How to open a Walther 32A shorepower plug?

[PaulRainbow]

Thanks for taking the time to add to the useful content of the thread, Paul.

I’ve read the “how to” link again and it still reads like an advertising campaign to me.

Also clicked on the google link for additional background info.

Serious question, if the Marinco plug and socket carries such high risk, why is it almost universally used within the AWB sector? Any pressure to improve it from interested parties?

How about the concept of needing shorepower lead tested annually, as mentioned in the first article? Any views on this?

No idea how these plugs are still considered acceptable for new build boats.

The annual inspection that's mentioned is a quote from a US insurance company, I don't see how it would be feasible to implement and police that. Who would carry out the checks ? Who would want to carry out the checks and potentially be open to claims of compensation if there was a fire onboard ?

 

[Skylark]

No idea how these plugs are still considered acceptable for new build boats.

The annual inspection that's mentioned is a quote from a US insurance company, I don't see how it would be feasible to implement and police that. Who would carry out the checks ? Who would want to carry out the checks and potentially be open to claims of compensation if there was a fire onboard ?

I was thinking about something similar to PAT testing. Also, car MOT is valid for a year but only confirms that the car met the requirements on the day of test.

Until this thread, I was blissfully unaware of any issues surround shorepower plug and socket related fires.

 

[Alex_Blackwood]

No idea how these plugs are still considered acceptable for new build boats.

The annual inspection that's mentioned is a quote from a US insurance company, I don't see how it would be feasible to implement and police that. Who would carry out the checks ? Who would want to carry out the checks and potentially be open to claims of compensation if there was a fire onboard ?

I think you will find that under the code of practice. All shore supply leads should be (PAT) tested. When you have "The incident" your insurance company may ask for proof of testing. No?
The IET Shop - Code of Practice for In-service Inspection and Testing of Electrical Equipment, 5th Edition

 

[starfire]

I think you will find that under the code of practice. All shore supply leads should be (PAT) tested. When you have "The incident" your insurance company may ask for proof of testing. No?
The IET Shop - Code of Practice for In-service Inspection and Testing of Electrical Equipment, 5th Edition

I would hope its something a surveyor would ask about, but other than it being there & working I doubt it.

Pat testing should include inspection rather than just waving a meter over it.

I've lost count of the marinco connectors I have replaced, sometimes having remove both plug & socket because they are welded together, then cut back the boat wiring to remove the burnt bits.

Slightest bit of corrosion, loose terminals onto undersized conductors or not twisting to make connection & they are toast.

They have no place on a boat, but they get fitted because that's what everybody else fits.

I agree it's something the insurers should insist is checked, but I wouldn't like my public liability insurance to be claimed on too often by other insurers.

If I'm involved I do it right or not at all & sleep at night.

 

[PaulRainbow]

I think you will find that under the code of practice. All shore supply leads should be (PAT) tested. When you have "The incident" your insurance company may ask for proof of testing. No?
The IET Shop - Code of Practice for In-service Inspection and Testing of Electrical Equipment, 5th Edition

As far as i'm aware, boats are not subject to those regs. If they were, we wouldn't see boat owners making oddball cables up or fitting inverters with dangerous wiring etc.

As i said earlier, once a boat has been sold from new, there are pretty much no regulations governing electrical installations, or those that carry them out.

 

[Alex_Blackwood]

As far as i'm aware, boats are not subject to those regs. If they were, we wouldn't see boat owners making oddball cables up or fitting inverters with dangerous wiring etc.

As i said earlier, once a boat has been sold from new, there are pretty much no regulations governing electrical installations, or those that carry them out.

Paul, Quite agree, the boat may not be subject to these regs. but the cable which runs between the boat and the marina shore power outlet is a different kettle of fish! It is not only the insurance company who may be interested in what standard the cable is. In the case on an accident HSE could also be involved. Without going into all the gory detail, which would take up all week! It is not difficult to "PAT" test your own cable and ensure it is safe and fit for purpose! I think that from my own experience a lot of owners are, understandably, in complete ignorance of regulations covering "Extension" leads, which is what a shore supply lead is. I Don't know how marinas regard the situation. In our club we try, without being too heavy handed, to ensure compliance.

 

[Skylark]

…. It is not difficult to "PAT" test your own cable and ensure it is safe and fit for purpose!

How, Alex?

 

[Alex_Blackwood]

How, Alex?

Visual inspection of the lead for damage and abrasions etc., open up plugs and sockets, inspect and check connections, Use a multimeter, if you have nothing else, to check continuity, polarity and note the resistance of the line, neutral and earth wires of the lead. There are limits for earth resistance but you probably won't measure that with a multimeter. Common sense really if the lead is in good condition and you can show that you have maintained it and taken due care I don't think any one will hang you! There are also PAT testing companies around that will do it for a couple of £'s I would obviously recommend that route. However as the regs. stand any competent person can PAT test.

 

[PaulRainbow]

Paul, Quite agree, the boat may not be subject to these regs. but the cable which runs between the boat and the marina shore power outlet is a different kettle of fish! It is not only the insurance company who may be interested in what standard the cable is. In the case on an accident HSE could also be involved. Without going into all the gory detail, which would take up all week! It is not difficult to "PAT" test your own cable and ensure it is safe and fit for purpose! I think that from my own experience a lot of owners are, understandably, in complete ignorance of regulations covering "Extension" leads, which is what a shore supply lead is. I Don't know how marinas regard the situation. In our club we try, without being too heavy handed, to ensure compliance.

