Forestay

[NorthRising]

This is the top and bottom end of forestay.

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d30/jamesdargie1/IMG_20161031_211347602_zps1nqfc8uf.jpg

The top seems bent; was it manufactured like that or has this arisen through use?

 

[Seajet]

No, not made like that, yes from use - may well be during mast lowering or raising; the top one at the very least means the whole wire is knackered, really - one doesn't want to mess with forestays.

Sadly replacement will mean a whole new wire with top & bottom swaged eyes - and sorting out how it happened so as to prevent recurrences.

 

[NorthRising]

Thanks for the response. I suspected this might be the case; time for new forestay.

 

[NorthRising]

The lower is straight, but new forestay it is, and no more DIY mast lowering.

 

[Seajet]

The lower is straight, but new forestay it is, and no more DIY mast lowering.

DIY mast lowering - and raising - should be fine on a 23' Sonata - I take it that's what the OP has ?

But would require above all else a pivoted mast step; what has she got ?

 

[Davegriff]

Toggles, fitted top and bottom, should alleviate most such problems, irrelevent of mast raising surely?

 

[Seajet]

I've got toggles on my standing rigging, but they only articulate so far; one still has to keep an eye on them during mast up / down exercises, during which the forestay is usually disconnected with say the spin halliard taking the load, but the forestay must not be allowed to drop somewhere awkward on deck and kink - so I tie up the bottlescrews to the guardwires etc with elastics so they cant topple when the mast is being raised.

In this case it looks a bit like the forestay was connected at a time the rig was slack, then an unusual load put on when it wasn't aligned - maybe some sideways mishap in the past.

 

[dom]

Agree with all Seajet says and would just add that a break in a bent swaged fitting often occurs one or two mm inside. That said your wires are nice and straight at their exit point, so it is the SS fitting itself which has started to deform and that's less of a worry, but it's still worrying!

A forestay break is particularly nasty so I'd agree with the recommendation to change out fairly quickly -- where is the mast going if it it snaps upwind? :ambivalence:

If reusing at all, keep a lookout for snapped strands and also strands which stand proud of the wire, as these are indicative of hidden breaks inside the fitting. It wld seem from your pics that none exist, which is good.

 

[Seajet]

Call me Captain Cautious, but even with good new rigging I always secure the spare and spinnaker halliards tight to the pulpit ( which is pretty well bolted down and backed ) with the tails well cleated / clutched - the loads on the forestay when going to windward in a stiff breeze even on my 22' are considerable, if the wire or something did go I'd probably get a funny shaped pulpit - so have to think of some BS about spinnaker systems - but it might give breathing time, also in the meantime it keeps the spare halliards out of the way...

 

[NorthRising]

Interesting. Yes the Sonata has a mast step pivot; I am not aware of any sideways event.

The boat was re-rigged in late 2009 (on surveyor's recommendation); and not launched till May 2010. The mast was lowered in 2012 to sort out some halyard issue. Then lowered again before crane out this year. I'm assuming the forestay was actually replaced in 2009 (I did pay for it...)

The roller gear is ancient, and is one of these old ones without a top swivel, the halyard being brought back down the drum next to the foil. I wonder if that contributes to stress on the forestay at the top. The upper terminal has been bent forward rather than to the side, so my suspicion is during lowering or raising.

 

[NorthRising]

Toggles, fitted top and bottom, should alleviate most such problems, irrelevent of mast raising surely?

What is a toggle (sorry for my ignorance), the top teminal is joined to a fitting on the mast with a clevis pin. Should there be something between that clevis pin and the forestay terminal?

 

[William_H]

What is a toggle (sorry for my ignorance), the top teminal is joined to a fitting on the mast with a clevis pin. Should there be something between that clevis pin and the forestay terminal?

Yes a toggle is a fitting that allows articulation in 2 directions. Often seen on the end of bottle screws. A toggle at top and bottom would have averted the bend in the swage fitting. Although my forestay has swages where the wire goes around a thimble and back on itself it has no toggles and has not given bend trouble. I drop the mast (self lowering) certainly every year sometimes more. There is the risk of your kind of damage when the mast is down and stowed or being lowered where wires can end up anywhere. I guess you need a new forestay if only for peace of mind. olewill

 

[LadyInBed]

What is a toggle (sorry for my ignorance), the top teminal is joined to a fitting on the mast with a clevis pin. Should there be something between that clevis pin and the forestay terminal?

 

[grafozz]

Jimmy green is doing a special on new rigging right now , 35 % discount .

 

[NorthRising]

So how does the toggle attach to the forestay; if it is like those that attach the shroud turnbuckles to the chainplates there is nowhere to attach the threaded toggle to on the forestay. At the lower end of the forestay it attaches to turnbuckle I'm yet to be convinced that a turnbuckle at the top of the forestay is appropriate.

 

[Minchsailor]

A forestay takes a lot of punishment with a jib flogging, causing vibration. Both ends should be double toggled.

 

[pete]

A toggle like this http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NTAwWDUwMA==/z/WEIAAOSwDk5UDgjp/$_35.JPG would do you but it seems to me that yours has bent in the direction that it does have articulation not the other way? can it pivot to more than the required angle fore and aft without fouling the mast clevis pin fitting? if so it possibly has been caused when the mast was raised.

 

[Minchsailor]

Here is the double toggle at the foot of my forestay - sorry for quality, but enlarged from a general pic of the boat.

 

[LadyInBed]

So how does the toggle attach to the forestay; if it is like those that attach the shroud turnbuckles to the chainplates there is nowhere to attach the threaded toggle to on the forestay. At the lower end of the forestay it attaches to turnbuckle I'm yet to be convinced that a turnbuckle at the top of the forestay is appropriate.

The long part of the T is swaged to the wire.

 

[PuffTheMagicDragon]

It seems to me that the forestay was used to control the mast while it was being lowered without using a pole (spi-pole or similar) to keep it at the same angle to the mast. Think of the mast and the pole forming an 'L' shape. This prevents the loaded forestay from getting closer to the mast, thus preventing any bending of the top swage.

Here is a photo from internet showing the principle: