First time Yacht for Liveaboard

Ninpo

Ninpo

Well-Known Member
Joined
17 Jan 2011
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392
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Chichester
www.ivaninsurance.co.uk
Hi all,

I've been doing some research into which Yacht I want to get for when I do go the whole hog and go liveaboard :)

I'd love a Jeanneau Sundream 28 but that's way out of my price range for now.

So I've narrowed it down to two contenders... I am open to suggestions however :)

1. A Leisure 23sl
2. Mk1 Corribee

Has anyone here ever sailed either of these? How do they hold up for space etc?

Anything similar.

Cheers :D

Ninpo
 
Unless you are really intent on making life difficult for yourself I would suggest that being able to stand upright on board has to be one of the prime considerations for a liveaboard. Living aboard means you will spend the vast majority of your time tied to something and, in UK at least, you won't be wanting to spend a great deal of that time in the cockpit. The headroom in the Corribee is 4' 8", definitely not a lot. Headroom in the Leisure 23SL is stated to be 5' 11", less in the 23 I think.
 
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vyv_cox said:
Unless you are really intent on making life difficult for yourself I would suggest that being able to stand upright on board has to be one of the prime considerations for a liveaboard. Living aboard means you will spend the vast majority of your time tied to something and, in UK at least, you won't be wanting to spend a great deal of that time in the cockpit. The headroom in the Corribee is 4' 8", definitely not a lot. Headroom in the Leisure 23SL is stated to be 5' 11", less in the 23 I think.
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Thank you for your insight vyv_cox :)

So the Leisure 23sl is around 5'11, that'd do me standing up! I'm only 5' 9 or thereabouts.

I do in all honesty prefer the look of the Leisure 23sl - I'm not sure what the difference is between that and the ordinary 23 but hey :D
 
Andy and Lyn said:
How about a Westerly Renown - where do you want to live on the boat?
Click to expand...

A Westerly Renown - what size is that? I'd prefer sopmething that I can solo, I'm planning on trying to liveaboard somewhere in Gosport... if possible.
I'm looking at having a budget of around... £6-7.5k

ukmctc said:
buy a moody 33, trapper 500 both easy liveaboards.
do you intend to stay in one place or travel and stop when you need to work?
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Moody 33 - I take it it's 33'? trapper 500...

Well I intend to stay in Gosport, it's where I work. I would go cruising on the yacht though, either over weekends and occasionally during the week/evenings.
 
It helps to know that you are mainly staying put.

A yacht that offers most accomodation for the price may not be the best for long-distance cruising. For example I'd go with the Corribee if travelling, but the Leisure 23 for a base.

Consider where you want to keep the yacht. A marina is most convenient, but you'll have to keep the yacht insured and seaworthy. Marina fees, insurance and maintenance are all significant costs you need to factor in. A mooring is very inconvenient for a working liveaboard and will have no power. A mud-berth is perhaps best in terms of the balance between cost and convenience. There used to be a fair number in the creeks in Portsmouth Harbour, but they are mostly in out-the way places and these days in short supply, unobtainable for larger yachts.

I lived through one winter aboard a Kingfisher 20+ without standing headroom so it can be done - at least when you are young. This yacht was lined inside, which was a plus as condensation can be a real bugbear in winter. A friendly local pub, where we liveaboards were not expected to spend very much, was a great asset in the evenings.
 
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For the budget how about one of these? Decent boat and you can stand up. Bear in mind marinas are expensive in Gosport, aim for sub 8 metres/26 feet, it's significantly cheaper. Good luck...:)
 
Ninpo,

I had a deep water mooring for a while in Spider Lake, Portsmouth - through Gosport Boat Yard.

A million miles out there if by your own small tender, definitely not safe a lot of the time.

More to the point, say you get a mooring close in, check if you have access by dinghy at low or even half water; it's quite usual for the boat to be merrily afloat on her mooring but you can't get to or from the shore - pretty sure that's the score at Gosport, the only hope I can think of is the little marina in the corner, sorry I can't remember the name, bit of a hotchpotch of old boats and liveaboards but would be a good bet if they have spaces.

I'm assuming a normal full-blown marina berth is out of budget. If it's not, be wary of spending out in advance on a marina in case liveaboard doesn't work out ( hugely better situation in a marina WITH MAINS POWER though ).

If for any reason it didn't work out ( if you have other options of a place to live ) you might end up thinking you'd rather have spent the money on a bigger / better boat, only you know the whole score.

