Has DSC radio made EPIRB redundant?

[ShipsWoofy]

Re: Yes I agree, boat owners should have an epirb!

No, I am still learning. It is not about that.

You come on here after learning something new and basically give a lecture, presuming all on here do not know this stuff and you often; and read OFTEN, suggest no one but you takes any responsibility for their ships safety systems or equipment.

Rather than saying, I have made a point of checking my lifejackets are serviceable and fit the crew, you said (I am not going back to quote now, but something like) most people don't even know where their jackets are!

Well excuse me if I take umbrage to that as including myself in most people or even some people, you should try not to speak for others. Often your research throws up some interesting points, but then I have to stop reading as you Begin to presume about everyone else who you believe to be haphazard with safety. The difference is, many just do it without beating their chest about it.

Do you see what I am trying to say, I hate other people talking for me, especially politicians and some no name on television who states people thought this about some dull subject, well I didn't.

Feel completely free to talk about yourself or about things you have experienced, but each time you come on and presume something about another unknown to you skipper I will be here, being a git!

If you are unsure, words like people, you, other skippers should be triggers for you to stop writing. Be fair, you invent most of your presumptions, and I, being a sensitive soul, find them offencive, [irony]like most on here[/irony]

 

[ShipsWoofy]

Re: Yes I agree, boat owners should have an epirb!

I did not say hanging out, I said visible.

I can get at all my cables without pulling half the boat to bits. Many modern plastic boats which look beautiful, can require half the interior to be removed to get the ceiling down for example. So a simple broken wire in a hidden crevice can turn into a rebuild option.

Boats should be comfortable, but not at the expense of maintenance. Do you see the point I am trying to make. I look around many boats at the boat show and start trying to see how to get behind panels or follow the miles of cables, what I see bothers me. It may also explain quite a lot of the may day calls due to electrical problems that people can not jury repair as the systems have been hidden or have become far too complicated.

For example, some of the power panels on modern boats which look like computer panels, well, that is in my opinion asking for trouble, having electrical systems computer controlled is dangerous past all sense.

Which nicely brings us back to self contained epirbs I guess!

 

[GC1]

Re: Yes I agree, boat owners should have an epirb!

I really do think you have 'lost it' /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif Is the computer you are typing on there with all it's wires out, is your house the same with wires everywhere /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif Are your central heating pipes all above the floorboards, do you cringe when you get in a car and feel you have to cut up the dash to expose the wires in order to feel safe to drive it, do you refuse to go on an aircraft with miles of hidden wiring because you want to see it all hanging out for 'safety' reasons, do you wish when you walk up the street you could see all the fibre optics, sewage systems and water pipes at street level, do you wish you never had any skin so that the doctor could just fiddle with your bones and guts, do you think you have a problem?......I do /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

See you are at it again, trying to believe everyone is as paranoid as you, take a chill pill, relax, deep breaths and become friends with 'panels' and 'mouldings' they are not all bad you know and can add to safety /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif could you imagine a 3 yr old on a boat with wires all over the place /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif Get real, get some panels, go on, it may be hard, but you know you want some /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Beware of 'Your' presumptions, quite a few people on here, me included would have no interest in looking or having access to wires and cables (especially after my latest incident), because even if something did go wrong we are not qualified to interfere with them, nor would we know what to do, we would get a professional to do the job. Perhaps some are deliberatley put out of the way to stop 'fiddlers'. I hope you don't go 'fiddling' around your house with the new regulations relating to electrics now in place /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif, if that spreads to boats you will be very frustrated looking at all those lovely jucy coloured cables and not allowed to touch /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[tazzle]

Yes, it always gives me a feeling of great safety when moving about on the boat to have an EPIRB on the belt (along with 800N bolt croppers, selection of knives and fids, 2 x handhelds, first aid pouch, flare holster, SOLAS grab bag and emergency laptop with GPS). I can usually just about crawl out of the wheelhouse to give mooring instructions....

Uhm, /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif lads; this one's actually up for sale on eBay

 

[GC1]

/forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif No wonder the McMurdo is 'Revolutionary' then, question answered, thanks /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[Talbot]

That crew off the coast of cornwall, started outside VHF range and took to their dinghy after trying to raise the alarm on their VHF.

If you have an iroguois then I thought upside down was their normal mode of sailing /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

yeh yeh yeh I know It is one of the things on my list of "to buy"

 

[Talbot]

The engine start battery is on the keel, but the domestics are sited above them. Ths is actually lower than they were originally fitted. With the work I have done on the boat, hobby horseing has reduced.

 

[DAKA]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
then I think most installations will be struggling at 20 miles.

[/ QUOTE ]


The Coastguard antenna are very much higher than that so most people should be getting abt 50 miles.

Personally in the solent I hear Portland all the time, france as soon as I come out of the lee of the Isle of White, and frequently Brixham.[ QUOTE ]



I too hear Portland and France all the way across the Channel on a nice day.

