Earls Court Boat Show

Its not working very hard for its members if all the smaller manufacturers can't afford to exhibit at the main show of the year!!!!!

I'm not disputing the success of big British marine companies.... I agree, they are a great success story, but their exhibited products don't reflect a large (I'd go as far as to say a vast majority) segment of the boat buying publics requirements or budgetary abilities..... the large boats are no doubt fabulous, but how many of us can afford something like that?

I'm sorry, but the BMF hasn't won my sympathy by creating a show that covers larger and larger boats and become more and more 'stage managed'..... in a nutshell, the vast majority of what was exhibited was completely irelevant to me budget wise, and the vast majority of my sailing friends and acquaintances......

As for the chandlery discounts vs internet argument... I don't tend to go to the show looking for bargains... I go looking for expertise, advice and experience.... and its harder and harder to find that when the largest share of the chandlery floorspace is taken up by several mega chandleries that are the only ones that can justify the cost.... what happened to the small stands of highly specialist exhibitors that just offered 3 different sizes of 'widgets' and knew the answer to any possible question you could dream up in their area of expertise... they simply weren't there.... many will remember the small booths upstairs on the mezzanine at EC that were a mine of useful advice and support.... gone.
 
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We dont even know how much this man is taking, is it EC1 and 2 or just 1

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According to this ybw news report Brooke confirms they have booked EC1&2.

The boat show calendar is getting out of hand already..... Ignoring the location/dates, can we really afford another show? I know we couldn’t really justify further expense…

Its already a bloody joke the costings involved over a 12 month period, attending the already established UK main shows.
 
Not having been to any of the boat shows, ever!, does not however prevent me from spouting my opinion /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I am actually quite surprised / puzzled that folk seem to be getting quite so "anti" any new show.........

My take on things would be, fair go to anyone who wants to try and set something new up - if it doesn't work so be it.

FWIW I would have thought that manufacturers would attend ANYWHERE they could sell enuf boats or gear to justify the expenses involved (whether or not they bring their boats on a trailer) .........even if this involves having to "sell" to punters rather than just asking folk to form an orderly queue??

I would have thought that their would be a market for a show with a diverse range of exhibitors (Suppliers and Manufacturors), not just the big boys - but to do this it needs to be affordable for the small folk............but then again I am NOT putting my money into this!
 
Sorry James et al, but I reckon MagnaCarter has it right on this occasion. If, James, you think that LIBS currently caters for the needs of the 'average' boatowner, then it's not surprising that IPC's magazines have displayed the general tendency (with honourable exceptions) to move up market, and increasingly far away from the kind of sailing that many people can (or will) afford.

I seem to recall that one of the mags did a survey on the 'average' yottie not so long back. I'd say that Mr Average didn't have the kind of discretionary cash to splash that would bring him into the apparent market for many LIBS exhibitors. Not without making some serious compromises on the quality and fit-out of his shiny new mortgaged-financed AWB, at any rate.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not anti-LIBS. I turn up faithfully and ooh and ah at all the new shiny toys just like any other enthusiast. It's fun to indulge in a bit of escapism now and then, so why not?

But if the EC boat show returned to something like the old formula, with boats n'stuff to look at, and a couple of those fun displays in the pool, coupled with real-world sellers of real-world chandlery and kit at real-world prices - or as near as the marine industry will ever get to such a concept - then I'm up for it. And so is my wallet.

I had about a grand of discretionary spending available at LIBS. No-one got my money. Their stuff either cost too much or - and this was a chandlers, by the way - they didn't have the item displayed in stock. It would have been quicker and (as I subsequently discovered) cheaper to by it on the web. Their loss. At the old EC, everything on show in the chandlery and similar stands was there and on sale. I'd have bought it. I did at the time. I would again.

