Elizabethan 29 cradle

[pandos]

Hi I have recently bought a project to keep me occupied for a few winters.

I need a cradle to hold it which must be capable of being rolled in my driveway, has anyone got measurements for a cradle.

as you can see from the attached pic that the trailer is not exactly designed for transport, and frankly the digger wants it back.

 

[rob2]

It sounds like you want a trailer or trolley rather than a cradle. The basis of how the boat sits between supports with its weight on the keel is the same as for a cradle, but a substantial frame and axles are required. The Liz 29 is borderline on weight for legally towing on the road with a Land Rover or similar as it will be around 3 tonnes plus trailer. If you can accept a static cradle the a homebuilt version made from scaffold poles, acros and tubeclamps will save a lot of money. You really need to get some measurements of the hull at the position of major bulkheads, as positioning good sized support pads here will distribute the load better. The pads are usually set a little below the waterline (4'2"), but want to be angled from a base frame which should ideally be at least as wide as the boat (7'6"). There is some useful information and a "handbook" on the Elizabethan owners' site - http://www.eoa.org.uk/forms/Elizabethan29OwnersHandbook.pdf.

Most yard trolleys (not road trailers) are built using heavy girders for the frame and a couple of Transit axles or similar, often with both axles lockable or steerable with a towing bar attachment on each axle. This arrangement allows tight manouvring, but also requires access from both ends to achieve it. It is not a trivial proposition to move over 3 tonnes around just for convenience, so a cradle may be a better option.

Rob.

 

[pandos]

Hi. Thanks for the reply.

I have already moved the boat over 100 miles in the digger trailer, (possibbly overweight)

I need a cradle to hold it in the garden but a yard trailer to get it in the gate, ( the road in front of my gate is not wide enough to swing in the boat) it will need to be swung by a loader onto the cradle and then hauled in the gate.

what I am after is exact sizes for a cradle that is in use thus reducing the element of chance, and allowing the construction of a simple cradle that can be fitted with wheels for the short trip to the end of the garden.

 

[Jabamusic]

I have already moved the boat over 100 miles in the digger trailer, (possibbly overweight)

Holy c**p !! God loves a trier!

Good luck with this. The Elizebethan is a great boat, I love her stern.

 

[pandos]

That trailer takes a 3.5 ton digger, but the boat was a bit bigger than she looked on the ground. Had to be loaded in a field with a JCB.

It will be a nice project but only viable if actually in the back garden.

 

[Jabamusic]

Is this the sort of thing you are after?

I know, no wheels....

 

[rob2]

Yeah, this is the problem for many who (quite rightly) see the option of building in the back garden as the only viable way to refurbish faster than the rate of deterioration. I know, my mate sold his boat to someone who lived local to the boatyard as the journey to and from the coast made each visit 50% making good the deterioration since our last visit. It's also why you see newspaper cuttings of massive cranes lifting the completed boat out over the roof of the house!

Problem is, a cradle is ideal whilst you're working on the boat as it is more stable than a trailer or trolley, but it gets much of that stability from the base frame being flat on the ground and the bonus is that means it can be much lighter built. By contrast a yard trolley is built with heavy frame components to prevent undue flexing, particularly whilst it is being wheeled across uneven ground such as the boatyard or your gravel drive. A trailer is built lighter and will usually flex a bit more than you would accept on a yard trolley, but the boat is securely strapped to it and road surfaces are expected to be smoother. Of course the suspension helps even out some of those problems.

In your situation, I would consider it to be ideal to get a secondhand trailer to shift it into place. Once ready to work, take off the wheels and block the chassis really securely to get some of the advantages of a static cradle. When you're not working on the hull outside, you could also add some shores to cope with really bad winds (like the incredible gusts we had during a thunderstorm yesterday - damn left the roof open on the car!) I believe most trailers have support legs which can be moved a little to align the pads to suit, such as at a bulkhead, but compared to lying on its side in a digger trailer it'll be an improvement!

Rob.

