How long before we are in the firing line?

ari said:
Do you think our survival rests on a minuscule (compared to world population) amount leisure boats that are used for a handful of hours a year no longer being used? I'm more inclined to think it won't make one jot of difference, but I'm no expert :)
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Well, I suppose the point is that it does make "a jot of difference". No individual action will solve the problem, but everyone doing everything just might. An example of, I'm afraid, what my American friend calls, "the British can't do attitude".

It's more that ALL internal combustion engines will be replaced by more environmentally friendly alternatives. The fossil fuel supply chain will gradually disappear.
 
ari said:
Do you honestly believe that will happen? Go and stand on a bridge over the M25 and try and imagine the infrastructure (creation and supply of electricity, creation of the components required to make batteries ) required to keep all of those cars running daily. Then try and scale that up to every car in the country!
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Well, of course, the full switch over won't happen in 2030 - we'll probably have significant numbers of fossil fuel cars until, say, 2050. Given a 40 year lead in time, yes, I think it's possible.
 
Dino said:
Having worked in the EV world for a few years up until 2 years ago, I have a fairly good insight into the industry. As Portofino mentions, the mining of battery materials like lithium is an issue. They have no hope of delivering enough battery raw materials to even meet half of the 2030 targets. There simply isn’t enough supply globally. There is also huge growth in solar and this needs battery storage and a high percentage of the battery manufacturing is going towards solar rather than EV’s.
The whole green agenda is important but sometimes I think it has been created in order to create jobs and line pockets.
Funnily enough, I now work in the solar area.
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It looks as though the lithium side of things is going to provide wealth and jobs in Cornwall. There are two companies exploring lithium extraction and they reckon that there is the potential to extract 21 000t per annum. I don't know if that is in total or per company. One company is going to mine rock and extract the lithium, the other is using geothermal liquid extraction.
Exciting stuff going on but even so, they reckon that this tonnage is only half the projected UK demand.
 
A footnote: last year my nephew was working for the boathire people at Mylor and a guy was there on the slipway trialing a new electric conversion kit for outboards. The engine unit was designed such that you unbolt the petrol engine from the casing and bolt the electric one on in its place. The battery unit was the size of a 25l fuel tank and would give 4 hours solid running. He was talking proper powerful engines not the diddy ones you see currently. Clever idea as it would just be a bolt on to current motors and four hours continuous running would cover most day boating and some short distance cruising if you go to marinas.
No idea if he has taken it further.
 
Very interesting thread especially when compared with one I started not that long ago. 2035 ban on petrol/diesel cars and the implications to boating?

I think we have some breathing space but imagine if you could replace with a cheap electric alternative? It might feel like a long way off but the EV revolution seems to be progressing rapidly. Hydrogen has also got to be something to consider one day.
Just trying to be positive!
 
Why are we assuming that ICE engines will not meet the zero emissions targets? There will be fuels that our current ICE engines will be using that will generate zero dirty emissions, with some minor mods to the fuel system, and possibly injectors.
 
dpb said:
"From 2050 the use of internal combustion engines for boats in UK waters will be banned ."

Are you stating this as fact?
Presumably you have other sources to back this statement up as there is nothing to that effect in the document that you have linked to.

Mind you I will, or may be, over 90 by then so probably not too concerned!
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It cant be a fact if for no other reason 2050 is 30 years in the future.
However it is an aspiration. It is achievable although fast boats would use some fuel other than diesel or petrol.
Sounds like we are about the same age . If I should be alive and boating then it will be on rivers and canals . A slow electric boat could do very nicely .
 
MartynG said:
It cant be a fact if for no other reason 2050 is 30 years in the future.
However it is an aspiration. It is achievable although fast boats would use some fuel other than diesel or petrol.
Sounds like we are about the same age . If I should be alive and boating then it will be on rivers and canals . A slow electric boat could do very nicely .
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Bring back the canal horses!
 
rafiki_ said:
Synthetic and bio fuels most likely. Brazilian cars ran for years on ethanol before discovering oil fields off their north east coast.
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I used to know peole who ran 4x4's on recycled oil from catering industry. They smelled like a chip shop. It was no good in winter .
 
MartynG said:
Some people consider the use of a horse cruel to the animal.
Is it cruel for a horse to pull a canal boat? – Animal-human relationship
,
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Well, the article actually suggests that it is not cruel, but that some passers by think it is. To avoid disturbing neighbours or sleeping occupants, I once pulled a large narrow boat out from the mooring and a short distance down the canal, it's really not that hard as, once it gets going, there is little resistance. It would be easy for a big cart horse.

Horses are used in racing and riding. Horses used to be used for all sorts of deliveries.

In my family town, cart horses tow the drays to deliver the beer and they appear very well cared for and happy. They get a month off in the summer each year and roll in the fields nearby.

I suspect that a well loved, cared for and fed cart horse that is only asked to do a reasonable distance with adequate breaks & days off is as happy as any animal. The bargeman will always walk with the horse to check it's ok.

It's like a retriever retrieving or a gun dog pointing perhaps. Our border collie just loved rounding up anything.
 
PowerYachtBlog said:
Car electrification dead line of 2030 is nuts, ......snipped

Electrification is not the future, and it will actually create a big electrical crises like no other, as it will surge electrical demand and production by minimum 300%, some numbers also say by about 1000%.
snipped
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Have you done any research on this? Can you reference the sources?
What factual evidence do you have? Can you reference them?
Have you factored in that this political measure only refers to the sale of NEW ICE vehicles and the bulk of the existing vehicles are likely to be around for 10 years or more? So the ramping up of EV ownership will be not a cliff edge issue.
Have you factored in the potential for V2G (vehicle to grid) and the demand management that offers?
 
Lots of questions because I mainly know sails.

Can chip-shop cooking oil have the pong filtered out of it, or does the process cost more effort than it's worth?

Is pure vegetable oil too viscous to work in a diesel engine in very cold weather? Does it flow if the fuel-line and tank are pre-warmed?

More significantly, do vegetable-based oils create less noxious exhaust than mineral oils? If it's no better than diesel smoke, how would vegetable oil offer an alternative that is any more acceptable than current vehicle fuels?

I can imagine yachts with diesel engines continuing to be allowed to be built and sold, despite their 'frivolous' pleasure-boat basis flying in the face of what the legislation ceasing new petrol and diesel-engined private cars, will be trying to do...

...maybe "yacht diesel" will be dyed green, cost twenty times what commercial fuels do, and every cent of the duty will go towards building solar farms. That way, nobody can object to spendthrift motor-boaters roaring about...they'll be global benefactors. :)
 
ari said:
Do you think our survival rests on a minuscule (compared to world population) amount leisure boats that are used for a handful of hours a year no longer being used? I'm more inclined to think it won't make one jot of difference, but I'm no expert :)
Click to expand...

You is right there young man
 
A company on the River Medway at Maidstone has been hiring out 100% electric boats for some time.
Had about six of varing sizes/ capacities . Not sure how successful they have been
 
While I prefer happy threads particularly at the moment and I think this one is rather depressing. I had this thought:

Up until now Future generations have had and I think have expected 'more' than the generations had before them.

Will we soon be approaching a time where this will be reversed............... Now I am the depressing one :)
 
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