Hunter Medina - Dropping the Mast.

[ash2020]

Hi all.

I'm picking up a Hunter Medina 20' tomorrow. I know nothing much about the boat yet. I'm getting a lift out onto the trailer but then I will have to drop the mast, me and my partner. We're both pretty ancient and not very strong!
I always used to use an A frame on my 23' Jaguar but I won't have one. I have 2 scaffold boards about 5' long and 2 bits of 3x2 6' long, that's it. Plenty of ratchet straps and ropes and there's a winch at the front of the trailer, of course. At a pinch, I could go and buy some longer timber.
The seller said it is a fairly lightweight mast. Should I make up a gin pole or A frame? How much do I need to loosen the shrouds? Any suggestions?
Thanks.

 

[ProDave]

The easiest way would be to ask the previous owner / seller. It is described as a trailer sailor, so you would think the mast must be easy to raise and lower.

Are you a member of the Hunter Asscocoation?

 

[greeny]

Can you contact the seller and ask if he can be there to help?

 

[ash2020]

The easiest way would be to ask the previous owner / seller. It is described as a trailer sailor, so you would think the mast must be easy to raise and lower.

Are you a member of the Hunter Asscocoation?

I'm not yet but that's a very good idea. There may be some info on their website. Thanks.

 

[ash2020]

Can you contact the seller and ask if he can be there to help?

Unfortunately he can't be there tomorrow morning. Has to be at work. I had a convo with him and he's generally done it with a couple of friends. Not 2 feeble oldies!

 

[wombat88]

Sorry to not be any help but remembering my Jaguar 21 the mast was a lot heavier than it looked. Second time round there were four of us.

 

[wallacebob]

I dropped my H Horizon 23 mast with gin pole, using main sheet. Surprisingly easy, but had helpers to guide mast down; no wind essential. A crutch is needed to lower onto at rear of cockpit.

 

[greeny]

Can the crane that lifts you, help take the mast down or is it a travel lift?
If not I'd definitely consider making up an A frame. I do my sun 2000 with an A frame and still have to be very careful that the mast doesn't get blown off centre and break the mast foot. SWMBO's job is to use the main halyard to keep the mast central but stay away from under the mast as much as possible just in case. I tried it with a gin pole but it was a bit too wobbly for me and made the A frame instead. If possible turn the trailer to be inline with the wind to prevent the side forces. You may also need another A frame or similar to drop the mast into, a few metres from the back of the trailer.
I used 4x2 for the main A frame and 3x2 for the one at the back. Galvanised female eyebolts with 10mm screwed rod through the top apex of the main A frame. 6mm bolt through the rear one. Mainsheet as the lowering device with the spinnaker halyard as a second safety line attached to the trailer winch. Overkill but at least I was sure. It takes a bit of time to measure and construct though so allow yourself a few hours extra.

 

[ash2020]

Sorry to not be any help but remembering my Jaguar 21 the mast was a lot heavier than it looked. Second time round there were four of us.

Thanks. This mast looks a lot lighter than my Jag 23 one, but it might be deceptive.

 

[ash2020]

I dropped my H Horizon 23 mast with gin pole, using main sheet. Surprisingly easy, but had helpers to guide mast down; no wind essential. A crutch is needed to lower onto at rear of cockpit.

Thank you. There is a crutch, it's just the side to side thing I'm a bit worried about. I think the shrouds will loosen as soon as it goes back.

 

[ash2020]

Can the crane that lifts you, help take the mast down or is it a travel lift?
If not I'd definitely consider making up an A frame. I do my sun 2000 with an A frame and still have to be very careful that the mast doesn't get blown off centre and break the mast foot. SWMBO's job is to use the main halyard to keep the mast central but stay away from under the mast as much as possible just in case. I tried it with a gin pole but it was a bit too wobbly for me and made the A frame instead. If possible turn the trailer to be inline with the wind to prevent the side forces. You may also need another A frame or similar to drop the mast into, a few metres from the back of the trailer.
I used 4x2 for the main A frame and 3x2 for the one at the back. Galvanised female eyebolts with 10mm screwed rod through the top apex of the main A frame. 6mm bolt through the rear one. Mainsheet as the lowering device with the spinnaker halyard as a second safety line attached to the trailer winch. Overkill but at least I was sure. It takes a bit of time to measure and construct though so allow yourself a few hours extra.

It's a travel hoist. I'm sure they would do it at the yard, but charge handsomely for it. I think I'll make up an A frame, as you say. That's the way I always did it with my Jag23. I had 4" aluminium poles back then but I don't still have them. It looks quite like the base of the mast is almost in line with the shroud fixings so I might get lucky with the sideways movement. Looks windy tomorrow so if it's iffy I will call it off and wait until I'm better prepared. Thanks for your input.

 

[William_H]

The poles you use as a gin pole arrangement should be about 8ft long. Typically the distance from mast base to forestay attach. If you buy wood then you may be able to attach with wire or rope to the chain plates. Likewise attach the top end to the forestay. I use a bit of 3/16 SS rod clamped to the forestay just above the swage which has a loop bent in to it to take a shackle. This enables me to attach the tackle and tension down the forestay to make it easy to disconnect and later reconnect the forestay. I use old wind surfer mast material made up for use as spinnaker poles. They clip in to purpose build loops on side decks.
You would be foolish to try to lower the mast without a gin pole or A frame to raise the forestay to tackle point to give geometry to the pull. I guess you understand that form previous boat. However I always rely on armstrong method of keeping the mast centred when in transit from up to down. (fractional rig 21fter) A person on the cabin roof can keep the mast central. If you do it on the trailer it is a lot more stable than on water. (however I find it scary prancing around on cabin top on boat on trailer. It is a long way down to hard ground so I usually raise and lower mast on water.
I think you will find after setting up correctly with right gear raising and lowering mast will become a doddle. You move the mast forward after disconnecting from mast base. Make sure you can get the axle (pin) out. A bit of work to get mast base back in with stays attached when raising. I just make a cradle of old rope under the bow rail to take the base of the mast for on road towing. Mast top then hangs out over the stern iof the boat but not buy too much. good luck ol'will

