HMCG - casualty working

[Birdseye]

Here in the Bristol channel, normal coastguard service seems to be regularly interupted by casualty working, when apparently every man woman and the office cat are required elsewhere.

Now I'm sure that if I were a casualty, I would be grateful for any help they gave. But I find it difficult to believe that they dont even have someone who can press play on the pre-recorded weather forecast because everyone is on channel zero.

What do you think? Does anyone know the reason why? Is it like the police where everyone rushes off to an incident because its more interesting than routine activities (my daughters injury free RTA brought 4 police cars 3 paramedics and an ambulance, 13 people in total, and they were still arriving as she drove away) or are HMCG really on a very low manning level?

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[Jools_of_Top_Cat]

I agree, it also gets my goat that even when moved on to working channels ch16 must remain silent.

The coastguard provide a service, but they are not in charge of the radio, nor the users.

It is a small rant, but sometimes I feel like birdseye, does it take a whole area of coastgurads to organise a tow for a speedboat who does not understand what oars are for.

<hr width=100% size=1>Julian

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[jamesjermain]

Hey! Hang about a mo.

Silonce is maintained on Ch16 not because there is no one to work it but because it is needed for dealing with the emergency. The Coastgard and Lifeboat/helicopter might work on Ch0, but anyone else involved has to work on 16. You don't want endless radio checks, requests for weather etc when the 'copter is trying to run a hi-line or a yacht is standing by to pick up casualties.

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[mickshep]

Re: Hey! Hang about a mo.

Nice one JJ. There seems to have been a number of posts just lately slagging off the C.G. The vast majority of whome are highly trained, highly motivated auxiliaries, who are on call via a pager 24hrs a day. Like the R.N.L.I they will turn out in any weather at any time to help those in distress, This can be as simple as a search for a missing walker on the beach to hanging off a 100' cliff in a gale. Unlike the R.N.L.I, they get paid, But at the national minimum wage and only when actually on a "shout". There is no overtime or top up for working nights, So even the most cynical out there can't say it's done for the money. As for the Silonce on 16, The number of posts about the abuse of 16 which is as far as I know still designated "International Distress Channel". as apposed to, "Sunday morning gossip channel" or "I wonder if the radio I last used to leave the marina this morning is still working" Channel. But then I thought this was covered in the V.H.F course we have all taken to get our licence. My one and only emergency was the direct result of idiots on 16 who blanketed out C.G weather warnings of an imminent severe gale, Prior to this the forcast was SW 2 to 3. Mike

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[brianrunyard]

Re: Hey! Hang about a mo.

Well said JJ.
Brian

<hr width=100% size=1>Brian
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/brunyard

 

[Aja]

You may not hear the working on Channel 16 as it is out of your range - but there may still be safety working by the coastgaurd and others taking place.

Donald

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[Guest]

>they are not in charge of the radio<
Please note that communications with a shore station are controlled by that station - did they not teach you that on your VHF operators course?

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[Jools_of_Top_Cat]

Please don't missunderstand me. I did try to offer a situation where the silence is past requirement. I have heard many people fobbed off by CG because of casualty working, yet the casualty has now been handed over to the lifeboat. It is all to common for a lifeboat to be launched to tow home a breakdown in favourable weather, no helicopters, ambulances or any other services. Once the lifeboat is alongside and 'assisting' it is then their baby.

But alas the coastguard regularly appears to shut everyone up as they 'are casualty working'. How do I know this, I was on the Lifeboat for 7 years. More if you count me going down to the shed on a shout and cleaning while the boat was out, then cleaning the boat and tidying away the gear, I did this from about 8 years old......what did you do?

disclaimer ** I think on the whole the CG do a good and proffessional job, I do have a VHF and ships licence so don't try to get high and mighty on me. Would you like me to send you a photocopy to prove it to you!!!

The shore station may control a conversation from a boat, but does that really mean the shore station in this case the CG, is in charge of the VHF. Many people have been moaning about radio check weekends and suggesting the coast guard should ask for ships to give their call signs etc. This is not the juristriction of the coast guard ---- did they not teach you this on YOUR VHF operators course.

<hr width=100% size=1>Julian

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[HMCG]

I cannot account for individual incidents. However in the operations room the channel 16 operator may be listening to up to 14 remote aerials at once. This means that a ship station on one aerial will not hear the activity on an aerial at the other end of the officers guard. If a distress situation is being worked on channel 16 that operator will be working that site but is still listening to the others for new distress traffic. Therefor you may be silenced to allow that operator to do their work. Another problem may be that if your traffic is routine there may be no-one else in the operations room to deal with your call on a working frequency. During an incident there is far more happening than what you can hear on the radio.