The 8th Edition Regs cover the shore power installation, which has to be tested/inspected annually, but they do not apply to the boat, or the shore power cable. I've been supplied with cables from various marinas, such as visitor cables or metered cables and i've never seen a PAT test sticker on one of them.

That doesn't mean we shouldn't look after our shore power cables, but in my experience the only time many owners take a look at them is when they stop working. It isn't hard to physically look at the cable and make sure the cable is sound, has no breaks in the insulation, both connectors are secure and not straining the wiring and that the pins are clean and there has been no arching, etc.

But, if we're going to insist an annual PAT testing, as a requirement, should we have to PAT test everything onboard ? Should we make it a legal requirement that only qualified personnel can work on any of the AC systems (same as in domestic or commercial premises) ? Owner installed inverters and generators should be stopped ?

Thin end of the wedge for a BSS type scheme ?

 

[Alex_Blackwood]

The 8th Edition Regs cover the shore power installation, which has to be tested/inspected annually, but they do not apply to the boat, or the shore power cable. I've been supplied with cables from various marinas, such as visitor cables or metered cables and i've never seen a PAT test sticker on one of them.

That doesn't mean we shouldn't look after our shore power cables, but in my experience the only time many owners take a look at them is when they stop working. It isn't hard to physically look at the cable and make sure the cable is sound, has no breaks in the insulation, both connectors are secure and not straining the wiring and that the pins are clean and there has been no arching, etc.

But, if we're going to insist an annual PAT testing, as a requirement, should we have to PAT test everything onboard ? Should we make it a legal requirement that only qualified personnel can work on any of the AC systems (same as in domestic or commercial premises) ? Owner installed inverters and generators should be stopped ?

Thin end of the wedge for a BSS type scheme ?

Paul, I basically agree with everything you have said. The shore power cable is a bit of a hazy area. I don't want to get into all the nitty gritty about the 18th edition. It covers in detail shore power leads for caravans! It covers extension cables in construction sites etc. etc. but it is very non committal on shore power leads in marinas. There is enough about extension leads for the not so smart lawyer to be able to say "Why didn't you comply with X, Y or Z". A bit like the Bible, you can find the answer that suits, if you look deep enough
The thing with PAT testing is, there is no requirement to do it anywhere! The requirement is to maintain the equipment in a safe condition. Marinas should be doing this with their leads. Most places find PAT testing an easy way to comply. I did say that the OP could "PAT" test this own lead, in inverted commas. I also explained how. Which is basically your second paragraph.
I don't think it should be compulsory for owners. However as you say it makes sense to look after and maintain your equipment. Like you I have seen some atrocious examples around.
It is a minefield Paul. Possibly best in this case to let sleeping dogs lie!
What's next on the agenda?

 

[ean_p]

Paul, Quite agree, the boat may not be subject to these regs. but the cable which runs between the boat and the marina shore power outlet is a different kettle of fish! It is not only the insurance company who may be interested in what standard the cable is. In the case on an accident HSE could also be involved. Without going into all the gory detail, which would take up all week! It is not difficult to "PAT" test your own cable and ensure it is safe and fit for purpose! I think that from my own experience a lot of owners are, understandably, in complete ignorance of regulations covering "Extension" leads, which is what a shore supply lead is. I Don't know how marinas regard the situation. In our club we try, without being too heavy handed, to ensure compliance.

I not sure that Pat testing and the HSE are applicable to private individuals acting in a private capacity are they? may be wrong but thought they were for commercial / industrial issues. An insurance company cribbing your extension lead would be like an insurance company cribbing your anchor, not quiet sure just where all that goes...!

 

[penberth3]

I not sure that Pat testing and the HSE are applicable to private individuals acting in a private capacity are they? may be wrong but thought they were for commercial / industrial issues. An insurance company cribbing your extension lead would be like an insurance company cribbing your anchor, not quiet sure just where all that goes...!

As mentioned above, a few shades of grey here. Marina's shore supply and box is definitely commercial. But the connection cable? Even on the private side there is still the civil "duty of care".

 

[Daverw]

Just to add comment, PAT testing has no legal requirement, see HSE statement below, this is taken directly from HSE FAQs, they are guidelines that most employers carry out to help with compliance with maintaining good working order

I've been told that, by law, I must have my portable electrical appliances tested every year. Is this correct?
The Electricity at Work Regulations 1989 require that any electrical equipment that has the potential to cause injury is maintained in a safe condition. However, the Regulations do not specify what needs to be done, by whom or how frequently (ie they don't make inspection or testing of electrical appliances a legal requirement, nor do they make it a legal requirement to undertake this annually).

 

[starfire]

Just to add comment, PAT testing has no legal requirement, see HSE statement below, this is taken directly from HSE FAQs, they are guidelines that most employers carry out to help with compliance with maintaining good working order

I've been told that, by law, I must have my portable electrical appliances tested every year. Is this correct?
The Electricity at Work Regulations 1989 require that any electrical equipment that has the potential to cause injury is maintained in a safe condition. However, the Regulations do not specify what needs to be done, by whom or how frequently (ie they don't make inspection or testing of electrical appliances a legal requirement, nor do they make it a legal requirement to undertake this annually).

True.

PAT Testing is one way to demonstrate compliance with EWR & health & safety.