How to choose a boat , what to look for

[Portofino]

For years I have been saying start at the hull .I know they skirt them off at U.K. shows and try to sell them on fridge cap , prawn griddles or cup holders .
Theres been a few threads on folks wanting a more comfy ride .

If you re paste it into your search engine you can see the comments .
Hope it helps some ?

 

[Portofino]

@Chris H …..recently wondering why I can’t steer at speed and for evasive action need to slow it down to sub 25 knots ish .
Go to 10.48

The 23 * deadrise means when running fast it’s arrow straight , developing a set .Rudder s just knock a few knots off because turning adds drag , they can’t overcome the V hull set , they slightly bend the arrow .Put a long curve in .


I won’t be the only one there are lot of Ray hunt , Soni , Levi , Dick Bertram , Don Aronow, Amarti type muscle about .
Theres no re invention of the wheel just keeping to the formula.

 

[Mr Googler]

@Chris H …..recently wondering why I can’t steer at speed and for evasive action need to slow it down to sub 25 knots ish .
Go to 10.48

The 23 * deadrise means when running fast it’s arrow straight , developing a set .Rudder s just knock a few knots off because turning adds drag , they can’t overcome the V hull set , they slightly bend the arrow .Put a long curve in .


I won’t be the only one there are lot of Ray hunt , Soni , Levi , Dick Bertram , Don Aronow, Amarti type muscle about .
Theres no re invention of the wheel just keeping to the formula.

Same on mine…..takes an age to turn with loads of lean. I was turning at 33 knots though ?

 

[Seastoke]

QUOTE="Mr Googler, post: 8013071, member: 30656"]
Same on mine…..takes an age to turn with loads of lean. I was turning at 33 knots though ?
[/QUOTE]
Put 4 ply tyres on the trailer.

 

[Portofino]

Same on mine…..takes an age to turn with loads of lean. I was turning at 33 knots though ?

Mine hardly heels ( like a aero plane ) @33 knots it will be a waste if time even to even touch the wheel .I have to drop it down into the water and slow by throttling back first then touch the wheel .You get used to it .No biggie

Yours is outdrive so not the best comparison , but is was developed for wave bashing , to carry the speed in a sea , Not just work in pan cake flat boat show conditions.A higher dead-rise V of the hull will develop a set at speed .Glad you noticed this .

 

[paradave]

A hull that can’t be steered at 30knts sounds like a poor design.

 

[Elessar]

For years I have been saying start at the hull .I know they skirt them off at U.K. shows and try to sell them on fridge cap , prawn griddles or cup holders .
Theres been a few threads on folks wanting a more comfy ride .

If you re paste it into your search engine you can see the comments .
Hope it helps some ?

Took my school pal while taught me to sail on Maia for a few days.

He said the most important thing in a sailing boat is the way it sails. The creature comforts inside are a distraction and often make the boat worse.

He’s as comprehensively wrong as you are.

 

[Portofino]

Took my school pal while taught me to sail on Maia for a few days.

He said the most important thing in a sailing boat is the way it sails. The creature comforts inside are a distraction and often make the boat worse.

He’s as comprehensively wrong as you are.

You are shooting the messenger .Did you manage to see the comments I suggested before firing from the hip ?
Repeat you have to re enter it on Google/ u tube .

And all the other great hull designers, a few mentioned in post #2 , are thus wrong .

Which one ( or more ) of the 7 do you disagree with and why ?

 

[Elessar]

I disagree with the whole premise.

Experiential design is the only way.

You don’t start with the hull/engine/interior or in any other thing.

You start with the required outcome. Which for you is something about the way the hill performs that frankly I don’t give that much of a damn about as long I have enough space to keep my friends happy with the boat stopped.

 

[Portofino]

@Elessar .
Your view is of variance to rest ( thus far ) of the mo Bo community.
It not either or btw .You can get creature comfort’s and a good hull ,

 

[Elessar]

A representative sample ?

 

[MapisM]

Which one ( or more ) of the 7 do you disagree with and why ?

The very first, to start with. Americans are obsessed with bow flare, for reasons that I never really understood but I think have much more to see with aesthetic/tradition than anything else.
In real world, just look at how many really fast boats (as opposed to "muscle boats", as you called them, whose performance is just a tiny bit above my sedate flybridge) are built with a bow flare, and you will find none.
And I mean it: zero, zilch, nada.
But don't tell that to Carolina flare fans, they will find all sort of excuses to stick to their guns.

 

[petem]

@Portofino as per Elessar, the whole premise of your arguments is flawed. Hull design is just one of a number of factors that go into boat design. If you only ever use your boat in benign conditions (which most of us do) then a BBQ (for instance) is more important than having a hull that can handle rough conditions.

In fact, the Spanish weather for the past six weeks has been particular calm. I don't think myself or my partners have lost a single day of boating due to the sea conditions and capability of our boat.

