. They followed and we lost the order, and you have what you have.

But on the other hand, plastic seats apart, they are technically at the front, and were the first to build a standard spec boat in 83/4 with the first 30. Included shore supply, battery charger, all navigation equip supplied or wired in, fenders etc.


Brian

 

[Bejasus]

Re: Market research

Isn't that exactly what is going on here on this post. I am sure that more than 1 or 2 on here can afford to at least consider Sealines. Therefore surely this is contibuting to their 'market research'....... and haven't they gone strangely quiet.

"I am the master of my fate: I am the captain of my soul."..........I think????

 

[oldgit]

Re: But you said it ISN\'T fair enough

My recent visit to sbs with a friend who believes that the 45/6 ft sealine is the answer to all his dreams was totally impervious to my complaint that the boat does not posess clean lines overall and frankly looks crap in my humble opinion .
As this will be his very first boat durability and resale as yet mean squat.
Sealine I suspect realise my chum is their prime market and cater for him admirably.

Just hold tight dear it will not be so rough when we get round the corner,trust me.

 

[kimhollamby]

The opposite point of view

Surely the real point here is that if it doesn't agree you can walk on? Others may find the things you don't like perfectly acceptable.

I tend to view the ongoing march towards expensive internal finishes as being one of the factors that is forcing the new boat market further and further away from my own ability to buy into it. It also petrifies me to think that I might be looking at buying in an antique furniture restorer every time I so much as set foot on the more extreme examples.

It's great reading stories about boats with one standard price where you can order anything you like but there a lot of people out there who cannot afford the luxury of knowingly funding that margin to the builder. Or who are not prepared to do so, wanting to keep their capital investment within certain boundaries.

I don't odds the fact that there are boats out there rather better equipped than a five star plus hotel room; there is clearly market demand for that. But I also welcome it when other builders use what others might see as compromises in order to deliver a lower price break or perhaps, in some cases, increased durability.

It is somewhat sobering to me that I could still buy a boat I could be happy with (in terms of what it offered) on my budget a few years back. A walk around Southampton this year (as a prospective buyer) revealed just how far I have fallen off the pace in terms of my ability to buy into the cruiser market. That's not a reflection on my salary...it is a reflection of increased buyer expectations and the ways in which that is pushing price increases well beyond ROI as new models come on stream.

For that reason (and reaching for my tin hat) I welcome a market where different builders have different approaches. Long may some of them continue to use materials that are more cost-effective. If that means no leather and that also means I'm then not briefing my guests every five minutes on how not to damage the decor then I for one am more than happy to live with it.

kim_hollamby@ipcmedia.com

 

[kimhollamby]

Re: But you said it ISN\'T fair enough

But you are making sweeping points about durability and resale that are incredibly subjective. Your friend has a ready upgrade path through Sealines if goes that route and is likely to get a very good trade-in. That is similar to most if not all of the mainstream builders and I don't believe Sealine are off the pace in this respect. Neither do I think that their residuals on builds of recent years are any worse; in fact there is a ready market for many of the models. Look at the 350/360/F36/F37 series as an example.

It might not be your choice, different issue, but your suggestion that your friend is being naive seems a bit tough.

kim_hollamby@ipcmedia.com

 

[halcyon]

Re: Ooh. An audience with Sealine.

It is now market lead, was originally lead by a engineer with a love of boating, thus built as a practical boat, not a clone of every other boat in the market place.

Brian