Help req'd to find a plug for this socket

Rogershaw said:
Until a live to metal case of an appliance happens and makes the appliance case live and you touch it.
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Not much chance of that these days with insulation standards. Going back to my youth, it was normal for TVs, radios, amplifiers etc to have live chassis as the supply wire was often cotton covered rubber twisted pair with no earth.
 
Graham376 said:
Not much chance of that these days with insulation standards. Going back to my youth, it was normal for TVs, radios, amplifiers etc to have live chassis as the supply wire was often cotton covered rubber twisted pair with no earth.
Click to expand...

Its not about live chassis but the metal case of any mains appliance like kettles, Toasters. but electric tools and other metal cased items.
 
I had a generator with the same socket: it’s the standard 16 amp schuko socket. A fair number of countries use it as their standard plug and socket setup for ring mains for larger demand electrical items: kettles, vacuum cleaners, hair dryers etc. Some countries have a variation with a pin connection for the earth but they’re all the same basic footprint.
Given that I’d encountered some polarity problems wandering round the Med, I have a plug in polarity tester on board, which I used to determine which pin on the generator was live and which neutral. I then marked the plug and socket so that I always put it into the generator the same way, thus preserving the polarity into the boat shore power socket when I was using the generato.
 
duncan99210 said:
I had a generator with the same socket: it’s the standard 16 amp schuko socket. A fair number of countries use it as their standard plug and socket setup for ring mains for larger demand electrical items: kettles, vacuum cleaners, hair dryers etc. Some countries have a variation with a pin connection for the earth but they’re all the same basic footprint.
Given that I’d encountered some polarity problems wandering round the Med, I have a plug in polarity tester on board, which I used to determine which pin on the generator was live and which neutral. I then marked the plug and socket so that I always put it into the generator the same way, thus preserving the polarity into the boat shore power socket when I was using the generato.
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This is almost certainly wrong and potentially lethally dangerous.

Most small portable generators should not be plugged into the incoming shore power socket. If the neutral and ground cannot be bonded together at the generator, it should not be connected to the shore power socket, end of.
 
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penberth3 said:
Standard blue generator socket is 16A, isn't it?
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Sorry, I meant that if you stuck a travel adapter in it then you'd have a UK socket that you wouldn't expect to be 16 amps.

It's a good point that they might be intending to run something high current from it, like mini ring main or something. I had rather naively assumed it would be the kind of stuff you'd run off a normal extension lead.
 
VicS said:
Beware if that is non polarized (i.e. reversible)Iif so it should not be used with appliances designed for UK use. They must have double pole switching or double pole circuit breakers not as is the usual UK standard of single pole switches and a fuse only on the line conductor. Or your "cheap" generator could prove very costly.
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Hi VicS
Many thanks for your insight. I'm not using this generator onboard, but in my workshop where no mains power is possible. May I ask how you would (in layman's terms) make the output from this device safe. I had thought of using a 'garage' consumer unit with 63 volt rcd. Is this enough?
CV
PS The 380 volt is a completely separate individual plug
 
PaulRainbow said:
This is almost certainly wrong and potentially lethally dangerous.

Most small portable generators should not be plugged into the incoming shore power socket. If the neutral and ground cannot be bonded together at the generator, it should not be connected to the shore power socket, end of.
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This I totally agree with and unless the output of the generator is centre tapped bonding neutral an ground at the generator should be done. If you plan to use a garage unit I would suggest that the neutral/earth link is essential so that the RCD will work correctly
 
PaulRainbow said:
This is almost certainly wrong and potentially lethally dangerous.

Most small portable generators should not be plugged into the incoming shore power socket. If the neutral and ground cannot be bonded together at the generator, it should not be connected to the shore power socket, end of.
Click to expand...

Here we go again, according to you, tens of thousands of CE marked generators are unsafe to use out of the box. Wonder how they passed the safety tests and are allowed to be sold.
 
Graham376 said:
Not much chance of that these days with insulation standards. Going back to my youth, it was normal for TVs, radios, amplifiers etc to have live chassis as the supply wire was often cotton covered rubber twisted pair with no earth.
Click to expand...
"Universal" radios, which could run on AC or DC mains, generally had a live chassis. I don't know why.
 
cygnusv said:
Hi VicS
Many thanks for your insight. I'm not using this generator onboard, but in my workshop where no mains power is possible. May I ask how you would (in layman's terms) make the output from this device safe. I had thought of using a 'garage' consumer unit with 63 volt rcd. Is this enough?
CV
PS The 380 volt is a completely separate individual plug
Click to expand...

What is a 63 volt rcd?
 
When I use my generator it is because there is no shore power available. I would NEVER connect one where the other is available.
With a centre tap Neutral generator the 'Earth' is the generator case or if like mine the case is plastic, a screw terminal on the case which is provided so you can run a wire to an earth spike hammered into the ground. On a boat you could connect an earth wire and throw the other end over the side but I don't, and I'm guessing, most never do, so when using a generator, the appliance Earth doesn't actually go anywhere.
 
LadyInBed said:
When I use my generator it is because there is no shore power available. I would NEVER connect one where the other is available.
With a centre tap Neutral generator the 'Earth' is the generator case or if like mine the case is plastic, a screw terminal on the case which is provided so you can run a wire to an earth spike hammered into the ground. On a boat you could connect an earth wire and throw the other end over the side but I don't, and I'm guessing, most never do, so when using a generator, the appliance Earth doesn't actually go anywhere.
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What is a centre tap Neutral generator. I know what a center tap earth supply is

Is the screw terminal on the case which is provided so you can run a wire to an earth spike hammered into the ground connected to the centre tap or to the neutral plug outlet.
 
Graham376 said:
Here we go again, according to you, tens of thousands of CE marked generators are unsafe to use out of the box. Wonder how they passed the safety tests and are allowed to be sold.
Click to expand...

Portable generators, that cannot have their neutral and Earth connections bonded are what they say on the tin, portable. There is nothing wrong with using them as portable units, but they should not be used as fixed installations. They should not be plugged into the boats AC shore power inlet.

All AC power sources, whether it be mains, generator or inverter, when connected to the vessels input socket, should have the neutral and ground bonded at source. Never mind "according to you", it's common sense, good practice and would be forbidden by current build regs.
 
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