How big should a snuffer be?

SK700

SK700

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I went to buy a second hand snuffer from a sailmaker and as they could it not find it when I got there they offered me a new one at a good price.

Only problem is it seems too big and heavy. And the gap between the top of the sail and the halyard attachment is about a meter, this is on a 7m boat with 3/4 fractional rig so seams way too big.

They have already admited that it is not the one I ordered but insist it will be suitable and suggest trying in the spring.

Are there any guidelines for lenght and diameter or hoop size?

thanks
 
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How big should a snuffer be?

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Just big enough to fit in the skip!

Sorry, I hate the damn things. Not helpful I know.....
 
A 7m boat doesn't need one! Your kite's not much bigger than a high performance dinghy's spinnaker.

Just hide it behind the main for hoists and take downs.
 
The snuffer for my cruising chute (9.5m boat with masthead rig) is about 15" across the mouth and about 12" long (at a guess). The distance between the halyard attachment and the top of the chute is only 6" or so.

I know some people don't like them but I do /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
 
my snuffer has the head of the sail about 2 foot down from the block at the top of the mast, and its maybe a couple of feet short of the length of the chute so I have to stuff the last few handfuls in afterwards. this is on a 14m luff.

it came with the boat and I'm not yet convinced that I would go and buy one if I didnt have one. when it works it helps small crew handling of a cruising chute, but it has a life of its own and an ability to twist and tangle you wouldnt believe.

with a full crew I wouldnt think of using it.
 
Can't really help with size of snuffer, but I would have thought that if you are dealing with a reputable sailmaker, their advice would be worth following. Personally I have found snuffers invaluable. We have one on the cruising chute and on the spinnaker for our 10 metre Westerly. I must confess to having been terrified of the spinnaker and it just sat in its bag , sulking ( it came with the boat), until we bought the chute which came with a snuffer. It was so easy to use, especially as we usually sail with a crew of three, that I asked Jeckells to make me a snuffer for the spinnaker. We can now rig -- and most importantly -- drop the big sail without fear of a wrap or worse, and be in control for the whole operation. Essential kit for the shorthanded crew.
 
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Essential kit for the shorthanded crew.

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I fully agree. I wouldn't dream of using the chute without one; I usually sail single-handed - well, with the tillerpilot, really. He's in control while I play the strings.

When fully hoisted the snuffer is a good half metre above the head of the sail.
 
SL is 9 mtrs LOA, masthead rigged, small main and big genny. with a spi that doubles the sail area at a stroke. I decided a 11.5 m Luff and 65 sqmtrs in a turtle was too much for short handed work and bought a snuffer from Hyde sails. Best decision I made as it makes the beast easier to drop and gives time on the hoist. Now use the sail much more often which is, admittedly, not difficult as was too scary before. Never found the hoist too hard, but the drop.....

Initial contact with Hyde stated Luff 11.5 mtr, they recommended snuffer 11 mtr, The strop at the head is only about 50cm and the mouth is oval max 45cm but only about 8cm deep. Very efficient service.
 
I would say the mouth must slide up and down easily squeezing the chute/spinakker as it goes and the length should almost cover the bottom of the sail.

The top definitely needs to be closer to the haliard connection to allow the swivel to operate correctly.

Simple, safe and quick to use.

BOL
 
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Essential kit for the shorthanded crew.

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I fully agree. I wouldn't dream of using the chute without one;

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Absolute horse poo.

Very far from essential! I've cruised with one for years (my dad won't throw the damn thing away), so I do know how to use one, and it's such a pain. It never unsnuffs cleanly first time, creates another set of lines to tangle if it all goes wrong and (the greatest sin) leaves the head a metre or so from the mast where it can a serious wobble on in any breeze, making the boat harder to steer and a broach more likely.
"Ah, but I never use the kite in any breeze" they say. Even less reason to have the snuffer! The one thing they're supposed to do is make the kite easier to tame in wind!

I also race 2 handed quite often, and we fly big kites on a 37 foot cruiser racer without any snuffer or any drama. Often leaves us wondering why we have the 8 others the rest of the time!

There is nothing a snuffer could do to help after a chinese gybe, or a wrap round the forestay. In fact in both cases it'll make the situation worse, and if you have a situation like that you'll want the skills that proper kite flying gives you.

The key to kite flying is preparation and using the shadow behind the main and jib. Not a snuffer.
 
I can only respond by quoting you:

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Absolute horse poo.


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There is no way that I could fly - or douse - a chute when I am sailing alone, unless the chute is equipped with a well-made snuffer. (Mine is by Arun Sails).

Wobble ia largely avoided by proper control and adjustment of halliard, tack line and sheet.