For interest, I lived on my Anderson 22 ( quite roomy but 4'8" headroom, which is not critical if the boat is comfortable ) with fiancee and a chum for a few weeks in midwinter a long time ago.

We had snow on deck, but were on a 'proper' marina berth, and were able to spend the long evenings in a nice warm pub ! Even with the dry heat of a mains fan heater, it was still condensation which made us give up, this is THE No.1 enemy, try polstyrene tiles on all bare surfaces, or carpets, good for warmth but mustn't be got wet.

I think the success or otherwise of your venture will be like any dwelling - location, location, location !

I'd definitely go for the Leisure over a Corribee, 100% ! For living, this is.

The Leisure will perform adequately, probably faster too just not as easily mannered.

Avoid inboard engines, though they are very rare on the 23 anyway.

The difference with the SL is it's a wedge-shaped coachroof, not exactly sleek, but the standard was just that, a bog-standard stepped lid, which looked bulkier than the SL - may even have more room but it's probably the stripes on the SL hiding things.

Remember to buy her as a sailing boat, you'll still need to insure her which could likely mean an 'insurance survey', unless the boat happens to come with a recent survey.

Very well worth shopping around for both insurers and surveyors, both vary prices a lot.

If you're going to have to get a survey done anyway, it makes sense to have
it done as a condition of buying the boat, in case anything nasty or expensive is found. Also surveyors make sure to find enough to knock their fee off the boat price...

If you pay for a survey it's yours, the owner would have to buy it from you if he wanted it; or a keen seller may help towards the cost ( guestimate £250-300ish ).

As I say I have a 22' boat, had her 33 years, so know the tips and what you do & don't need, had other larger boats too and know the area moderately, if I can be any help feel free to PM me.

BTW somone mentioned a Hurley 24/70, not a bad idea if the right keels and price but I know one which had delaminated at the keel join - watch out !

Good luck - I can promise it'll be an unforgettable experience - just be a bit savvy, don't rush in and make it that for the right reasons !
 
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AndrewB said:
It helps to know that you are mainly staying put.

A yacht that offers most accomodation for the price may not be the best for long-distance cruising. For example I'd go with the Corribee if travelling, but the Leisure 23 for a base.

Consider where you want to keep the yacht. A marina is most convenient, but you'll have to keep the yacht insured and seaworthy. Marina fees, insurance and maintenance are all significant costs you need to factor in. A mooring is very inconvenient for a working liveaboard and will have no power. A mud-berth is perhaps best in terms of the balance between cost and convenience. There used to be a fair number in the creeks in Portsmouth Harbour, but they are mostly in out-the way places and these days in short supply, unobtainable for larger yachts.

I lived through one winter aboard a Kingfisher 20+ without standing headroom so it can be done - at least when you are young. This yacht was lined inside, which was a plus as condensation can be a real bugbear in winter. A friendly local pub, where we liveaboards were not expected to spend very much, was a great asset in the evenings.
Click to expand...

I'm definately looking for something under 26feet, as I doubt I'd need bigger than that, and as you've said, once you pass that you'll start really paying for it!

As for Mud-berths... aren't they only accessible at certain times of day? and dont they rise and fall with the tides? So if I just fancied staying put on the yacht all day inside I'd have a fairly bumpy time when it hits the mud right?

I'm aware that Marinas can be abit pricey... but surely they're worth it as they have facilities etc...

djbreeze said:
For the budget how about one of these? Decent boat and you can stand up. Bear in mind marinas are expensive in Gosport, aim for sub 8 metres/26 feet, it's significantly cheaper. Good luck...:)
Click to expand...


Looking good, it's a nice yacht, yeah I'd want it to be under 26ft, as anything above that you'll start paying for it


Seajet said:
Ninpo,

I had a deep water mooring for a while in Spider Lake, Portsmouth - through Gosport Boat Yard.

A million miles out there if by your own small tender, definitely not safe a lot of the time.

More to the point, say you get a mooring close in, check if you have access by dinghy at low or even half water; it's quite usual for the boat to be merrily afloat on her mooring but you can't get to or from the shore - pretty sure that's the score at Gosport, the only hope I can think of is the little marina in the corner, sorry I can't remember the name, bit of a hotchpotch of old boats and liveaboards but would be a good bet if they have spaces.

I'm assuming a normal full-blown marina berth is out of budget. If it's not, be wary of spending out in advance on a marina in case liveaboard doesn't work out ( hugely better situation in a marina WITH MAINS POWER though ).

If for any reason it didn't work out ( if you have other options of a place to live ) you might end up thinking you'd rather have spent the money on a bigger / better boat, only you know the whole score.

