Flares...traditional or LED?

davethedog

davethedog

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Another question for the knowledgable masses assembled on this forum:

We are looking to change (update) our flares soon and thinking of getting a couple of LED ones, to avoid all the hassle with disposing of old flares and also the inherent risk of having explosive devices on the boat (the wife is explosive enough most of the time never mind adding to it!).

So, what is the legality ref this regarding Europe, etc, as I recall that you had to have a certain amount of flares etc, or is this outdated now and we have moved on with the times?

DTD
 
The reviews of the LED flares have not been particularly complimentary. The only way that they get the range is by making the beam pretty narrow - and that then means that it must be pointing at the person who is looking for you otherwise they will not see it. Some rotate the beam to cover the full arc, but it will still be narrow in the vertical direction.

Our flare pack is now out of date and I am going to get it disposed of in a couple of weeks. We have two AIS radios on the boat plus PLBs, so I don't think I'm going to replace it with a full off-shore pack - our style of sailing does not justify it. I will buy three or four hand-held flares to help guide in a rescuer, but no rockets - they are just too difficult to safely dispose. I would not feel too bad about letting off the red hand-helds in a secluded spot on bonfire night when they expire.
 
davethedog said:
So, what is the legality ref this regarding Europe, etc, as I recall that you had to have a certain amount of flares etc, or is this outdated now and we have moved on with the times?DTD
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Don't know about other countries but flares (not leds) mandatory in Portugal. Lagos Navigators site has details about qty to be carried.
 
Should they really be called flares. The one I was shown was just a fancy light relying on line of sight and as maby says a narrow beam to boot. I will stick with flares and include rockets so as to be seen from beyond line of sight.
 
pcatterall said:
Should they really be called flares. The one I was shown was just a fancy light relying on line of sight and as maby says a narrow beam to boot. I will stick with flares and include rockets so as to be seen from beyond line of sight.
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You are mixing things up.
the LED would replace a HH Red ( would you really want to let one of those off on deck ) NOT a Rocket
 
davethedog said:
Another question for the knowledgable masses assembled on this forum:

We are looking to change (update) our flares soon and thinking of getting a couple of LED ones, to avoid all the hassle with disposing of old flares and also the inherent risk of having explosive devices on the boat (the wife is explosive enough most of the time never mind adding to it!).

So, what is the legality ref this regarding Europe, etc, as I recall that you had to have a certain amount of flares etc, or is this outdated now and we have moved on with the times?

DTD
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There is no (UK or international) recognised format/flashtype/sequence of LED light that is recognised as a distress alert. Assuming you already have DSC VHF and a PLB or EPIRB, then saying to the rescuer "I'm the boat with the bright flashy light" is a vey useful addition when they are faced with an area with lots of boats and no other obvious sign of a problem, particularly if they all match the description of "I'm the white one with white sails".

Www.solocoastalsailing.co.uk
 
Interesting question. I know in France flares, when carried, must be in date. Next time I am over I'll ask for a friend.

Personally, I am huge fan of pyrotechnics, see my comments in the Flares again thread
 
My sailing is limited to pottering around the Solent plus the occasional trip to Weymouth, so I've ditched my flares and have an LED "flare". I've never carried rockets, and I reckon the LED job is superior to a handheld flare as it lasts a couple of hours instead of a couple of minutes. Between the DSC VHF, and two mobile phones, I reckon I can get someone's attention, so the flare's job is only to guide them in the last mile or so.
 
Plum said:
There is no (UK or international) recognised format/flashtype/sequence of LED light that is recognised as a distress alert.
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Hint : ... --- ...

saying to the rescuer "I'm the boat with the bright flashy light" is a vey useful addition when they are faced with an area with lots of boats and no other obvious sign of a problem ...
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This is indeed my thinking for my LED strobe thing ... it conforms to no official standard, but is seriously bright (4 x 100W LED chips, over driven) and we can argue about it's meaning within the colregs after they have recused me.
 
Stemar said:
My sailing is limited to pottering around the Solent plus the occasional trip to Weymouth, so I've ditched my flares and have an LED "flare". I've never carried rockets, and I reckon the LED job is superior to a handheld flare as it lasts a couple of hours instead of a couple of minutes. Between the DSC VHF, and two mobile phones, I reckon I can get someone's attention, so the flare's job is only to guide them in the last mile or so.
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Reasonably close to other vessels, I think an orange smoke would get a far quicker response than anything else. Dump it overboard and forget about wasting time on phones and radio, just get on with surviving.
 
The point about VHF radio and EPIRBS is well made. For 'the last mile' I carry and have used a handheld 'milspec' strobe, the light from which also bounces off the sails. That DOES get attention....

As for flares, I still have my purple ones. Now THEY get attention, too......
 
I am about to buy a new lot. In fifty years I have ignited one hand held white in good earnest (forget night vision if you do this!) and a good many expired ones on Bonfire Night when it was still lawful to do that. They all worked but some very old ones gave a different colour.

I think I trust them. If I was in a liferaft I think I would want to have a red rocket handy
 
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I've never used an LED flare, so willing to be corrected if I'm wrong, but I'm guessing an led flare is pretty ineffective by day so a smoke emitting signal would still be useful. Be aware that some LEDs cannot be seen by night vision devices which your rescuers may be using. I have no idea if this applies to LED flares but an old fashioned strobe would certainly attract attention, as would a pyrotechnic.
 
boomerangben said:
I've never used an LED flare, so willing to be corrected if I'm wrong, but I'm guessing an led flare is pretty ineffective by day so a smoke emitting signal would still be useful. Be aware that some LEDs cannot be seen by night vision devices which your rescuers may be using. I have no idea if this applies to LED flares but an old fashioned strobe would certainly attract attention, as would a pyrotechnic.
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also, at night, besides products producing different forms of light, smoke signals give out an amount of heat which is significant to night vision devices :}
 
The real question which I can not answer is the requirements of various countries to carry flares. Certainly here in west Oz one must carry at least 2 parachute and 2 smoke flares. It was mentioned at one stage that a smoke flare will give a helicopter pilot an indication of wind direction and strength. (though I reckon he could do that from sea conditions. Anyway my opinion is that an EPIRB with GPS should cover almost all emergency calling needs. Certainly any bright light or mirror should do the final location. ol'will
 
JumbleDuck said:
What proportion of the general population recognize SOS in morse code, do you suppose?
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And how is that relevant to anything? If you remember, the proposition was:

There is no (UK or international) recognised format/flashtype/sequence of LED light that is recognised as a distress alert.
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And I disagreed, as there is. The morse for SOS is recognised internationally as a distress signal, and is a well known sequence. Even school kids know it.
 
Minn said:
I am about to buy a new lot. In fifty years I have ignited one hand held white in good earnest (forget night vision if you do this!) and a good many expired ones on Bonfire Night when it was still lawful to do that.
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As far as I know, it's still lawful now! The MCA tried to claim that it wasn't, but had to admit that they were making it up.
 
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