How Do You Value a Classic Boat in need of moderate restoration?

Nautorius

Nautorius

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Hi All,

Despite my love of Shiny GRP things I have had several "do-er-up-ers' over the years but nothing I can consider a classic.

Since moving South I have been looking for a classic boat for the Thames i.e. more boat for the cash. However, like most people I have limited time.

I have now looked at several boats and now wonder “how do you” value a classic boat. Those with pedigree are easier such as Faireys, but what about one off professionally built boats?

The one I am looking at is a 1961, Aluminium Hull and Frame, Ply top sides, twin ford diesels. Still original except for engines (replaced 1984) but sat rotting under covers for last 10 years. It was a very expensive boat when Built £10,000. Not been in water for 10 years, some ply cabin sides are rotten, all needs wiring checked and engine which have 10hrs on them have not run for 10 Years. She is beautiful to look at and although the diesels are only 60hp she should do 12 Knots (hull built for 25 knts). She was fully restored in 1984, then tweaked in 1996, before being lifted out and left. Centre cockpit boat designed as a luxury yacht tender!

So how do I put a price on her….

Cheers

Paul
/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 
Re: How Do You Vlue a Classic Boat in need of moderate restoration?

Work out a cost for repair of the cabin sides, and allow for the time to do it. Also allow for any other damage caused by the rotten sides, such as fittings, bulkheads etc.

Allow for the cost of new engines. If they have run for 10 years, assume they are knackered (even if they aren't)

Add the cost of any improvements you would to carry out, then total it, and ask yourself whether or not you can afford to do it.

Offer them £1000 basically!

Your effectively buying a hull, thats all! If the engines work, and if theres any fittings to keep, consider them a bonus.

Saying that though, the owner probably still thinks its worth 10 grand. Its your job to make them relise its worth virtually nothing as it is, so that you can snap it for next to nothing.

My own boat was for sale for 20k originally. After uncovering what needed doing, I got it for 11k in the end. Quite a saving!
 
Re: How Do You Vlue a Classic Boat in need of moderate restoration?

Just a suggestion, but how about taking the price the vendor is asking, subtracting what you think it will cost to put everything right, and then meeting somewhere in between?
 
Re: How Do You Vlue a Classic Boat in need of moderate restoration?

Cheers,

He wants 10k! I would put her restored at £8-12K. My Thoughts were that she is only worth buying if I can get the engines running and reliable. In the long term I would re-engine her to larger diesels but I can not afford that. I have £8.5k Max to spend on this. Do you value work at the cost of a professional? I thought £1500 for engines and gearboxes to get working. £1500 for Cabin Sides (Framing Aluminium and fine) £1500 for strip back to Aluminium/wood and full epoxy and repaint. £1500 for new Electrical wiring (she is aluminium so those have to be right or she would dissapear) £1000 Contingency!

So I reckon she is worth £2k-£3k. But how do I convince an owner (who has inherited her) that she is only worth a 1/3rd of what he thinks?

Cheers

Paul /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 
I suspect, like most people, the current owner has limited time.....much like yourself.....

If you were planning to do the work yourself, then costing the materials, storage, tools, equipment and considering the hours of work and what you are prepared to work for, you can assess what you are prepared to pay.

If you price the repairs based on the likely labour cost by a yard you'll almost certainly come to the conclusion that you should be paid to take it off the current owners hands.

All the above can be ignored, if like a good woman she is easy on the eye you'll go into this knowing the cost is going to be high!
 
Re: How Do You Vlue a Classic Boat in need of moderate restoration?

[ QUOTE ]
Hi Smiffy,

see post above. Does that work out?

Cheers

Paul /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Well you seem to have a lot of £1500's.............see Burgundy Bens post.......it's about it really, if you are going to pay a yard???????............Do it yourself, over time, hence keeping costs down, you may be on to summat worth the bother. To be honest, and I know it aint my money, I would look elsewhere.
 