Example. -
Vessel reports that he is sinking 4 persons on board, one person in the water.

Positions have to be ploted and updated. Possibly a search plan created for the lifeboat/helicopter to locate the person in the water....1 operator.

Mayday broadcast created and checked before transmission....1 operator.

Lifeboat is tasked to attend....1 operator will be working lifeboat.
Helicopter is tasked in case there is a requirement to recover people from the water and take to hospital.....operated by same operator.

Coastguard Rescue team are observing from Shore and arranging onshore reception for casualties...same operator again + all of watch (except 16 operator) to answer telephone calls from the team who have been paged.

Ambulance service has to be briefed and ambulance arranged....1 operator
Hospital has to be warned and kept up to date.....new or same operator.

Police have to be informed and kept up to date......1 operator.
Constant influx of press calls.....1 operator or same.

999 calls from members of the public seeing the yacht in difficulties....whole watch (except 16 operator)

Calls from family members who have received a mobile phone call from crew on yacht....up to whole team (except 16 operator)

Routine phone calls for weather information and advice (these have to be answered as they may be incident related calls but if routine will be asked to call later)...up to whole watch(except 16 operator).

it goes on and that is just one incident running. When multiple incidents are running we may never be off the phone or radio.
The normal compliment around the coast is between 4 and 6 operators depending on time of day and time of year. During an operaion we are all busy and routine calls will be put on hold until we are ready to deal with them. Remember our primary responsibility is Search and Rescue. This takes priority over everything else we do.

I hope this helps give you an idea of what happens during an incident.

regards.


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These are my own thoughts not the MCA's

 

[Birdseye]

Interesting response, and thanks for that. Gives a better idea of what goes on.

Presumably, someone will use their judgement and use channel 16 to give weather warnings during casualty working, rather than updating the press or police etc. After all, the weather conditions that might have given rise to one casualty could cause another.

And in honesty (you are anonymous on this forum!) is it really always like that with every officer fully involved in the emergency? Or could some be re-directed back to the routine, sometimes?



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[HMCG]

Yes in some cases they could be redirected into routine work but that is the exception rather than the rule in anything but the most basic incident. You must also remember that during the busy summer months each station will most likely have multiple incidents running at any one time causing even more problems. Believe me it is not an easy job to do and it is just getting busier each year.

regards,

HMCG

<hr width=100% size=1>These are my own thoughts not the MCA's

 

[ccscott49]

Couldn''t weather be transmitted at set times on set channels for different areas by recording? This would ease the load at least a little, also automate the radio check thingy as suggested, on the now defunct shore station channels, 25, 26 etc. The americans have dedicated weather channels, is that not possible here? I think you do a great job anyway, try getting the same service down here in the meddy, no way!!

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[Jools_of_Top_Cat]

Thank you, I do not attmept to create a storm, I was just supporting another posters view that as soon as a small incident arrives the coastguard appears to go all hands on deck regardless of the scope.

I appreciate what you say and appologise if I caused any offence. It is not something that affects me as I have not called for a radio check since I fitted the radio in winter 2002. Strangely enough it still works, and I am usually able to get weather by other means or I have heard your broadcast.

Well done also to Holyhead and Milford Haven Coast guards and all the rescue services involved this morning in Tremadog and Cardigan Bay....Extreemely professional, and all turned out ok.

<hr width=100% size=1>Julian

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[Jools_of_Top_Cat]

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/wales/3080951.stm>http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/wales/3080951.stm</A>

Was woken at about 6am when Pwllheli lifeboat launched, listened as events unfolded. I was extactic when the CG stood down rescue when people found.

It is fabulous when things turn out ok, well done to all involved.

<hr width=100% size=1>Julian

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[CAYBROOK]

Re: Hey! Hang about a mo.

Unlike the R.N.L.I, they get paid,

Mick,

Having just come across this forum, and reading through the various entries it would appear to me that there are a lot of contributors to this forum who seem to thrive on critisising the Coastguard.

How many have actually visited there local operations rooms and discussed there concerns with the staff there. For those that don't know there are 19 currently around the UK, and also somewhere in the region of 3,400 volunteer coastguards,and just to put the record straight the RNLI volunteer lifeboat crews do receive some recompense for there efforts. But as you say, it is not a money issue.

The Coastguard Service is there to help all persons in distress, regardless of who they are or what predicament they are in.

I am sure that any of the CG rescue co-ordination centres would be happy to host a visit and discuss your concerns after the summer season.

Hope you all have a safe time enjoying you hobby.





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