jon and michie
Well-Known Member
we went on a friend's boat at the start of the season - we have a single without bow thruster - he has twin outdrives a bow thruster and the difference was night and day and without using the wheel.
Help please!?
- Thread starter MikeEly
- Start date
pmagowan
Well-Known Member
When you get a new boat there are always handling peculiarities to get used to. I am normally in flappy sail boats and normally the old, difficult to steer, long keel variety that tend to continue in a straight line irrespective of where you intend it to go. When we got a new boat with fin keel that should steer much easier our problem was that the additional maneuverability can lead to over corrections and she blows sideways much more readily. We had a couple of awkward moments in marinas. But, then you get used to it. You adapt and adjust. Practice makes perfect (or if not perfect at least better). Fenders are your friend.
Greg2
Well-Known Member
For years I followed the ‘leave the wheel centred‘ with outdrives advice…..then I figured that directional thrust might be quite helpful and it turned out that it was!
I don’t disagree that for someone completely new to such a set up there is merit in seeing what you can achieve with engines alone without the complication of thinking about where the drives are pointing when you apply power but sometimes needs must.
It is relevant to note that there can be a huge difference in handling characteristics on boats with what appears to be the same set up. Our Princes 32 (twin outdrives) and Fairline Targa 35 (twin outdrives and same hull as the OP’s boat) were a bit of a pig to handle at close quarters but our S34 and a mate’s Princes 285 were an absolute dream. In fact my mate privately thought I was just rubbish at boat handling on the Targa until he took the helm and tried to put it into a finger berth.
Another mate has twin outdrives with single props and he never uses the wheel but then he has the ‘paddlewheel‘ effect, which you don’t get with duoprops.
I don’t disagree that for someone completely new to such a set up there is merit in seeing what you can achieve with engines alone without the complication of thinking about where the drives are pointing when you apply power but sometimes needs must.
It is relevant to note that there can be a huge difference in handling characteristics on boats with what appears to be the same set up. Our Princes 32 (twin outdrives) and Fairline Targa 35 (twin outdrives and same hull as the OP’s boat) were a bit of a pig to handle at close quarters but our S34 and a mate’s Princes 285 were an absolute dream. In fact my mate privately thought I was just rubbish at boat handling on the Targa until he took the helm and tried to put it into a finger berth.
Another mate has twin outdrives with single props and he never uses the wheel but then he has the ‘paddlewheel‘ effect, which you don’t get with duoprops.
PlanB
Well-Known Member
An make sure your wife becomes as competent as you at boat handling, and you can handle the ropes. You never know when you may be suddenly incapacitated. And in adverse weather, if your wife can helm, you will have more strength to hold the boat on a line ashore.
Bouba
Well-Known Member
Yes…who ever your crew is you have be like a two man tag team.
Before entering port have a think about the conditions and discuss this with the crew…but whoever is at the helm has the final say…the wife understands this and I don’t get a telling off until the engine is turned off.
At all times stay in communication and nobody is allowed to jump off without the consent of the helmsman
petem
Well-Known Member
Outdrives are too far back and often too close together to allow effective positioning and rotation without the wheel.
The best instructors (e.g. Mendez Marine) teach beginners to use the wheel on an outdrive powered boat. And why wouldn't you want to point the drives in the direction that you want the stern of the boat to go? It's an absolute no-brainer.
Once you work out how to use the wheel to position the stern then it's simple to learn to use the bow-thruster to position the bow.
Bouba
Well-Known Member
I sense the OP getting more and more confused as everyone argues over the best way to handle a boat
Portofino
Well-Known Member
I will go potentially an antagonistic few step further .
To Pete only if you get it waaay out of shape in some last chance salon of recovering the situation = start using the wheel .
From personal experience my instructor back in 2005 ( sent by SSkr ) taught me never to use the wheel .
Further more with knife in hand “pressing it in and twisting “
…..One yr my bow thruster , you know those crappy VP BP s electric leaked its seals and bust it’s crappy designed gearbox very early on say May .Same guy told me “ it’s all in your head a matter of confidence you don’t really need it “
The issue of repair was on many levels - none availability of the part on one hand and having it lifted + yard to fix on the other .So we left it all the way until the following yrs annual 10 months without a thruster .
Guess what ? Er he was absolutely right .
Sure a bit freeky entering a windy marina ( esp a new one unkown ) and only having sticks …..but they work on duo propped outdrives *
I don,t think you ever loose that sticks only skill or the ability to hover a helicopter , pull loooong wheelies on a motorbike , do a 360 spin on a snow board and land it and carry on as if nothing happened… etc etc - once you (more like your brain ) gets it !
Worth the effort very early to get that skill .Twin sticks , twin duo prop .
* BTW is do not buy into the outdrive “ close together arguments ” on certain set ups .Think about it VP engines are all the same width and have more / less the same gap between them .The legs stick out inline with the crank .
If there are any difference in leg apart geo it’s mm .So tiny to be insignificant.
You can easily with a twin set up and the regulation VP distance apart torque / turn a hull with one Fwd and t, other in rev .
How do you think IPS works ? They don‘t instal the pods the max distance apart in the hulls do they .
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Jon4468
Active Member
How about if you actually leave the pontoon with ropes untied and everything?
ST840
Well-Known Member
....
penfold
Well-Known Member
If it's waaay out of shape stop, pull away from the dock and start again. Like landing a plane, when an approach turns bad don't keep going out of pride or stubbornness.
benjenbav
Well-Known Member
As someone said - waaay 
- the best thing would be to hire an instructor for a day’s own-boat training. Getting the feel for what THIS boat does and what it can do would have the OP docking like Captain Ron.