 

[Chris H]

That’s just a salesman selling his boats, at no point does he explain you have to slow down to turn a boat…….think you’ll need a bigger spade !

 

[petem]

Anyhow, if I wanted a boat with a more capable hull I'd buy a Midnight Express.

 

[MapisM]

Anyhow, if I wanted a boat with a more capable hull I'd buy a Midnight Express.

Which in fact doesn't belong to the wishy-washy "muscle boat" category, and is firmly into the true fast boats league (albeit just, 'cause there are also MUCH faster boats, actually).
And unsurprisingly, she has no bow flare at all - Q.E.D.

As an aside, I had the privilege of running side by side with one of their US Customs 39 footers with quad Merc outboards, in San Diego bay.
I was on a custom built Fountain 27 powered by a Raylar HO600, and her mad owner managed to take them over at 80+ mph.
BUT, we were hanging on for dear life while doing that, while the customs crew looked like they could have sipped a tea even at WOT.
Bigger size matters of course, but I was impressed anyway.

 

[Portofino]

The very first, to start with. Americans are obsessed with bow flare, for reasons that I never really understood but I think have much more to see with aesthetic/tradition than anything else.
In real world, just look at how many really fast boats (as opposed to "muscle boats", as you called them, whose performance is just a tiny bit above my sedate flybridge) are built with a bow flare, and you will find none.
And I mean it: zero, zilch, nada.
But don't tell that to Carolina flare fans, they will find all sort of excuses to stick to their guns.

He explains it clearly “ buoyancy “ not stuffing it in a following sea .
Remember the “ bears porrage “ .
Thats not a Carolina flair .It’s flared but not that much .

 

[Portofino]

That’s just a salesman selling his boats, at no point does he explain you have to slow down to turn a boat…….think you’ll need a bigger spade !

Sure but at 10 48 he settles for 20* degree deadrise and explains the more deeper you go the more set , arrow straight they become .” Goldilocks porridge “

I like it as easy to drive , no fussy steering , no S shaped snake trail behind .
Passing wakes no need to re adjust the helm carries on the same course it did before it enter s .
If it s busy ahead , no issues just drop back …..to a safer speed considerate to others around .

NOT blat past close at 40 knots in the dark !

 

[Portofino]

@Portofino as per Elessar, the whole premise of your arguments is flawed. Hull design is just one of a number of factors that go into boat design. If you only ever use your boat in benign conditions (which most of us do) then a BBQ (for instance) is more important than having a hull that can handle rough conditions.

In fact, the Spanish weather for the past six weeks has been particular calm. I don't think myself or my partners have lost a single day of boating due to the sea conditions and capability of our boat.

We have had good weather too except on 2 days the run 30 miles from Portofino to Portovenere a pre booked over night hard to come by .
We over took a lot of other stuff all sizes cruising through at 28 knots .
Wasn’t forecast …..Twas a big fetch reflecting off the Cinque Terre huge cliff .

Second humping 70 miles across the bay of Genoa 8 am depart in a F5 , 2-1/2 hr later dead pan calm off Loano like the conditions you describe .
But you have to go through the middle bit .
Time restraint re getting guest to an air port and all that that entails .You can’t just sit it out .
The F5 started on the port bow 1/4 , then went beam then veered to following port stern 1/4 .
We never slowed down of changed course .

Wind finder , passage weather + others all used btw .Pretty useless on the day imho .Ok but not that brilliant to rely on .

 

[Portofino]

Which in fact doesn't belong to the wishy-washy "muscle boat" category, and is firmly into the true fast boats league (albeit just, 'cause there are also MUCH faster boats, actually).
And unsurprisingly, she has no bow flare at all - Q.E.D.

As an aside, I had the privilege of running side by side with one of their US Customs 39 footers with quad Merc outboards, in San Diego bay.
I was on a custom built Fountain 27 powered by a Raylar HO600, and her mad owner managed to take them over at 80+ mph.
BUT, we were hanging on for dear life while doing that, while the customs crew looked like they could have sipped a tea even at WOT.
Bigger size matters of course, but I was impressed anyway.

Any fool and there a lot out there on u tube can run a fast boat fast on pancake flat seas .That’s a given , but Elassars point about creature comforts ….Hmm .

My argument is you can have both , not sure why folks get so polarised and entrenched on this ride comfort sea keeping thingy every time I bring it up . Then like PeteM dismiss it because it’s pancake flat at the mo .

Threads about the 7 ingredients to a good riding hull .Spot on the GW guy .


Did you all pick up on the subtle point about seaplane aircraft pontoons lading on water .
” The Americans discovered in WW 2 …..” That’s Lindsay Lords work .
No guess work , no trail + error ….pure science .

Baffled my the reluctance of mo Bo folks to get under the skin of hull design or think it’s either or not both .