So I'm voting with MagnaCarter, for a return to the old mixture of bazaar, circus and trade show that EC epitomised. And I hope the organisers are reading this - get it right and you and your exhibitors can have my money. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
Re: competitive forces

Personally I thought Excel had as much atmosphere as a branch of B & Q ... all the big stuff round the edge and what small stuff there was in the middle. I seem to remember Earl's Court as being rather cosy. Outgrown the place? ..... Did it need to be bigger? How many Sunseekers do you want to look at? I thought this year's crop of sailing boats was disappointing .... I don't remember ever coming away from Earl's Court thinking 'I won't bother next year!' .... I've always done both shows on Tues/Wed of the second week ... EC was never that crowded ... Excel last week you could have fired a cannon up through and not hit anybody! Slight exaggeration but you know what I mean. This new show presumably is aimed at those who are dissatisfied with Excel ...... will the manufacturers support it? ... or both? What's next on the agenda? ... shift the Excel show to the NEC? Maybe that would be better .... what about March/April? Where will it all end? Do we care? Why are we here?
 
Andrew_Knight

Good post.

I would expect the number of people who have boats and want to add things to them is higher than those who want to buy a new boat..........and have decided to wait until the boat show to do this. (Times passed, I can understand why folk would be more likely to do this - but we DO now live in an information age, where folk can get themselves in a position to decide what they want / need well before ever seeing a particuler XYX model or the salesman).


IMO on the chandlery side although folk still prefer to see and touch what they are buying and can be sold to / helped a lot easier face to face, I also think that post Internet they are perhaps a lot more comfortable nowadays with dealing with suppliers who will just "pop it in the post", rather than HAVING to lug something around the show - so perhaps the folk selling bulkier items are not at the disadvantage they once were??
 
I would support something that was just like an indoor Beaulieu.
Chandlery, small new stuff, snake oil peddlars, proper burger bars, minor boats and dinghies, tenders, outboards.
As someone who did not get to work on a stand this year due to it being 11 grand to shove a 29 footer out in the marina with no eberspacher on board, I can see the need to appeal to the everyday boater, and not just the idiots like me with an AWB/Mortgage combination. I speak from my years of owning rubbish boats in permaresto condition, where I would take a grand or so (my years boat savings) to spend after being mesmerised into the latest gadget.
I dont think any institution is sacrosanct, and particularly not one that palpably does not provide what we the whinging public wants.

On the other hand, whoever bought a car from the Motor Show? /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Make it reasonable cost to vendor and punter, keep it trimmed well, and I am sure there is room for both.
 
What about -

Running the two shows at the same time?.
? Not so daft when you realise there is a reasonably rapid train connection between the two - OK you have to change.

Small stuff and non boaty bits at EC, seriously expensive stuff at Excel. Cheap train ticket between the two, and mix it up a bit so there's some incentive to go to The Other Place. Large screen Tv between the halls.

Bit of a radical idea, but that would solve the problem of complete separation, and might answer the critics.
 
Whoa! Did I ever say LIBS catered for the 'average' yachtsman?

The average yachtsman sails a boat of a certain age, fits it out from Beaulieu and does his own maintenance. You are never going to build a show round that. It's a show of new boats and new gear. And new boats these days tend to start at 30ft or more. There are fewer mail order chandlers although there were still a lot at ExCell - I would guess as many as at EC.

Sure there weren't many small boats but that reflects the new boat market. There were some - Lasers, RSs etc and there is always the Dinghy Show in a couple of months where there is a completely different atmosphere with all the owners associations exhibiting, lots of seminars etc.

And of course there are lots of shiney Mobos and not many yachts. That's been the market for years - don't you remember all of EC 2 being full of Prinsunlines plus a fair bit of EC 1?

There's an awful lot of rose-tinted spectacle wearing going on when people look back at dear old dirty, smelly, cramped, awkward Earls Court. And I should know: I've attended almost every one since the mid-sixties and worked at everyone since 1974.

So there!
 
JJ we have something that we can agree on EC was crowded, fetid and with nowhere to sit other than on the tacky floor, it was not somewhere I ever enjoyed going to.