 

[aitchem]

You need a yard cradle like this.
Mine is a bit wide really.

 

[Evadne]

Hi,
I don't know of anyone who has one in Ireland, at the last count there were only a few Irish EOA mambers but I'll look them up later. Although there might be someone in Wales who may be able to lend you one, it mght be cheaper to buy one then go get something on the ferry.
PM sent.

David

 

[pandos]

This is the size and type I need, wheels can be fitted for the short haul/journey.

I will email the boatowner and hopefully he will measure up for me.

Can be made with out the adjustability, cheaper and easier.....

 

[Tranona]

If you are going that route then a standard 4 leg cradle from somebody like Yachtlegs will be fine. No need for detail measurements as they are fully adjustable. We share such cradles in our club and the cradle I use takes a whole range of boats from 28' up to my 37'.

 

[pandos]

If you are going that route then a standard 4 leg cradle from somebody like Yachtlegs will be fine. No need for detail measurements as they are fully adjustable. We share such cradles in our club and the cradle I use takes a whole range of boats from 28' up to my 37'.

More than £1000 , plus transport from uk.

Simple uncomplicated cradle made to measure is the cheapest and perhaps the best option. Designed and made to do one job, but do it well.

Probably £200 in steel and welding rods, will see a good solid cradle,

 

[Deleted member 36384]

Tenamast over in Scotland, Ayrshire, build so called "under cover cradles" in bare steel at £600 inc. VAT. If you can lift the boat in with a crane you could sit her on the keel and prop up with 4 x stands at £90 each inc. VAT. Perhaps you could fit wheels to such a cradle. A recent quotation gathering exercise found that Tenamast are currently the cheapest amongst the major cradle builders when comparing like for like.

An alternative is eBay. Large cradles for bigger yachts go for about £700 according to my research (I am looking for a cradle). The crappy ones sell for much less.

 

[Tranona]

More than £1000 , plus transport from uk.

Simple uncomplicated cradle made to measure is the cheapest and perhaps the best option. Designed and made to do one job, but do it well.

Probably £200 in steel and welding rods, will see a good solid cradle,

Yes, but the picture you showed as an example was not like you are now describing, which is why I suggested if you want something that sophisticated then buy a stock one. You have the boat, take the measurements yourself. If you are capable of welding, surely you can use a tape measure? Then you will get a cradle exactly how you want it.

 

[Avocet]

I'd echo Rob2's comments. If you want a cradle that sits flat on level ground, that's one thing - it'll be quite simple and will take much of its support from the ground. In effect, such cradles are just like shores and the cradle frame itself doesn't do much more than hold the bottoms of the shores in the right place and stop the tops of the shores from moving outwards. If you just try to put a wheel on each corner of that sort of cradle, I think bad things will happen (unless it's on a very flat, even, level and stable surface. Even then, a tyre going down could twist the whole thing. You will need a MUCH stiffer structure if you're going to put it on wheels!

Depending on what your ground is like, Avocet's original cradle just had four huge castors - one on each corner. I think that might be pushing it for an E29 though. Avocet weighs just under 3 tons.

If you're willing to sacrifice mobility, I think you can knock up a suitable thing relatively easily, but £200 seems a bit light in the face of current steel prices. Avocet's is made up of a rectangle of channel section (I think about 50 x 100 mm standard rolled channel) and two 100 x 100 x (about) 6mm angle sections facing each other to make a channel for the keel to sit in, then 4 Acrow props - one at each corner, braced fore-aft and side-side with 25 x 5 mm strap, but there are NO wheels (or castors) on it.

 

[richardh10]

My Liz 29 is nearing the end (hopefully) of its refurb, and I have had it in the garden. I used 3 acrows on each side plus a selection of 6x3 fence posts, all braced and cross braced etc. It doesn't look pretty but it has done the job for 2 years, and cost practically nothing.

Easy to work on, and if I can be of any assistance just pm

Great boats, and I can't wait to get back in the water. Everyone will know when I have, because it will rain solidly every day for the following 6 months!