…maybe not quite.
- the best thing would be to hire an instructor for a day’s own-boat training. Getting the feel for what THIS boat does and what it can do would have the OP docking like Captain Ron.…maybe not quite.
W&J Boat Challenge 2023
New Member
38ft X 8ft Dutch Barge Mooring Challenge!
Hello everyone!
My pattern partner and I are new to boating and have decided to enter the fun and challenging lifestyle just before winter! Wooo!....Brrrrrr......
We have chosen a 38ft X 8ft Dutch Barge named Waterlelie (Water lily by translation of course!)
We are aware that our home county being Oxfordshire, would restrict us to the Thames (not canals of course)
We are hoping that we can reach out to the community for some advice on mooring but also to ask if anyone knows of any available moorings - Private/Residential, short term, but ideal mid-term and ultimately long term, but as you all know; Waiting lists are long
Our ideal area would be somewhere between Wallingford and Farringdon.
Any help or advice will be very appreciated!
Will and Jen
Hello everyone!
My pattern partner and I are new to boating and have decided to enter the fun and challenging lifestyle just before winter! Wooo!....Brrrrrr......
We have chosen a 38ft X 8ft Dutch Barge named Waterlelie (Water lily by translation of course!)
We are aware that our home county being Oxfordshire, would restrict us to the Thames (not canals of course)
We are hoping that we can reach out to the community for some advice on mooring but also to ask if anyone knows of any available moorings - Private/Residential, short term, but ideal mid-term and ultimately long term, but as you all know; Waiting lists are long
Our ideal area would be somewhere between Wallingford and Farringdon.
Any help or advice will be very appreciated!
Will and Jen
colhel
Well-Known Member
Welcome to forum!38ft X 8ft Dutch Barge Mooring Challenge!
Hello everyone!
My pattern partner and I are new to boating and have decided to enter the fun and challenging lifestyle just before winter! Wooo!....Brrrrrr......
We have chosen a 38ft X 8ft Dutch Barge named Waterlelie (Water lily by translation of course!)
We are aware that our home county being Oxfordshire, would restrict us to the Thames (not canals of course)
We are hoping that we can reach out to the community for some advice on mooring but also to ask if anyone knows of any available moorings - Private/Residential, short term, but ideal mid-term and ultimately long term, but as you all know; Waiting lists are long
Our ideal area would be somewhere between Wallingford and Farringdon.
Any help or advice will be very appreciated!
Will and Jen
You're post won't be seen by the people that can offer the best advice. I suggest starting a new thread on the Thames sub forum (link below)
Good luck!
The Thames Forum
PCUK
Well-Known Member
Try not to depend on the bow thruster. It is after all only a crutch!
bluetooth
Well-Known Member
MmmI will go potentially an antagonistic few step further .
To Pete only if you get it waaay out of shape in some last chance salon of recovering the situation = start using the wheel .
From personal experience my instructor back in 2005 ( sent by SSkr ) taught me never to use the wheel .
Further more with knife in hand “pressing it in and twisting “
Same guy told me “ it’s all in your head a matter of confidence you don’t really need it “
The issue of repair was on many levels - none availability of the part on one hand and having it lifted + yard to fix on the other .So we left it all the way until the following yrs annual 10 months without a thruster .
Guess what ? Er he was absolutely right .
Sure a bit freeky entering a windy marina ( esp a new one unkown ) and only having sticks …..but they work on duo propped outdrives *
I don,t think you ever loose that sticks only skill or the ability to hover a helicopter , pull loooong wheelies on a motorbike , do a 360 spin on a snow board and land it and carry on as if nothing happened… etc etc - once you (more like your brain ) gets it !
Worth the effort very early to get that skill .Twin sticks , twin duo prop .
* BTW is do not buy into the outdrive “ close together arguments ” on certain set ups .Think about it VP engines are all the same width and have more / less the same gap between them .The legs stick out inline with the crank .
If there are any difference in leg apart geo it’s mm .So tiny to be insignificant.
You can easily with a twin set up and the regulation VP distance apart torque / turn a hull with one Fwd and t, other in rev .
How do you think IPS works ? They don‘t instal the pods the max distance apart in the hulls do they .
My old Fairline Targa 34 was rubbish at turning on the sticks. T40 is very easy. The legs are wider apart. Point - you are making generalisations. Some boats will behave differently.
John100156
Well-Known Member
Agree, when I had my T34 it was definitely wheel and then power, once you get use to it, you can slot it in anywhere, even in strong wind/tide. If you have bought a boat with a bow thruster then use it! It makes it even easier (I just don't get this don't use your BT nonsense).
When I did my Day Skipper many, many years ago in Gibraltar in February, the boat did not have a BT working, so its good practice not to use it from time-to-time IMHO.
My current and last boat have/had shafts so with props further apart centre the wheel and just using the throttles works best. I also make sure the trim tabs are fully up and just do things nice and slow, unless its particularly windy, then sometimes you just need to get the back in the hole a little faster....!
When I did my Day Skipper many, many years ago in Gibraltar in February, the boat did not have a BT working, so its good practice not to use it from time-to-time IMHO.
My current and last boat have/had shafts so with props further apart centre the wheel and just using the throttles works best. I also make sure the trim tabs are fully up and just do things nice and slow, unless its particularly windy, then sometimes you just need to get the back in the hole a little faster....!
Pump-Out
Well-Known Member
Not in your chosen area, but try Thames & Kennet Marina.
Once afloat you can then seek a berth nearer to where you want to be.
BB1
Well-Known Member
Outdrives or shafts, are the hand controls nice and smooth?
