Buck Turgidson
Well-Known Member
We used to practice this every couple of years when I flew nimrods. Out in the Moray firth. Jump off a boat right the liferaft then get everyone in. It was hard when I was 21 so at 55 I don't rate my chances.
Entering a liferaft
- Thread starter lustyd
- Start date
RunAgroundHard
Well-Known Member
I am 59, overweight, have asthma, I can get into a liferaft in a pool situation, wearing an inflated lifejacket. I am quite puny as well. ISO life rafts are designed to enable boarding from the sea.
Buck Turgidson
Well-Known Member
In a pool I could do it and keep a fag on the go at the same time. Out on the oggin with wind and waves is a very different scenario.
Iliade
Well-Known Member
Put the boom off to the side and secure it there, climb on top of the wheelhouse and pull the l.r. painter, step into raft and wait for boat to sink, or for the raft to get swept off the roof.
Alternative for smaller craft: Remove raft from the back of the quarter berth into the saloon, step back into companionway and pull painter. Return to saloon if sufficient space remaining, otherwise remain in cockpit, await rescue.
Alternative for smaller craft: Remove raft from the back of the quarter berth into the saloon, step back into companionway and pull painter. Return to saloon if sufficient space remaining, otherwise remain in cockpit, await rescue.
Buck Turgidson
Well-Known Member
not sure the maths works for the second scenario and wouldn't want to be in it when the results come in!Put the boom off to the side and secure it there, climb on top of the wheelhouse and pull the l.r. painter, step into raft and wait for boat to sink, or for the raft to get swept off the roof.
Alternative for smaller craft: Remove raft from the back of the quarter berth into the saloon, step back into companionway and pull painter. Return to saloon if sufficient space remaining, otherwise remain in cockpit, await rescue.
boomerangben
Well-Known Member
Mmmm inflating on board - I would be terrified of it getting punctured. And if you’re on fire……..Put the boom off to the side and secure it there, climb on top of the wheelhouse and pull the l.r. painter, step into raft and wait for boat to sink, or for the raft to get swept off the roof.
Alternative for smaller craft: Remove raft from the back of the quarter berth into the saloon, step back into companionway and pull painter. Return to saloon if sufficient space remaining, otherwise remain in cockpit, await rescue.
For me if I need a life raft, it’s a deploy and go type of scenario. The less time the raft is alongside, the less chance there is of puncture and injury from the dying vessel and by making sure everyone is ready at the same time, less chance of someone being left behind or becoming separated from the rest of the crew
Edit to add the risk of the wind blowing the raft away before loading
Scillypete
Well-Known Member
Having had to take to a liferaft from a sinking boat I can say that staying clipped onto said sinker was not something we gave any thought to. The first one in stepped down into the raft that we kept close by shortening the painter by hand, last one in had to be encouraged to shift his harris as water was lapping over the stern and he literally leapt across doing the entry as trained RN style only months earlier. Painter cut and away.
Wind was easing from earlier gale but still around f7 sea state was not smooth, we were 2000nm into a transatlantic crossing.
There will be many different scenarios and conditions you can’t train or expect it for any particular time and you just have to do the best you can in a bad situation. If you live to tell the tale it’s a success.
Wind was easing from earlier gale but still around f7 sea state was not smooth, we were 2000nm into a transatlantic crossing.
There will be many different scenarios and conditions you can’t train or expect it for any particular time and you just have to do the best you can in a bad situation. If you live to tell the tale it’s a success.
Roberto
Well-Known Member
An interesting video (in French) of the sinking of a Mini650 near the Azores, fire caused by Li-ion batteries thermal runaway, small flames gradually picking up the whole boat. The guy says a frightening moment when he was inside the inflated liferaft very near the boat, the underwater ballast pouches made paddling almost useless, the raft did not move while the fire was beginning to spout all around pieces of incandescent material (+toxic fumes etc); the raft eventually turned around the boat and drifted to a safe distance.
lustyd
Well-Known Member
I can see the sense in this, but the thread started because a boat and liferaft were found without owner after the EPIRB was set off, hence wanting to discuss how to do it more safely in rough conditions.
The thread started due to the boat in Biscay, were not discussing benign conditions, obviously that would be an easy scenario.