 

[ash2020]

The poles you use as a gin pole arrangement should be about 8ft long. Typically the distance from mast base to forestay attach. If you buy wood then you may be able to attach with wire or rope to the chain plates. Likewise attach the top end to the forestay. I use a bit of 3/16 SS rod clamped to the forestay just above the swage which has a loop bent in to it to take a shackle. This enables me to attach the tackle and tension down the forestay to make it easy to disconnect and later reconnect the forestay. I use old wind surfer mast material made up for use as spinnaker poles. They clip in to purpose build loops on side decks.
You would be foolish to try to lower the mast without a gin pole or A frame to raise the forestay to tackle point to give geometry to the pull. I guess you understand that form previous boat. However I always rely on armstrong method of keeping the mast centred when in transit from up to down. (fractional rig 21fter) A person on the cabin roof can keep the mast central. If you do it on the trailer it is a lot more stable than on water. (however I find it scary prancing around on cabin top on boat on trailer. It is a long way down to hard ground so I usually raise and lower mast on water.
I think you will find after setting up correctly with right gear raising and lowering mast will become a doddle. You move the mast forward after disconnecting from mast base. Make sure you can get the axle (pin) out. A bit of work to get mast base back in with stays attached when raising. I just make a cradle of old rope under the bow rail to take the base of the mast for on road towing. Mast top then hangs out over the stern iof the boat but not buy too much. good luck ol'will

Hi, thanks for that. I've got quite a bit of experience on both the Jag 23 and and a 26' American Hunter, which had a purpose made gin pole arrangement. That was a doddle, could rig and launch in less than an hour. This is just a worry because I don't know the boat, the angles, the winch etc. I'm sure it'll be fine.

 

[Refueler]

I used to do my Snap 23 .. myself and 10yr old son .. without any additions ... the main point being to have one person stand on coachroof and stop the mast swinging side to side .. NOT to move about if boat still in water !!

A single Gin Pole sticking out fwd from mast - I advise against .. as the mast lowers - that pole CAN and often does fall to side trying to find shortest line length.

 

[ProDave]

Does it have a furling Jib? If so that is usually a minimum of 3 people needed, 2 to lower the mast and a third to handle the furler as the mast comes down.

I would say don't do it with just 2 that do not know the setup.

Depending how the shrouds are arranged some may need loosening or even disconnecting before you start lowering the mast. Surely the seller can advise?

Is it on a trailer? We used to lower the mast on a previous 18ft boat on it's trailer by using the trailer winch to lower the mast gently while the second person guided the mast as it came down.

 

[DanTribe]

Bit of thread drift here.
My brother had a Sonata and thought he would save some money by taking the mast down himself. The yard craned the boat out and put it on his trailer.
With 5 hefty young lads we managed to lower the mast but it was touch and go and nearly a disaster.
When he got the bill, it included "cranage, mast removal and placing on trailer"
When he complained the yard manager apologised, took the bill back and crossed out mast removal, then handed it back.

 

[MisterBaxter]

Bit of thread drift here.
My brother had a Sonata and thought he would save some money by taking the mast down himself. The yard craned the boat out and put it on his trailer.
With 5 hefty young lads we managed to lower the mast but it was touch and go and nearly a disaster.
When he got the bill, it included "cranage, mast removal and placing on trailer"
When he complained the yard manager apologised, took the bill back and crossed out mast removal, then handed it back.

I used to raise and lower my Sonata mast by myself, using the spinnaker pole as a gin pole, with a fairly elaborate arrangement of ropes to keep everything moving in one plane. It took a bit of time to set up but was smooth enough in operation.
The important detail was to unhook the shrouds and attach them to a bridle tied between stanchion bases, so that the attachment point was at the same height as the mast step. That kept the mast supported through most of its range of movement.

 

[ProDave]

We regularly lower the masts on many boats up to about 30ft. Generally 5 people, 3 on the rope lowering it, from the top of the harbour wall, 2 guiding the mast down and catching it in a yoke, and 1 handling the furler.

Mast cranage is charged at the same rate as lift out cranage so big saving if we all club together and drop all the masts on one day.

 

[Refueler]

Lowering mast of a 25ft motor sailer ... that mast is heavy and has furling gear as well ....

The 'pole' at the stem - actually bent later !!

It is why that same boat now has a dedicated A frame .....

My main concern is not actually weight of mast - but the form of the mast foot .... if its the Tabernacle with high sides ... not a good photo - but if you look carefully - you can just make out mast pivot bolt about 12" above deck ...

then lowering / raising is more safe .. mast tends to stay more central - it can still sway yo side - but less so.
My previous boat to this Snapdragon 23 was Alacrity 19 ... my wife (small) and myself would raise and lower without any poles / extras etc. But it had that tabernacle affair as well ...

Again not so good a photo - but you can just make it out :

But if you have this 'blade / slot design - then extreme care needed to not let mast sway to side as the mast foot can break as happened to me (it was frozen solid and lowering mast snapped it when it would not pivot) ...

 

[greeny]

"A" frame every time and more than two able people if possible. We can all find ways of making it happen when under time and manpower constraints but to be safe and sure then crane comes first (not available) followed by A frame and suitable pulley and block equipment, along with a few able bodied people. New to you boat. I'd not want to start the ownership with an accident or damage. IMHO.