For interest, I lived on my Anderson 22 ( quite roomy but 4'8" headroom, which is not critical if the boat is comfortable ) with fiancee and a chum for a few weeks in midwinter a long time ago.

We had snow on deck, but were on a 'proper' marina berth, and were able to spend the long evenings in a nice warm pub ! Even with the dry heat of a mains fan heater, it was still condensation which made us give up, this is THE No.1 enemy, try polstyrene tiles on all bare surfaces, or carpets, good for warmth but mustn't be got wet.

I think the success or otherwise of your venture will be like any dwelling - location, location, location !

I'd definitely go for the Leisure over a Corribee, 100% ! For living, this is.

The Leisure will perform adequately, probably faster too just not as easily mannered.

Avoid inboard engines, though they are very rare on the 23 anyway.

The difference with the SL is it's a wedge-shaped coachroof, not exactly sleek, but the standard was just that, a bog-standard stepped lid, which looked bulkier than the SL - may even have more room but it's probably the stripes on the SL hiding things.

Remember to buy her as a sailing boat, you'll still need to insure her which could likely mean an 'insurance survey', unless the boat happens to come with a recent survey.

Very well worth shopping around for both insurers and surveyors, both vary prices a lot.

If you're going to have to get a survey done anyway, it makes sense to have
it done as a condition of buying the boat, in case anything nasty or expensive is found. Also surveyors make sure to find enough to knock their fee off the boat price...

If you pay for a survey it's yours, the owner would have to buy it from you if he wanted it; or a keen seller may help towards the cost ( guestimate £250-300ish ).

As I say I have a 22' boat, had her 33 years, so know the tips and what you do & don't need, had other larger boats too and know the area moderately, if I can be any help feel free to PM me.

BTW somone mentioned a Hurley 24/70, not a bad idea if the right keels and price but I know one which had delaminated at the keel join - watch out !

Good luck - I can promise it'll be an unforgettable experience - just be a bit savvy, don't rush in and make it that for the right reasons !
Click to expand...

Spider lake - Not safe? in what respect?

I've walked past that small marina, the one right by the sea, not too far from the ferry terminal. They've liveaboards... I may go and have a nosey ^^

I'm definately going to research this alot before I decide to up sticks and leave, I can always find some other accomodation if it doesn't work out... however - I'm not one to complain, I'll always stick at something until I can make it work ;)


thanks for the info on the surveys etc... thats something I need to learn more about. as I've no idea what happens when a survey takes place nor what it is 'exactly' nor what impact it can have upon marinas, insurance, yacht prices...

etc

Thank you all for your input!
 
I've got a 27' Colvic northerner motor sailor. Two full headroom cabins forrard and a double berth sleeping cabin aft, plus a fully water tight cockpit. You could find one in your price range
 
Ninpo said:
I'm definately looking for something under 26feet, as I doubt I'd need bigger than that, and as you've said, once you pass that you'll start really paying for it!

As for Mud-berths... aren't they only accessible at certain times of day? and dont they rise and fall with the tides? So if I just fancied staying put on the yacht all day inside I'd have a fairly bumpy time when it hits the mud right?

I'm aware that Marinas can be abit pricey... but surely they're worth it as they have facilities etc...

Looking good, it's a nice yacht, yeah I'd want it to be under 26ft, as anything above that you'll start paying for it.
Click to expand...

Mudberths are typically alongside a short jetty or pontoon attached to the shore, so the yacht is accessible all the time. It will only be afloat around high tide; at low tide it will dig a hole for itself in the mud, and settle on the level. You will hardly notice it ground - certainly not bumpy! You'll sleep better in a gale than on a yacht afloat.

However a yacht with a long fin keel may have problems with a mudberth, both in access and in grounding level (it depends on the quality of the mud). There is a lot to be said for a bilge keeler if you want this type of berth. Incidentally, avoid a mudberth on a steeply sloping bank as the yacht may not be level when grounded. Check whether mains power is available - a big plus in winter. Also, if your loo flush uses seawater, you may have problems at low water. A chemical loo is better.

Mudberths are cheaper than marinas but dearer than a mooring. They were always my choice when money was tight.

If you haven't yet looked into marina fees you should do so immediately - you may get a shock. Places like Wicor Marine up in Portsmouth Harbour will be a good deal cheaper than, say, Haslar in Gosport. Marinas will require you to be insured, insurers will require the yacht to be surveyed, and surveyors will require the yacht to be fixed - all extra expenses. Also, English marinas don't permit liveaboarding. However most (but not all) will tolerate it if you lie on the application form and then keep a low profile. I don't know about Gosport marinas, it would pay if you can to make a few discrete enquiries before comitting yourself - but DO NOT ask the marina management directly.

