Fisher owners!! Please be honest...

dancrane said:
Also very true...but, I guess the point is, the reason for my foolish, wishful nostalgia in respect of the Fisher, is that no designer in the twenty-first century, has yet used the advantages of experience and computer-aided design, with the old, unpopular goal of creating a heavier-than-average wheelhouse cruiser.
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Could it be that designers realise weight has no benefits per se and only increases cost for no return. CAD and FEA allows designers to produce equally strong hulls that are much lighter and therefore cheaper and faster. The old hulls were heavy for no better reason than designers had to use overkill to be sure they had enough.

As for wheelhouses, there are lots of them. maybe not the faux north sea trawler type of the Fisher but certainly lots of deck saloons that can be motored from inside.

Odd isnt it that we are happy to have modern light weight well engineered cars but for boats some of us hanker after the old Morris Cowley equivalent
 
Various ponderings...

It's probably true. I'm almost convinced by the car-comparison; I'd much sooner crash whilst inside a new (monstrously ugly) Renault, than one of those lovely old 'Whitehall' Rovers.

Although, let's not kid ourselves; cars have got progressively heavier in the last two decades, at least. Look at how the Mk1 1970s Escort compared with the last...my Mk6 was about 40% heavier, and that Mk6 was positively flyaway compared with today's equivalent Focus.

But it certainly seems that early GRP yacht builders relied on serious over-building to negate the suspicions of traditionalists, and possibly their own private doubts. In fairness, that strategy seems to have resulted in those vessels' owners enjoying steady solidity four decades on; and occasional structural failures in modern economically-produced AWBs surely stir up disapproving murmurs from the graves or easy-chairs of the old-timers.

But I'd certainly rather have a fully-proven modern lightweight, than a safe-and-sure slow boat, unnecessarily over-built.

Amongst the subjects of my investigative research (wild fantasy), I've taken close interest in affordably ancient catamarans...so you'll appreciate that I'm not fixated by ballasting.

The Fishers managed quite a few things that sportier designs frankly fail at. I always enjoy listening to my sister's lubberly point of view, because she sums up an honest disinclination to bend to the practical necessities that yachting routinely requires...

...she liked the deck-level wheelhouse, which eliminates stepping unsteadily into an underlit cabin to escape wind and spray. She liked enjoying full daylight inside. She liked the high freeboard forward, and the bulwarks, and the reassuring sense that anything the boat might collide with, would likely come off worse. I recognise that most of these are instances of a frank fondness for large motor boats.

But part of her liking was for the blissful peace and unlimited potential range that the sails bestow, aboard a vessel with the ship-like atmosphere that the Fisher's proportions convincingly deliver. And honestly, I liked all that, too.

So, while I love the sleek Nauticats and some other 'deck saloon' designs, I'd be interested to see an updated take on the Fisher style, which maintains the imposing deck-level wheelhouse and sheerline, whilst slightly smoothing out the bulbous underbody. And a long, deepish fin, rather than Northshore's shallow bathtub? She might track rather oddly upwind, but no worse than before. (I mean the restyled Fisher, not my sister, bless her. :D)
 
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Fisher's were designed by Wyatt & Freeman - Northshore only updated (re-drew) the interiors - I did the MKIII Fisher 34 with the heads aft instead of fwd and longituninal galley instead of the galley aft - gave a smaller saloon but when you have two (Pilothouse) it doesn't matter imho!

Iirc the same designers drew the Cromarty 36 which is a much more modern design.
 
E39mad said:
Fisher's were designed by Wyatt & Freeman - Northshore only updated (re-drew) the interiors - I did the MKIII Fisher 34 with the heads aft instead of fwd and longituninal galley instead of the galley aft - gave a smaller saloon but when you have two (Pilothouse) it doesn't matter imho!

Iirc the same designers drew the Cromarty 36 which is a much more modern design.
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Thats the one with a picnic table on the stern (marinised of course)! :D

This might be of interest to some http://www.fisherowners.co.uk/

Personally, always liked the look of the Northeaster range.
 
Dare I suggest you start small. An LM27 in reasonable condition can be had for £26k. You could also go for a Hunter Pilot 27 for about £10k more. Both are reputed to sail better than would be expected for a 27foot deck saloon :-)
 
I just came across this thread and while it is from some time back I thought I would add my two pennyworth.
I first saw a Fisher in the 70s in Southampton Water, while out sailing with my dad. I said at the time 'I love the look of that boat and if I ever buy a yacht it will be a Fisher. Dad mentioned that it wouldn't sail worth a damn etc, but I simply loved the boat. 30 years later I was lucky enough to buy Wight Mistress, (F34) and now (2018) we are in our 16th year of ownership. Sailing? Well, we tend to do a lot of cross Channel work as we live on the Isle of Wight and like visiting the French coast. A Fisher will do everything reasonably well. If you are the type to spend the afternoons bashing round the cans, don't buy a Fisher, but equally don't moan when going up the Thames in a blizzard, or running back from Alderney in a rainstorm. We manage about 50-55 off the wind, which is not fantastic, but the new suit of sails, a Bruntons Autoprop (to replace the 20 dustbin lid 3 blade drogue) and a Hydrovane have all conspired to give us 1 to 1.5 knots extra under sail. Wight Mistress gets up to hull speed on a beam reach in a F5 so long as the sea doesn't punch you back. Which ever way you cut it, for any 34ft yacht it takes around 12 - 14 hours to go from Bridge Buoy to Cherbourg or Alderney, so I am extremely comfortable doing it in my Fisher 34, and if I do have to fiddle with the flappy stuff I slip on a light cardigan and open the door......
The Fisher, in my humble opinion (and as previously stated) does everything reasonably well and in much more comfort than most others. Steve White, retired YMI and naval bridge watchkeeper (submarines)
 