BUT on a bad day when the boat is pitching range is reduced significantly.

I was crossing at the Dover end one year and I could not get a message to Dover from Cap Griz Nez less than 20 NM and Dover has a very high Ariela on the Cliffs.

We could hear each other trying to speak but were both breaking up.



I have DSC and I have a McMurdo Fast find plus (EPIRB + GPS) but be warned if you care to read the instructions they may not work in the water, you have to hold it on top of your chest.
Instructions also say may not work from a life raft, you have to hold it on the roof of the life raft, so all this survival gear is designed for swimming pool use or nice sunny day crossings.

I have DSC linked to gps
I have EPIRB integral gps
I have a life raft and flares

The best Mayday remains VHF and you hope a local pleasure boat will come to you.

How many times have you been out and bothered to decipher the DSC call on your set or do you just turn it off to stop the klaxon ???????

The only mayday I have answered was to rescue a Collie dog by the request from a distressed owner, VHF has a personal note, Human nature is to help.
DSC is a machine making a row and spoiling your cruising, you also have to come off the plane to try to work out if you are anywhere near , human nature is ' someone else will do it '.

 

[GC1]

I don't know if it is available, but if the DSC could mark say a red spot (scene of the incident) on the linked in plotter with immediate ETA to scene, that would be interesting and very useful and also with plain text detailing the emergency if possible.

 

[DAKA]

Red dot still has problems

Whats at the red dot ??
Illegal immigrants
Terrorists
Pirates
Traffickers

What will it cost to get there
Will I still make that cil
The tide may turn and it will get even rougher


VHF distress call has the personal cry for help, I put my life and vessel in danger for a dog, I would think about my family's safety before I went to a red dot.


Im going to sign off before I get called a right ********* but when you are out with your family in anything other than perfect conditions you have not got the resources to start playing with electronics.

 

[Medskipper]

Re: Yes I agree, and its going to be engines as well soon!

From what I have read, engines manufacturers are going to be building their engines with engine management systems so just like cars these days the average boater will not have a clue how to fix a problem at sea! My car broke down a few months back and having been messing around with engines all my life I lifted the bonnet to have a look and it was a struggle just trying to find the spark plugs!!
It was a waste of my time anyway because a computer chip has gone down and even the Merc garage engineers to three days to discover what the problem was! God help us all if we end up with boat engines that just cannot be even looked at and understood at sea! Bad news, don't engine manufacturers realise this?

Barry

 

[Gludy]

That facility exists.

In fact you can also find the position of any dsc set that is on and to which you know the number - it appears on your plotter.

 

[Gludy]

DAKA - you are not saying that an EPIRB is not a good safety device ... are you?

 

[Its_Only_Money]

Re: Yes I agree, and its going to be engines as well soon!

[ QUOTE ]
From what I have read, engines manufacturers are going to be building their engines with engine management systems so just like cars these days the average boater will not have a clue how to fix a problem at sea!

[/ QUOTE ]

They are already there..... fly-by-wire throttles, gearshifts and fully electronic injection systems. All 100% compatible with the marine environment of course..... /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

 

[DAKA]

Hi Paul,

I am not saying an EPIRB is not a very valuable piece of kit.

I have bought what I THOUGHT was the best available
out of my limited budget (something else had to be left off that year)
I bought the McMurdo Fast find +

But there has been at least one recall that MCmurders said would come back by return of post but in fact was a good size chunk of the boating season.

They have also sent two warnings

a) It may not work when in the water so when in the water keep it out of the water eg/ on your chest

b) It may not work from a life raft
when in a life raft hold it on the roof of the lift raft

You can see why I feel a bit hacked off with two very useful thoughts,

Has anyone been in a life Raft in poor conditions that would like to comment on the practicality of leaning out the life raft and holding on while you hold this thing on the roof.


Does anyone know if there is a link with Wessex and the Wessex fiberglass roof system that went bust a few years ago both from the same area I think and both having products that I have not got as much confidence in as I did from reading their adverts.

 

[GC1]

It did not come up on my old plotter but I do remember seeing something briefly before our incident on my new Garmin 3005C, are you saying that it will automaticaly place the bearing on the plotter? I haven't got the manual either as it is at the dealer from when they fitted it.

 

[NorthernWave]

I would refuse to take the boat to sea without the epirb, but wouldn't without a DSC VHF, (as long as I have some form of VHF). I certainly see peoples point if they are cruising within range and the epirb I guess is fairly expensive? But on another veiw about the range, I have DSC on my HF/MF SSB. But as is said above if the boat sinks the epirb will continue to transmit where the DSC's will not. Hopefully you have a hand held in your survival bag???

Chris

 

[Gludy]

I do not blame you at all for being pissed off with McMurdo.
But there are other makes that do work.

 

[Gludy]

Example of integrated plotter/dsc radio
If another boat, say a friend, has their radio powered on, you can ask the eystem where the boat is with that MMSI number and it will put it straight on the plotter for you - that is without even asking your friend!