If you can push your budget to a 25-26' yacht, with standing headroom, I can tell you from experience that it would be VERY much more comfortable than a 21-23' for living aboard. On the other hand, the smaller the yacht, the easier it is to find cheap places to keep it.
 
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Ninpo said:
So I've narrowed it down to two contenders...

1. A Leisure 23sl
2. Mk1 Corribee

Has anyone here ever sailed either of these? How do they hold up for space etc?
Click to expand...

Ooh, I can answer this.

I live on a MK1 Corribee, and this is my third year of doing so, and I've spent quite a lot of time on a Leisure 23sl, mainly in the forward berth with it's absolutely gorgeous owner. ahem.

So, which one to live on? The leisure, for sure. There's loads of room for a 23 footer, and you get space for clothes and a heater. The Corribee just doesn't have that room so you'll end up shuffling stuff about and keeping your clothes in a kit bag. As has been said though, the Corribee is a proper beast of sail boat and will take you anywhere. Careful with the MK1's though. Get one with a skeg.
 
You may even find a Westerly Centaur for that price if you look around. I know of one that went for 5k and looked great after a bit of TLC. There was one very keenly for sale, as they say, on the Medway, bet you'd get it for a bargain price if it's still around. Remember it's a buyers market...look at boats for 10K and make silly offers. I know someone who bought a Pentland for 10k, and she was in good sailable condition.
 
nathanlee said:
Ooh, I can answer this.

I live on a MK1 Corribee, and this is my third year of doing so, and I've spent quite a lot of time on a Leisure 23sl, mainly in the forward berth with it's absolutely gorgeous owner. ahem.

So, which one to live on? The leisure, for sure. There's loads of room for a 23 footer, and you get space for clothes and a heater. The Corribee just doesn't have that room so you'll end up shuffling stuff about and keeping your clothes in a kit bag. As has been said though, the Corribee is a proper beast of sail boat and will take you anywhere. Careful with the MK1's though. Get one with a skeg.
Click to expand...

The only reason I'd suggested the corribee was because of you're adventures on Kudu :D
Good work, keep it in leisuring on the leisure ^^


The corribee's are a lot cheaper than the leisures too... a plus in my book!

Keep up the vids, I've just finished watching your 17 part documentary, inspiring stuff!
 
Live Aboard Headroom

I was press-ganged into searching for an affordable cruiser for "Captain Bligh". Top of his list was a Virgo Voyager, fin keel, inboard diesel because "I can stand up in a Virgo Voyager". At the time there were none to be had. Eventually a Robert Ives 4-21 was found and after numerous mishaps and a long shakedown and refit the boat finally made it to the West Indies. The boat sails well doing about 90nm per day on average, all time best 114nm. For serious cruising you will need solar panels and an H frame welded on the stern rail. You will also need a wind vane as well as an Autohelm. True to Murphy's Law about 18 months after the Ives had been converted from what was basically a day-sailer, the exact boat turned up complete with Yanmar 1GM! It was for sale by widow I suspect as the asking price was only £2.5K - too late as all the expensive modifications had already been done to the Ives. Virgo Voyager twin keel versions are far more common than the fin keel and unless you are going on a blue water cruise they are a better bet as they don't fall over when "sailors" are eating their pub lunch. I saw some absolutely awful boats during the (Internet) search. In particular there was a Jaguar 22 painted up in football colours. No diesel just an outboard and they wanted £8K for it!!!! Good luck.

Ninpo said:
Hi all,

I've been doing some research into which Yacht I want to get for when I do go the whole hog and go liveaboard :)

I'd love a Jeanneau Sundream 28 but that's way out of my price range for now.

So I've narrowed it down to two contenders... I am open to suggestions however :)

1. A Leisure 23sl
2. Mk1 Corribee

Has anyone here ever sailed either of these? How do they hold up for space etc?

Anything similar.

Cheers :D

Ninpo
Click to expand...
 
AndrewB states that UK marina's do not allow live-aboards? I e-mailed Fleetwood and they are happy to have liveaboards at an extra £550/year for a 40'r.

Their price guide even has POA for liveaboards on it so they advertise the fact.

There must be others? Nathan lives in Preston marina at the moment and I assume they know given he is on hard standing?
 
Keep us informed of your progress, we appear to be in similar circumstances. I am curious to know which of us gets on the water first. :)
 
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