lezgar
New member
Yes after April 2004
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holding tanks in spainish waters
- Thread starter lee
- Start date
lezgar
New member
Yes after April 2004
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Gypsy
Member
I too suggest you fit a holding tank despite the lack of laws in some Med countries. When you are cruising much of Italy and Greece there are simply not many shore based toilets apart from tavernas and restaurants and sometimes they are not too inviting either so a private and clean place on board is not to be underestimated to make happy and healthy cruising.
Then think of your situation in one of those dreamy anchorages when you want to drop in to the water for a swim at any time. I personally don't like swimming in my own (or family's waste). Then there are the small ports. There is enough rubbish and sewage going into some of them that nobody would notice what you may produce but there are still many which are clean enough to swim in - don't let's reduce those few.
We have lived aboard for 2 full seasons in Italy, Greece and Turkey and have not found our holding tank to be a problem - sure one has to remember to empty it when 3 miles out but that is a small price to pay for the comfort of your own on-board convenience ANYWHERE and to be kind to the remaining beautiful bays and ports of the region.
Please tank up.
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Then think of your situation in one of those dreamy anchorages when you want to drop in to the water for a swim at any time. I personally don't like swimming in my own (or family's waste). Then there are the small ports. There is enough rubbish and sewage going into some of them that nobody would notice what you may produce but there are still many which are clean enough to swim in - don't let's reduce those few.
We have lived aboard for 2 full seasons in Italy, Greece and Turkey and have not found our holding tank to be a problem - sure one has to remember to empty it when 3 miles out but that is a small price to pay for the comfort of your own on-board convenience ANYWHERE and to be kind to the remaining beautiful bays and ports of the region.
Please tank up.
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A
Anonymous
Guest
Good point.
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charles_reed
Active member
To hold or not to hold
If anything witholding your waste products from entering the sea is slightly non-environmental - they provide excellent nutriment for animals lower down the food-chain.
However in 1972 most Mediterranean countries signed a protocol undertaking to reduce and then eliminate effluent discharge into the inland sea. This, far more significantly for the environment, has resulted in a considerable reduction in industrial waste being discharged into rivers running into the Mediterranean. Most damaging are various heavy metals (cadmium which is highly toxic to nearly all life has been utterly banned throughout Europe) and organo-halogens.
This protocol, as regards raw sewage from leisure boaters, has been notable more in its breach than its observance. Nowhere will you find, to my knowledge, tank pump-out facilities as are commonplace in UK inland waterways an in the US Intracoastal.
Certain authorities, notably the Greeks, have made random attempts to prevent the pollution of beaches and ports - the banning of sewage pump-out has more to do with preventing bathers from being infected than anything else. In the case of the Greeks it has, I suspect, more to do with an official stick with which to beat and fine visiting yachties than any regard for environmental matters - a JP friend of mine was banged up for a night, nearly causing an international incident, for spilling about a teaspoonful of diesel in a harbour in the Cyclades.
So if you're in the Med, the most you'll be expected to do is put your sewage, whilst inshore, into a buffer tank (not to be confused with a true holding tank) and then pump it all out when more than 3 miles from the coast.
As a visiting foriegn-flag boat you're unlikely to be affected at all by the recent spanish legislation, though I suspect this will all gather speed and, in due course, pump-out holding tanks will be mandatory for all in EU mediterranean waters as they are in the US Everglades and Intracoastal. From observation it will take a very long time for the facilities to be provided and one can expect it to be greeted with delight as another profit-taking opportunity (unlike the UK and US).
Hic transit faeces mundi
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If anything witholding your waste products from entering the sea is slightly non-environmental - they provide excellent nutriment for animals lower down the food-chain.
However in 1972 most Mediterranean countries signed a protocol undertaking to reduce and then eliminate effluent discharge into the inland sea. This, far more significantly for the environment, has resulted in a considerable reduction in industrial waste being discharged into rivers running into the Mediterranean. Most damaging are various heavy metals (cadmium which is highly toxic to nearly all life has been utterly banned throughout Europe) and organo-halogens.
This protocol, as regards raw sewage from leisure boaters, has been notable more in its breach than its observance. Nowhere will you find, to my knowledge, tank pump-out facilities as are commonplace in UK inland waterways an in the US Intracoastal.