Fr J Hackett
Well-Known Member
I went on a course which was conducted in a swimming pool. About 10 from memory and we all had to take it in turns to enter the life raft first from the water then help the next person in. 3 managed it first time I can remember that as my friend and I both early 50s at the time were two of the 3. Of the rest 2 struggled and eventually managed to get into the raft ( we were all wearing full foul weather gear over a boiler suit and inflated life jacket. The rest couldn't manage to get into the life raft on their own. I have little doubt that the odds of getting into a life raft on your own as a single hander in full kit in a big sea would be very high indeed and not something I would care to contemplate. The obvious answer is to get into the raft directly from the yacht without entering the water.
Roberto
Well-Known Member
Likewise, did the course and tried both 150N and 275N lifejackets, I could do it -just- with the smaller LJ, with the bigger 275 absolutely impossible, even partially deflated. Maybe a real distress can provide an adrenaline boost but not keen to try.
Scillypete
Well-Known Member
And there in lies your problem. . . . None of us were there, nobody can ascertain exactly what the conditions were at the time, or the decisions taken, or the actual ability and agility of the poor individual that had to make those decisions, and then take actions during what I have no doubt were extremely tough moments.
Yet you think there may be some lesson learned. . . . . . . It’s impossible to learn when you weren’t there and able to appreciate the situation, and none of us were so it is also impossible to speculate on what could or could not be the best thing when there are so many variables.
lustyd
Well-Known Member
Very little of this makes sense. We know the conditions, they were widely reported. We also know that the skipper set off the EPIRB and launched the liferaft, and that it and the boat were later found together without the skipper. The most obvious conclusion seems to be that the skipper was entering the liferaft and something went wrong leading to them being swept away.
If you don’t think it’s sensible to discuss how to avoid the same fate then you have a very different approach to sailing than I do. That’s fine, but don’t come here trying to stop others from discussing, learning, and understanding what can go wrong. If you’re not interested, stop reading and don’t post.
RunAgroundHard
Well-Known Member
The life raft has a knife, lifejacket safety lines may be too short to board. As part of your abandonment plan you extend the life jacket safety lines using a custom line design. Enter the life raft, cut tether extension. If you fall in, both liferaft and person abandoning are still connected. Something like that, would not be a difficult thing to implement.
RunAgroundHard
Well-Known Member
An inertia reel could be hoisted on a halyard. Folks get to the abandon point clipped on, then clip to the inertia reel, unclip safety lines may, board life raft. Tail on inertial reel, clipped to guard rail, allows it to return to boat for next person. Defo more fiddly, the type that deaclerates would be required, not the locking type.
It doesn’t even have to be hoisted, could be clipped to the mast base or any deck level, secure fitting. You can get them with a line length that exceeds a typical painter length.
It doesn’t even have to be hoisted, could be clipped to the mast base or any deck level, secure fitting. You can get them with a line length that exceeds a typical painter length.
boomerangben
Well-Known Member
If it were me, launch the life raft (attaching the painter to a suitable cleat first of course), inflate, shorten the painter to an appropriate length and if I had concerns, clip the safety harness to the painter as I step/jump/sprawl into the raft, make sure everyone is aboard, cut the painter and set about the actions for using a life raft. 8mm polyester ( about 900kg mbl) might not be any good for a jack stay, but (for me at least) perfectly adequate for keeping me from being separated from the raft. If you want to be clipped into the raft I think, if memory serves, there are webbing lines sewn into the floor. I’m not sure whether I’d want to be clipped into a raft though given the risk of capsize
boomerangben
Well-Known Member
Another thought. Reference to the OPs original scenario, there is no evidence to say the incident happened when transferring to the raft, he might have fallen over board whilst launching the raft….
lustyd
Well-Known Member
I’m assuming clipped on to the jack stays for that bit. You’re right that might have happened but there’s already a clear and concise answer to how to avoid falling off of a yacht so no real need to discuss. As I said though, not a lot of guidance, information or discussion of the transfer and this is the first time I realised it may be an issue
RunAgroundHard
Well-Known Member
The good thing about threads like this, is that make you think about those rare situations and how you would deal with them. As a result I will update my abandonment procedure to include a method of securing a person transiting to the liferaft, where required.
capnsensible
Well-Known Member
Yup. Worth remembering K.I.S.S.