The major factor that decides whether one has problems with deploying and/or dousing lies exclusively with how the whole shebang is assembled, best done at the start of the season - on land. Once that is properly done the chute will deploy cleanly, again and again. Many people expect that they can shove everything together any old how and are then surprised that it doesn't work.

I have never had a 'toffee' around the forestay although I have often 'admired' them on other boats, usually fully crewed by experts. Who knows? Perhaps I don't know enough about sailing to manage a snarl-up.
 
Why couldn't you hoist or douse a kite singlehanded without a snuffer?

Have you tried?

There is a singlehanded series round here that boats I race on sail in. No snuffers on their (rather large) kites but they don't seem to have any problems, not as if I'm talking about aspiring Alex Thompsons here either, there are several pensioners in that fleet.
And of course the biggest advantage of NOT having a snuffer is that you don't actually have to leave the cockpit to drop it! (assuming your halyards are lead back) Unlike the snuffer where the singlehander has to be on the foredeck with none of the lines that control the kite, or the helm, to hand. Then has to drop it and gather the snake in before coming back to the helm. Also on the hoist, the snuffer sailor has to unsnuff the kite and then tie up the snuffer lines before running back to the cockpit to control the sail. Wheras the non snuffer sailor can be in the cockpit with all the controls to hand.

With the greatest of respect, that you think the wobble that is caused by not having the head of the kite at the mast can be cured by anything other than fully hoisting the kite does suggest that your spinaker flying experience is limited to lighter winds. Nothing wrong with that, but you do really learn a lot by pushing the envelope a bit.
 
I'm sure we should all stop wimping out and follow the example of your athletic pensioners, throw away our cissy snuffers and start acting like REAL sailors. Perhaps get a bit more racing in. Everyone enjoys a really hard beat to windward don't they? In the end mate, each to his own. I have had more than my share of spinnaker battles and snuffers work for me and I suspect for a lot of other folk. You do it your way, I'll stick with mine.
 
In bought one from Crusader sails when I bought a Ginaker from them. Good quality and it didn't cost the earth. Good people to deal with, why not give them a call and get a quote from them over the phone or by e-mail; usually very quick at providing e-mail quotes and you can normally get a boat-show discount if you order in this period even if you don't actually order at the boat show.

No connection e.t.c. e.t.c.

Alan.
 
Used Peter Sanders at Sanders Sails in Lymington for years now...quality sails but excellent advise. He always suggest snuffers when short handed and also makes stowing the sail ready for next deployment easy and hassle free. The problem with all those racing lot puffing up their chests in previous mails to yours is that they have 6-8 crew on board and looking behind me most weekends from the TP52 I race on most can't deploy a spinnaker even if they tried... maybe they should use snuffers!!!! Hope this helps.
 
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Used Peter Sanders at Sanders Sails in Lymington for years now...quality sails but excellent advise. He always suggest snuffers when short handed and also makes stowing the sail ready for next deployment easy and hassle free. The problem with all those racing lot puffing up their chests in previous mails to yours is that they have 6-8 crew on board and looking behind me most weekends from the TP52 I race on most can't deploy a spinnaker even if they tried... maybe they should use snuffers!!!! Hope this helps.

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My dad's snuffer is from sanders. And I will say that if you really want one you probably couldn't do much better.

Good name dropping with the TP52, what do you do on board, third assistant rope tidier? Must be if you've got time to look around.

My point is very simply that every time snuffers are suggested, a lot of people will tell you that they are essential for a cruising boat. Which is absolute tosh. Some people may like them, fine, each to his own, but they are a long way from essential, especially as the original poster is talking about a 7m boat. That's smaller than a J80! And being a cruising boat it's not going to have a kite anywhere near that big. Would you really reccomend a snuffer for a kite that size? Seems like a totally unecessary level of complication to me.
 
Flaming me old mate.
As several posters have said, you do it your way and let others do it theirs. I participate in both the 2 handed and single handed stuff that you refer to and with 120 sq metre kites I use snuffers. Solo there is no other way I could fly them with confidence.

The main secret we have always found is in the preparation, packing it right and hoisting it right. Every cock up we have had has been caused by us not doing this.

You are quite right to say that when cruising they are less necessary. That is when you are not using the kites in margingal situations and a letter box always works a treat. However a shy kite, a building breeze and a lee shore.......yummy, give me a snuffer. If there is a problem you can always try a letter box it. With a heavy kite up with one reef, the best way to sail my boat in 20 plus winds, you obviously cannot letter box the kite, definitely want a snuffer.

Different strokes for different folks. Makes the world go round.
 
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