Hydraulic steering

[Trevethan]

The current steering system on Gayle Louise is getting rather tired. The system comprises a chain off the wheel to a cog which drives a short shaft running transverse the beam, which in turn drives a very long shaft running from the pilot house, through the heads, through the aft cabin out through a hole at deck level into a worm drive gear box, which then pushes and pulls the rudder.

The system is 30 years old, but I hate it. There is lots of slack in it and the entire back end is exposed to the elements, dribbles rust on my deck, is a easy to trip over and allows water to drip into the aft bunk.

I have the chance to acquire for about £225 a hydraulic system - pump. hoses, ram, ball joint and assorted valves.

The kit is all made by Vetus. The hoses are a season old. Owner is selling cos he is fitting a cable driven system cos he missed the feed back in the hydraulics.

It came off a 45 footer displacing about 25 tonnes and will be fitted to a 40 footer displacing 17 tonnes. Same underwater profile, except his is a partially balanced rudder and mine isn't balanced at all.

Not sure of the model number, but Its a pretty substantial bit of kit. It looks like it is from Vetus' 230 to 1200 kg range.

Any advice on the pitfalls of hydraulics? what to check, how to fit, buyers for second hand worm drives... all gratefully received.

Am picking it up tonight.

 

[Chris_Robb]

I have hydraulc steering. I like it, and it is reconned to be the most reliable form of steering. However ....

No feed back - but your rudder is like a trim tab, you can walk away and the rudder cannot turn. I like my set up Vetus from about 25 years ago - still perfect.

Watch out if your going to fit self steering, as hydraulics creep and you cannot use any wind/water activated ones that act on the hydraulics. You would need to install somethingthat acted directly on the tiller head, and install a hydraulic bypass tab, so that the hydraulic steering is deactivated.

 

[RobertMartin]

I have hydraulic steering on my 38 foot yacht, love it, at first i did not because of no feed back, but you get used to that. Plus it is fantastic for autohelm and in rough weather, when you would be normally fighting the wheel.
Anyway, cars have hydraulic steering and no feedback, so whats the problem..

Bobby aka Seawolf..
Freedom is the song of your soul..

 

[Guest]

My 27 year old boat has the original Hynautics hydraulic steering in it, and the only drawback to it is that is air charged to maintain hydraulic pressure. Its easy enough to take care of though....about 5 strokes on a small hand pump. I believe the Vetus system does not require air charging and I have been considering replacing my current system with a Vetus system, mainly because of the age of the old system and the lack of replacement parts availability...... If I head for the islands and my steering dies.....I'm limited to my emergency tiller until I can have a Vetus shipped to me.

So, that leads me to this question: Those of you with hydraulic steering, how many of you have Vetus, and what is your general feeling about it?

Thanks - Rob

 

[andyball]

what cars have hydraulic steering,with no feed back?

I looked at lots of brands of (boat) hydraulic steering & asked as many owners as I could (usually systems for outboards).....with some of the makes- users complained of fluid leaks at either end,nothing terminal ,just a nuisance; tho' this could have been corrosion/salt deposit related with everything exposed, as it were.

 

[Chris_Robb]

See post below:

My Vetus kit is 27 years old. No leaks, no rust - rams look perfect. Top up once a year with about an egg cup full.

Some hydraulic systems use the wrong quality rams - they must be of very top quality - I think chromed bronze, so that they survive. Any pittingon the surface will lead to seal wear and leaks. Previous post pointed out leaks as main problem, and referred to outboards - probably cheap rams.

 

[ccscott49]

I have hydraulic, two station steering, my boat is now 37 yeaqrs old, only had one leak, which was from a bypass leak off hose, no other problems, I like it. The system you have however is a well known type, very reliable and some people swear by it, it was fitted to all the old lifeboats. If it could be repaired.overghauled, I would have been tempted to keep it, but as you've now bought the hydraulics, go for it!

 

[summerwind]

I also have Vetus hydraulic system and love it.

Can I suggest that you fit new hoses and, without any doubt at all, you should fit new olives on the hoses where they fit into the pump and ram.

When your'e putting the system together, cleanliness is absulutely vital. Do not make the curves in the pipework too sharp. Where pipework goes through bulkheads etc, use grommets around it to prevent wear on the pipe. Make sure the pipework is supported, not hanging in mid-air. Make sure you use the correect grade of oil.

When you have it all fitted into place, it is important to get ALL of the air out of the system. Buy a brake bleeding kit from Halfords which incorporates a non-return valve. Put the end of that in a jar of clean oil and keep pumping oil through until all bubbles disappear. (Be careful to keep the oil resevoir topped up or you will pump more oil into the system.) I find it is best to bleed one side of the ram, then the other.

Good luck.

 

[marcelo]

I bought an old sailboat with hydraulic steering (25 yo), and my hydraulic need a continues stroke to keep the way, I’m not sure if it depends on the fact that something is working wrong or is normal in these hydraulics, and other thing I don’t like it need to take three whole turns to go to the top in each way – is it the way on which hydraulics work? Or I need to repair or change?
Help.
marcelo

 

[Trevethan]

Thanks for all the advice. Going for it and will start shaping the ram mount.

I'd appreciate a few hints on what this should be made of, how large, etc.

Size I guess depends on the footprint of the ram.

I am thinking about using either pressure treated lumber or a big lump of dry oak. Any other suggestions?

Bolts will go through the ram, through the block, through the deck, through a plate to spread the load (Wood or steel? The latter I guess.. suggestions re: guage welcome)

Does this sound sensible?

On deck I am going to build a locker cum seat from marine ply to keep the ram dry and out of the way of the water, my feet etc.

Regards,

Nick

 

[Trevethan]

The gear box itself is fine. Its just the linkages to it have corroded and the chain drive is kind of slack.

I could replace easily it enough.

However if I keep it it means I have lumps of metal running across the aft deck that makes for a real trip hazard and looks awful.

It will also allow me to seal up the hole that the shaft runs through and eliminate a source of water and spiders. (They just stream though much to my wife's horror.) Again a small gland would solve this too, hydraulics seem a generally easier solution.

So if you know anyone looking for a worm drive... fairly cheap... let me know.

 

[Chris_Robb]

It sounds like your Hydraulic pump is very worn. I did not understand all your English, but if you mean that you are continually turning the wheel to maintain the position of the rudder, this means that the system is creeping, ie fluid is getting past the seals which are probably very worn.

It may be repairable, depending on make.

 

[marcelo]

Cris
sorry for my English Yes, I mean I need continually turning the wheel, I 'm thinking to bring it to some shop here to get an idea about the reparation cost.
thanks