GRP cold?

[dignity]

At the moment we live on a replica steel dutch barge, which is all warm and cosy in winter due to good insulation and solid fuel heating. However we find it very limiting where we can go. I really fancy a GRP trawler yacht, but the only experience I've had of GRP in winter is cold, damp and condensation, can anyone out there give their opinions, and their ways in which they keep warm!

 

[davidbains]

I wouldn't have thought GRP was any colder than steel, maybe warmer.
A foam sandwich GRP boat is insulated better. However, the same methods
used to insulate your steel yacht can be applied to GRP, and work in hot and
cold climes. I did meet a Crowther cat whose sandwich coach roof had been
lined with several inches of polystyrene foam and then wallpapered!
Where do you want to cruise? Hot or cold destinations?

 

[dignity]

East coast of the UK, so at the moment (Extremely cold), the main concern is on GRP is finding an effective form of heating other than hot air, eg. Eberspacher which OK will take chill off, but they never get the vessel really warm.

 

[timevans2000]

try a Dickinson Newport diesel heater. Bit like a Taylors but 5KW and Canadian. I paid £600 for it with all the bits you need to install. Ordered it direct from Dickinson off their website. I priced it up from the UK importer Kuranda marine, they wanted £1000 for same heater.

I am really pleased with mine. I have a badly insulated 37 Cat and the heater keeps it very warm. I also have 2 blown air heaters in the hulls. They are rubish by comparison. I dont use them now I have the Dickinsin heater.

Iam in the process of insulating my boat. I did the front cabin last winter and it has proved to be very successful. I used 2 layers of 6mm closed cell foam and then foamed backed vinyl to finish looks good and totally condensation free in the coldest/dampest weather

 

[Caronia]

Where are you getting the closed cell foam from? I have been searching in vain for a reasonably priced vendor.

 

[BarryH]

Try Southern Foam in Battersea. I'll dig out their number. I don't really use the closed cell stuff much, its too hard for the seating that I do.

 

[Abigail]

We're in teh midst of insulating our boat too (or at leaast removing acres of headlining and mouly foam from the last time it was done, about 20 years ago!)

Following advice here and elsewhere we're looking to use 9mm closed cell foam (probably from Keeling Rubber & plastics Ltd in Wolverhampton as they are charging £2.10 a square metre and we want 60m2).

When you did it, what did you use for glue onto the GRP, and how happy are you with that bit of it.

Also, our chain plates are very well supported with supports bulted to the bulwarks. There has obviously been movement in the past, and although we are rebedding them, I'm not convinced it'll be 100% water tight for ever. So we're going to run the insulation up to the support plates, and then velcros a layer over the top, so they don't attract condensation but can be inspected. How did you deal with any similar problem?

Thanks for any advice.

Sarah
s/v Roaring Girl


Sarah&Pip

 

[Caronia]

I have been investigating the use of closed cell foam for insulating GRP hull for some time now but have come across the "fire problem" apparently ordinary closed cell foam is a touch excitable if it meets an open flame. I cannot find fire retardent closed cell foam for less than £20 per square metre. Any ideas?

 

[Abigail]

Hi - I'm about to buy from Keeling Rubber & Plastics Ltd who are on 01902 404977, and based in Wolverhampton. They have quoted 60m2 of fire retardant (self-extinguishing) closed cell white foam 9mm thick at £166.85 inc VAT and carriage (2.10 a m2).

They assure me it is self extinguishing, tho I haven't actually set light to the sample! They do others as well, but they have recommended to me one referenced as K424.

Certainly I haven't found anywhere else to match that price. The nearest is a number of places that do closed cell foam for bedrolls, which is also fire retardant. This comes in 1.5m x .5m strips, usallu anywhere between £5 & £10 a strip. It's therefore quitre expensive for a lot but might be worth the simplicity for a small amount. It only seems to be in black or cam tho, which is a bit harder to work with because you can't see the lines you draw on it. Also this stuff from Keelings is a little bit more flexible, so you can really push it into the awkward corners.

I'm about to ask them about glue as I'm not sure what the best one is.

Hope this helps.

Sarah
s/v roaring girl



Sarah&Pip

 

[Caronia]

Gosh! that's a wonderful price. Please let me know the results of your interrogations into glue. I have been advised that PVA will suffice but for absolute security to use contact adhesive whilst ensuring good ventilation during fixing process and immediately afterwards.

Peter

 

[timevans2000]

I would not recomend using 9mm insulation. It is difficult to work with because it doesnt readily bend around obstacles. Also, 9mm wont provide enough insulation. Use 2 layers of 6mm and evo stick glue to bond.
Where I have had to maintain access to fittings we have used ply covered with the finished material (in our case vinyl) and used concealed screw fixings to attach it. We took the foam insulation completely over the fittings. If I ever have to access the fittings, repairing the foam is not such an issue as making the vinyl look good afterwards.
Hawke House marine supply some very good glue for bonding foam to foam. I think it was DG75. Dont use PVA. In my experience it does not work!
We have had access to Trade EVO (the stuff the carpet shops use) and this seems to glue everything successfully as long as your hull is completely clean. There should be no trace of old glue.
We used a wire brush attachment on the inside of the hull that removed everything, made lots of dust but realy does work.
I hope this helps

 

[Caronia]

Sarah .. I have sent you a private message.

Peter

 

[timevans2000]

My previous cat had been insulated with 1 inch thick polystyrene by the previous owner. I replaced some of it when relining the boat as part of a refit. Although the polystyrene was an excellent insulation material it is very difficult to glue in place. The board is rigid so does not follow the inevitable curves in aboat. The adhesive is coving adhesive as everything else melts the polystyrene.
I certainly would never use it again as it is important to ensure that no air from inside your boat ever makes contact with the cold surface of the bare hull. (this proves very difficult)If this happens you will get condensation.
Use closed cell foam and tape the joints with aluminium self adhesive tape to maintain the vapour seal.
Insulation works in hot and cold climates. I have been in situations where it is too hot to be out on deck, but nice and cool below due to the well insulated deck.