GALICIA - BLACK RIBBON - NEVER AGAIN

[Albatros]

Further to my prior message.. (I apologize for its length..) I would like to request your cooperation in making this matter widely known.. any way you possibly can..

The red ribbon was internationally used to bring a very sad matter to everybody's attention.. and it was successfuly used in websites worldwide..

I would appreciate it if you could help Galicia.. and most sailors in Europe.. to put international pressure on European and world politicians.. and to increase public awareness.. to ask your favorite websites.. and even your personal websites.. to display a BLACK RIBBON..

I'm going to hang one from my mast.. it won't have any international effects, but I'll feel better myself..

The most repeated comment in Galicia these days is NEVER AGAIN.. it could be a good motto under the black ribbon..

Maybe an absurd idea.. but many absurd ideas come up in these situations when one feels so sad, so angry, so powerless..

Thanks and best regards..

Albatros

 

[webcraft]

 

[Albatros]

Thanks!!!

Which website has it been posted at?

Pls visit the following website.. under construction..

http://groups.msn.com/OILSPILLSNEVERAGAIN

Best regards.. Albatros

 

[Guest]

Channel 4 news

Shortly after reading Albatros' other long and heartfelt post yesterday I happened to sit down and watch channel 4 news so I've got a couple of points to make.

Firstly - other posts on this forum demonstrate the depth of feeling shared by members.

Secondly, the Ch 4 news item (which was quite long and detailed) reported workers saying that the international response was very good and showed a lot of footage shot from above - oils slicks etc which is in direct contrast to Albatos' statement.

Thirdly and sadly, no it shouldn't happen but all the black ribbons and distressed postings in the world won't alter the fact that money makes the world go round. I suspect from reading (other postings) between the lines that a lot of posters on this forum either own their own companies or have positions of authority within companies. They will all be aware therefore of the overwhelming, driving need - profit. A sad fact.

Geoff

 

[webcraft]

Re: Channel 4 news

A sad state of affairs for yourself, Geoff . . . but not, as you rather arrogantly state, a fact - only a rather selfish opinion used by people to justify their own actions - or lack of them.

Believe it or not there are many of us on this forum for whom profit is NOT the overwhelming motive - even for some of us who run our own companies.

It's actually gravity - a force very much larger and more significant than anything we humans have yet come up with - that makes the world go round, not money.

Oh dear, the 80s and all the Wall Street Gordon Gecko 'Greed Is Good' stuff really got to you, didn't it?

Please don't tar the rest of us with your own brush.

(Use of 'tar' not accidental, BTW)

OK people, slag me off now for my bleeding heart do-gooder holier than thou mentality and tell me Geoff is right - humanity is doomed because our major biological imperative is to make money at the expense of other people. Who's going to be the first to trot out more trite social darwinism because it's easier than admitting that we are actually better than that?

Oops - too serious - quickly someone, turn this into a thread about bicycles or flag etiquette or something . . .

- Nick

 

[peterb]

Making the world go round

Just to get things right, gravity (in the form of tides) is actually tending to slow the rotation down, rather than keeping it going. What is keeping it going is inertia; a force which in other ways is helping the occurrences of events such as are being discussed here.

 

[Guest]

Can you read?

Arrogant, my arse. I actually said that I thought the whole situation was very sad and tried to justify nothing. I did state a fact - or have you not read a paper, listened to or watched the news.

I'm surprised at you Nick. As I once said you're a nice bloke - but you're letting your idealism get in the way of what is actually happening in the world. A state of affairs that I for one do not like. I'm realistic enough to see it. Personally (no I'm not going to say - you never know who might read this).

I also merely put another side to the story as Alabatros was saying that there was a virtual news blackout - which clearly isn't true. I am prepared to accept that the news is biassed however.

Unlike you - I will not resort to petty and underserved name calling.

Gordon Ghecko for Christ's sake - what cobblers.

Geoff

 

[Ohdrat]

Re: What is happening in this world

.. well from what I can see the drive for profits will mean that the joys of sailing on a relatively clean and abundantly life full sea are drawing to a close... either you accept that painting your hull black is a practical solution to the problem or you get off your frigging A**E and do something about it.. Quite simple really!

 

[Mirelle]

The polluters don\'t pay; their insurers do

This is the great fallacy in "making the polluter pay". The bill is picked up by the third party insurers, in this particular case the London Steamship Owners Protection and Indemnity Association, and spread across the whole industry - because this is a large oil pollution claim most of it will come from excess of loss reinsurance, and the reinsurers will recoup the cost out of next year's premiums, so every shipowner ends up paying for it at a flat rate. So the tanker owners with a huge investment in new, well run, ships, which have never spilled oil, will pay just as much as those who are, shall we say, less careful.

 

[webcraft]

Re: The polluters don\'t pay; their insurers do

Hi Mirelle,

At last somebody with a sensible and valid brick wall for my idealistic ranting to run full tilt into. This is a bit of a stumbling block to making the polluters pay, for sure.

What is needed is a blunt instrument - such as an annual pollution clean-up tax imposed globally on the oil companies and calculated retrospectively on the costs of the previous year - or two or three years in arrears if it's easier to administrate.

Of course, if this was ever implemented by international treaty no doubt some non-signatory rogue state (such as the USA?) would end up sheltering the oil companies. In this case it would be up to the UN to ensure compliance.

If you are one of those who don't believe the oil companies are the prime culprits, then don't worry - they have the power to put plenty of pressure on the shipping companies and other involved interests.

This is so full of holes I'm sure it will never fly - but surely it's not beyond the human race to come up with a solution?

- Nick