Yes, I totally agree. I have to say, however, that I have been quite pleased with Wight Mistress's sailing performance overall, more than I expected. Balancing the comfort and security against upwind performance is the pivot in the decision making process. I will add that we took Wight Mistress into the French waterways 2011 - 2014 (masts down and lashed on wheelhouse/pulpit) and she performed brilliantly there as well. 60hp Lombardini, worst consumption 1.6 ltrs per hours (driving gently) best consumption .6 ltrs per hour. (I fitted a calibrated day tank and took lots of measurements.) So I agree with the comment above, but feel free to be a bit surprised at what a Fisher can achieve (admittedly the Brunton Autoprop, new sails and a Hydrovane all contribute.)
 
If I had to buy a motorsailor, and it's not such a terrible idea for one's twilight years, I'd be looking for a Banjer.

4 listed on 'The Yacht Market'.
 
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dancrane said:
I love so much about Northshore's finest. Of course, it's very hard not to. I can easily forgive their sloth in calm conditions, because it's for such good reasons - their immense solidity and their disinclination to be thrown about. But...

...I really can't remember from my times aboard a F30 long ago, just how severely that big blunt wheelhouse diminishes each model's upwind ability. So, if you have one, would you care to tell, just what tacking angle you enjoy (or endure)?

Given my determination to use the motor as little as possible (in spite of the wind's amazing ability always to be blowing from wherever I want to go), I wonder if you can tell me either that the Fisher's stalwart characteristics make her rather flat tacking well worth putting up with, or (God forbid) that I ought to be looking elsewhere?

It's all academic at the moment, in fact...but a man can dream, and I do, day and night... :rolleyes:
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Yes, you should be looking elsewhere - not in connection with the boat, but in your choice of destination!
 
Just had a look at the Yacht Market. The Banjer looks brilliant. I am not sure I like the slope back windscreen; from experience you do get a bit of glare - hence the fishing boat windscreen sloping the other way.
Nevertheless, they do look very much worthy of investigating further. I looked at the one in Holyhead and I think it is well worth another look. Engine room looks respectable with a 6 cylinder engine. The uppers and insides a little needing TLC but that is all part of the fun. Don't discount the Fishers though, they do keep their price.
 
Twister_Ken said:
Dan - a souped-down Flying Dutchman cruising dinghy last week. A souped up Fisher this. What next?
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prv said:
Before that it was a Westerly gaff schooner and various other things.
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Some things don't change. Seven years on, I've only evolved far enough to think the Westerly schooner would benefit from a hard-top wheel shelter, too. :)

The reality gets closer, slowly. I now accept that a heavy long-keeler with a cloud of sail for progress downwind, could be matched very satisfactorily with a retrofitted wheel-shelter for auxiliary upwind/foul weather use. It's daft to lament what a motorsailer can't do as well as sleeker designs - but smart to enjoy the benefits of such a useable compromise.

Tranona said:
And I thought a schooner-rigged Osprey for singlehanded channel cruising...
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Interesting that I was seriously discussing modification of the Osprey, more than 18 months before I bought one. After five years of ownership, one mast is so far still enough.

But sailing the Osprey is what makes a motorsailer so consistently appealing. I already get all the performance I could ask for, in my summer dayboat. Open-cockpit yachts are (for me) too much like overgrown dinghies, retaining the weather limitations that I accept in an inexpensive dinghy. When I pay for a cabin, my willing outlay will mainly be for better comfort and versatility - much better, and enabling use in all seasons. I won't want days and nights afloat to be called off because of rain or cold wind.
 
In judging sailing performance, bear in mind the ability to tack, as well as the angle at which you can effectively sail.

I remember reading an article (PBO sail clinic?) some years back, which dealt with one of the Fishers (smaller one IIRC) which the owner was having real difficulty making tack. As I recall the experts were able to advise some improvements, but concluded it was never going to be a reliable tacker, and that the owner would just have to accept he might sometimes have to use the engine to make a tack. That seemed to me a major drawback, and would make me consider a Fisher only with caution.

I've never sailed a Fisher, unfortunately, so I'm in no position to judge how much of problem tacking it really is, or whether it is the same for all the different Fisher models.

With any heavy long-keeler it's unlikely to help the boat if the rudder is put quickly hard over, expecting the boat to flip onto the next tack like some sporty fin keeler - you need to develop a feel for how quickly she likes to come round and work with that, rather than against it (and gain some ground to weather while your at it!). You use the weight of the boat to carry it through a gentle but deliberate curve onto the next tack; rather than trying to stop the boat going one way, turn a corner, and head off in the opposite direction.
 
I wonder if anyone has ever converted a Fisher 25 ketch, to sloop rig? Northshore seem to have realised only rather late, that the hull deserved a taller rig. The ketch is really very small, whereas the sloop looks appropriately proportioned.
 
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