Certain authorities, notably the Greeks, have made random attempts to prevent the pollution of beaches and ports - the banning of sewage pump-out has more to do with preventing bathers from being infected than anything else. In the case of the Greeks it has, I suspect, more to do with an official stick with which to beat and fine visiting yachties than any regard for environmental matters - a JP friend of mine was banged up for a night, nearly causing an international incident, for spilling about a teaspoonful of diesel in a harbour in the Cyclades.
So if you're in the Med, the most you'll be expected to do is put your sewage, whilst inshore, into a buffer tank (not to be confused with a true holding tank) and then pump it all out when more than 3 miles from the coast.
As a visiting foriegn-flag boat you're unlikely to be affected at all by the recent spanish legislation, though I suspect this will all gather speed and, in due course, pump-out holding tanks will be mandatory for all in EU mediterranean waters as they are in the US Everglades and Intracoastal. From observation it will take a very long time for the facilities to be provided and one can expect it to be greeted with delight as another profit-taking opportunity (unlike the UK and US).
Hic transit faeces mundi
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JPGruntfuttock
New member
Re: To hold or not to hold
I just know I am going to be in trouble here, but having observed, repeatedly, the same phenominum in different places, perhaps somone more familiar with these 'issues' can enlighten.
In semi enclosed harbours and well frequented sheltered bays of the Greek Ionian Islands, clear waters to the bottom, schools of fish actively lurk close to the boats and then home in on the discharged but fragmented solids. Attacking them voraciously, playing water polo with any less digestible fragments until, very quickly all is consumed. This is clearly visible, indeed just after the usual morning constitutionals, the surface can boil with them.
It has been suggested that in fact it is the paper that lies on the bottom and takes time to rot away, certainly "the sh1t eating fish of Fiskhardo" wouldn't leave time for anything else to reach the mud. Again observation reveals that the paper, processed via a Lavac, ejects as a small cloud in the water.
The fish appear healthy, indeed grow to a good size over the season, are in fact holding tanks counter productive, the wrong answer to a non problem?
Before I disappear under a deluge, I too have been in the outer marina at Syracuse in the summer, when the miasma is solid enough to moor to, but that is discharge from main sewers, so not pure and freshly produced. I am asking if it is not environmentally better to introduce these fish, or their habits, into the challenged environments, rather than use chemicals, materials and energy with all the consequent pollution, to make non degradable plastic tanks and deprive the fish of much good nutrients?
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I just know I am going to be in trouble here, but having observed, repeatedly, the same phenominum in different places, perhaps somone more familiar with these 'issues' can enlighten.
In semi enclosed harbours and well frequented sheltered bays of the Greek Ionian Islands, clear waters to the bottom, schools of fish actively lurk close to the boats and then home in on the discharged but fragmented solids. Attacking them voraciously, playing water polo with any less digestible fragments until, very quickly all is consumed. This is clearly visible, indeed just after the usual morning constitutionals, the surface can boil with them.
It has been suggested that in fact it is the paper that lies on the bottom and takes time to rot away, certainly "the sh1t eating fish of Fiskhardo" wouldn't leave time for anything else to reach the mud. Again observation reveals that the paper, processed via a Lavac, ejects as a small cloud in the water.
The fish appear healthy, indeed grow to a good size over the season, are in fact holding tanks counter productive, the wrong answer to a non problem?
Before I disappear under a deluge, I too have been in the outer marina at Syracuse in the summer, when the miasma is solid enough to moor to, but that is discharge from main sewers, so not pure and freshly produced. I am asking if it is not environmentally better to introduce these fish, or their habits, into the challenged environments, rather than use chemicals, materials and energy with all the consequent pollution, to make non degradable plastic tanks and deprive the fish of much good nutrients?
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Paulka
New member
Voracious fishes
Fully agree with you!
I made the same observation at several mooring sites here in Spain.
I don't have a holding tank, and don't plan to install one unless the menace for heavy fine gets real.
According to many spanish peoples, there is a good chance this particular law will not be enthousiastically enforced, as it becomes effective on April 1st.
Is this an omen?
The mood is here "wait and see"!
Paul
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Fully agree with you!
I made the same observation at several mooring sites here in Spain.
I don't have a holding tank, and don't plan to install one unless the menace for heavy fine gets real.
According to many spanish peoples, there is a good chance this particular law will not be enthousiastically enforced, as it becomes effective on April 1st.
Is this an omen?
The mood is here "wait and see"!
Paul
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