However, if there is a market for this kind of thing then let the new guys have a go. I don't agree that because there are two shows then both would suffer, the new guys just have to get the focus of their activities right so that both they and XL mutually benefit.

Whilst I bow to your expertise in yots there are other boaty areas that could benefit from more shows. As a cross dresser (I have both yot and fishing boat) I was sorry to see that Orkney fishing boats didn't exhibit at XL this year, on cost grounds I believe. They have a good product and at a lower cost and different audience they might do better.

If I could draw a parallel with the, ahem, publishing market, PBO, YM and YW aim at different market sectors so why can't the boatshows mirror this distinction?
 
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Whoa! Did I ever say LIBS catered for the 'average' yachtsman?

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No. But I did infer from your previous statements that you thought that, by extension from your suggestion that there was no room for another show at EC. My (and others') point if you recall was that such a show could be targeted at those with more modest means or spending aspirations.

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The average yachtsman sails a boat of a certain age, fits it out from Beaulieu and does his own maintenance. You are never going to build a show round that.

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Okay, so your point is actually that you perceive there's no market. But that's a bit hard to swallow. I'm no statistician but - casting my mind back to ditribution curves - wouldn't one reasonably expect market volume to bulge at or around the level of Mr (non-weighted) Average? And wouldn't all our modest couple-of-grands-to-spend total more than the market share, by value, of purchasers of expensive new boats?

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It's a show of new boats and new gear. And new boats these days tend to start at 30ft or more.

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Sure. No-one's arguing about what LIBS has become. And as I have said already, it isn't necessarily undesirable per se. It just leaves a gap in the 'boaters of modest means' market.

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There are fewer mail order chandlers although there were still a lot at ExCell - I would guess as many as at EC.

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We'll have to agree to disagree. I think there were loads more small chandlers as well as small specialist sellers of electronics and the like. But then I also think summers were longer and sunnier when I was a kid.

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Sure there weren't many small boats but that reflects the new boat market. There were some - Lasers, RSs etc and there is always the Dinghy Show in a couple of months where there is a completely different atmosphere with all the owners associations exhibiting, lots of seminars etc.

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I don't own or wish to buy a dinghy. I own a small yacht and am likely to want another one sometime. People may wind me up about my boat being a dinghy with a lid on, but the reality is that it differs significantly from a dinghy. And it has significantly different requirements as to sails, electronics and other kit. A laser owner and I are unlikely to buy much of the same stuff for our boats.

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And of course there are lots of shiney Mobos and not many yachts. That's been the market for years - don't you remember all of EC 2 being full of Prinsunlines plus a fair bit of EC 1?

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Yes. And they sat quite happily alongside more modest yachts and river craft which were in the pool and in the remaining exhibition space. As well as all the little chandlers and suppliers. That's the point - almost everything but the big stuff has gone from LIBS. The everyday yachts thing in the central walkway at ExCeL was nice - loved the Westerley by the way - but it was utterly incongruent with the rest of the show.

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There's an awful lot of rose-tinted spectacle wearing going on when people look back at dear old dirty, smelly, cramped, awkward Earls Court. And I should know: I've attended almost every one since the mid-sixties and worked at everyone since 1974.

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Perhaps. But it was great fun and very buzzy. I don't think the 'new improved' LIBS can compete with that. I'd be happy to go to both, and I suspect others would be too. Anyway, time will tell who's right.

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So there!

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Aha! A spokesman for the BMF at last! /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
JJ
I think it's a bad idea but If you stand back and think, if the guy running the new show targets NOT the boat Builders but the add-on or ancillary suppliers like electronics, engines, clothing and general chandlery then he might be on a winner!

There are a lot of boaty people out there that really only want to buy/checkout bits of kit for a boat they already own - yes getting a look at some boat they can't afford is OK but not essential.
Let Southampton do that - I would suggest that there's a market for a show that is offering everything BUT new boats.

Peter.
 
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