Greece, chartering to do skippered charters, pitfalls?

[Fascadale]

Hi

I'm looking for some advice from the Greece experts:

Is it legal, in Greece, to charter a Greek flagged yacht, properly coded and from an established Greek charter company and then run that charter as a commercial activity for say eight weeks of the year? In effect, chartering a vessel to do skippered charters? The charter company would ensure that the usual charter paperwork, crew lists etc were correctly passed and stamped by the PP.

I don't think this activity would count as a "black charter" but .......................

I'm wondering about the insurance situation and would the Greeks want to tax me?

Or is there a simple way round all this?

Thanks

 

[Mr Cassandra]

Do you have a Greek skippers licence?

 

[scotty123]

Hi

I'm looking for some advice from the Greece experts:

Is it legal, in Greece, to charter a Greek flagged yacht, properly coded and from an established Greek charter company and then run that charter as a commercial activity for say eight weeks of the year? In effect, chartering a vessel to do skippered charters? The charter company would ensure that the usual charter paperwork, crew lists etc were correctly passed and stamped by the PP.

I don't think this activity would count as a "black charter" but .......................

I'm wondering about the insurance situation and would the Greeks want to tax me?

Or is there a simple way round all this?

Thanks

Why not get the charterers to sign for the boat & hire yourself out to them as skipper?

 

[grumpygit]

Hi

I'm looking for some advice from the Greece experts: . . . . . . . and would the Greeks want to tax me?

In law most definitely, do you have a Greek tax number.

Keep it very legal and above board, the PP are looking at dodgy charters and issuing some hefty fines.

 

[sailaboutvic]

If your thinking of doing black market charters in Greece then don't , there's are really getting hot on it , not only fines but you could lose your boat ,
There still a few that I know that's doing it , I think there bloody mad and I told them so .

 

[Fascadale]

Thanks for your comments

Do you have a Greek skippers licence?

No Greek licence but plenty of MCA/RYA paperwork

In law most definitely, do you have a Greek tax number.

Keep it very legal and above board, the PP are looking at dodgy charters and issuing some hefty fines.

No Greek tax number, UK tax payer.

If your thinking of doing black market charters in Greece then don't , there's are really getting hot on it , not only fines but you could lose your boat ,

Definitely not using my own boat. Planning to use a Greek flagged Greek charter vessel

Why not get the charterers to sign for the boat & hire yourself out to them as skipper?

This is an interesting suggestion

 

[sailaboutvic]

Ok so what you seen to be asking is if you can use a charter boat and hire yourself out as a skipper , not sure a charter company would let you but I sure there be happy to hire you to skipper their boat , yes you would have to pay tax but it going to depend if your hired as self employed or as a employee who pays the tax on your behalf , many many years ago I was based In Kos as it happen I was one of the first boat to get a berth contact .
I was offen ask to bring a boat back or take a charter out who was looking for a skipper on a employed basics , in them days no body was interested if you paid any tax , plus the company would encourage you not to get involved with the tax man, things are very different now .

 

[Pasarell]

I agree with Scotty123. Plenty of charter companies looking for qualified skippers with the right attitude to make clients happy. Right now there is a particular demand as Sailing Holidays are being chased all over by Port Police because they don't ask for any qualifications from their charterers. Police have been looking at them very closely, so they have hired anyone they can find to become "skippers" on their boats. Given their attitude towards private owners and damage caused by their boats it couldn't happen to a nicer bunch!

 

[steveej]

I agree with Scotty123. Plenty of charter companies looking for qualified skippers with the right attitude to make clients happy. Right now there is a particular demand as Sailing Holidays are being chased all over by Port Police because they don't ask for any qualifications from their charterers. Police have been looking at them very closely, so they have hired anyone they can find to become "skippers" on their boats. Given their attitude towards private owners and damage caused by their boats it couldn't happen to a nicer bunch!

Funnily enough, I know a guy who has just come back from sailing holidays. No certs whatsoever and no experience either. Dread to think what the insurance position would be if he'd crashed into anything. If greek law requires ICC or at least dayskipper I'd be amazed if the insurance would pay out. Pretty irresponsible of Sailing Holidays in my view.

 

[sailaboutvic]

I don't think sailing holiday have the monopoly on this charter company's have been getting away with it for years , we was on the quay where one major British bareboat company runs from the other year and heard then explains how to haul up a sail and when best to pull what sail out and when .
Then went on to simply things are like tel tail and what to look out for , then they where taken out to show how to anchor and do med mooring , one hour lesson no more then a go on each , then they where let loses on a 45 foot boat but not before getting caught to other boats laze lines , the guy who took them out just shock his head when I said jokingly they don't seen to have a que how can the company let them charter his comment was , the boat insured and they have a ICC so no problem .
I think I said some thing like , may not be for you but it is for the poor guy they hit .

 

[[3889]]

Skippering for a Greek charter company is great if you want to get lashed in a taverna every night but you won't get rich. In 2015 Sunsail paid their skippers £120..........a week!

 

[BobnLesley]

...bareboat company runs from the other year and heard then explains how to haul up a sail and when best to pull what sail out and when...one hour lesson no more then a go on each , then they where let loses on a 45 foot boat...how can the company let them charter his comment was , the boat insured and they have a ICC so no problem. I think I said some thing like , may not be for you but it is for the poor guy they hit .

It doesn't get better elsewhere:
We're in Bora Bora this week, so back into charter yacht infested waters, the charterers are primarily sailing around Huahine, Raiatea, Tahaa and Bora Bora all of which are inundated with complex and shallow, though admittedly well-charted reefs and getting the 20-30 miles between islands can quickly turn into a serious open-ocean passage a far cry from floating about in the sheltered waters of the 1-onion. Despite this, the skill, experience and qualification requirements necessary to charter a yacht here seem to be about the same as in the 1-onion; a large proportion of them are simply incompetent.

It’s the weekend/changeover back in Raiatea so mercifully quiet today, but during the last few days we’ve jumped into the dinghy to help eight get themselves moored, not to tie stern-to a quay or even anchor, simply picking up a mooring ball – hardly rocket science! Their biggest issue seems to be high topsides and short boat hooks along with engines that obviously only work in full ahead or full astern. Thursday morning though we did reach a new high (or perhaps low) when a charter catamaran which we’d helped moor-up the night before came to leave: The engine started fine and the gears engaged, but the boat wouldn’t actually go anywhere, it just turned in circles and occasionally bounced to a stop/pivotted around; waving and shouting couldn’t get the message across, so it was back into the dinghy, motor over and suggest that taking-off the mooring line might help?
There's a small tug-boat whose primary task seems to be recovering charter yachts and towing them back to the charter boats’ marina/repair yard on Raitea; during the last month or so we’ve seen it towing four catamarans and one mono (how many haven't we seen?) and whilst they might just have suffered unfortunate mechanical failures or breakdowns, two at least appeared to have a water-pump on deck, working hard to keep it afloat. The attrition rate is horrendous, so perhaps the profit isn't in hiring out the yachts, but in the insurance claims for repairing them?