Yep,

Beutiful Lines, great design, great layout, still original.....but too many unknowns. I can do the DIY work involving Wood and/or fittings but engines have me stumped so need professional help. This is to be a 2/3 year project with professionals getting her on the water and me doing the nice (or painful) restoration work. I have two young sons who love doing jobs and building things (and love boats) so this project gets us out of the wifes hair and in the summer all on the boat. I am quite capable and dedicated at a project (House etc) but this is what I really want to do. I have a large Double Garage kitted out as a workshop at home so would do most of the work there (designing and forming) then take it to boat for tweaking and fitting)

Yep, I am only prepared to pay a third of what he wants, but how do I talk him into it...and yes I know this is a money pit but I lost £14k on my last boat over three years so chucking money away is nothing new for me! It is the pleasure and enjoyment/challenge that I want.

Thanks

Paul /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 
Re: How Do You Vlue a Classic Boat in need of moderate restoration?

True,

How do I get the engines checked out without spending a ton on a boat I do not Own! Is that fair or is it buy it and see? She is at a boatyard so the marine engineers on site may a help but they probably will tell me anything to get rid of her.

I would have the Aluminium Hull surveyed and then see if they confirm she is sound. Lots of £1500's as my spreadsheet rounds everything up to the next £500 as I am conservative on my expectations..

Cheers

Paul /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 
Re: How Do You Vlue a Classic Boat in need of moderate restoration?

What are the engines?
 
Re: How Do You Vlue a Classic Boat in need of moderate restoration?

Smiffy,

Engines 2x Lancing Ford York diesels 59 bhp each fitted 1985 with only 10 hours use, Borg Warner 71 velvet drive boxes and shaft drive. The Hull and engine room is dry but they have not been moved or used for 10 years. They do turn over by hand though? The Previous 10 years saw very little use about 1hour per year! /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Cheers

Paul /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 
Re: How Do You Vlue a Classic Boat in need of moderate restoration?

Then it isn't any big deal for the yard to give them a run, all they need to do is change the oil, supply fresh fuel (gallon can), then bleed through. Connect the cooling system to a hose pipe, maybe supply a bit of heat to the air intakes (gas blow lamp) and if they are any good they should fire up no trouble. On the other hand, you could do all the above yourself? I would do one at a time just for ease of doing the job. I wouldn't bother changing filters (fuel or oil) just for a short check over run. Have a look for oil or coolant leaks around the engines, check for decent oil pressure, have a good listen, do they sound healthy? are they belching smoke when warmed up, is it black, blue or whitish grey? If they are smoky, it may not be a big deal to put it right, but talk to the engineers, they will tell you.
 
Re: How Do You Vlue a Classic Boat in need of moderate restoration?

Ford Yorks never break down.

Thats cause they never started in the first place!

Get rid, replace them with some Ford 1.8 XLDs out of a escort, and get some Transit turbo diesels if you want that extra power.

You will have to do all in your power to convince him it is not worth 10k. These people are in cuckoo land and need educating that their old boats are worth diddly squat. If you dont buy it, he will find that out for himself, because it will remain on sale forever, just like it has for the last 10 years no doubt. Tell him to think of the storage fees he will save by selling cheap to you!
 
Dont do it

Paul I would say that your best option is to offer 1k and walk away I have seen boats before like this being sold for silly money

It is like a car with no mot valueless

offer 1 k and see next year when it has not been sold for 10k how it has degraded

There is always a better deal to be had

Btw yes the yorks are a cr@pp engine
 
Re: Dont do it

Exactly my thoughts.

Whe my current boat was for sale for 20k, I expressed interest, but didnt buy as I thought it was far to expensive.

A year later, she was still for sale, and I put in my price I was willing to pay, and got it for almost half price.

It would still be for sale deteriorating now if I was still up for stupid amounts of money.

So as above, offer 1k. If they do not take it, you can walk away safe in the knowledge that you are not paying over the odds for an old project that is being sold for stupid amounts of money.
 
Re: How Do You Vlue a Classic Boat in need of moderate restoration?

If the bloke selling the boat is telling the truth, and the engines have only done ten hours, then they should start just fine. If on the other hand they old and knackered, you may have problems?
 
Re: How Do You Vlue a Classic Boat in need of moderate restoration?

Thanks smiffy,

I will take your advice and try and get them going. Best to negotiate price first though. I have also emailed lacing who did the conversion for any other info.

I can not believe I am seriously thinking of this..... /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Cheers

Paul /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 
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