Dying engine syndrome...

P

porth

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I went sailing with a mate yesterday, good day bloody cold and a gale, no race 'cos the committee boat sank! Problem with the engine though; full revs no problem out of gear, but in gear the revs slowly died down to stop. Dont think its the prop, 'cos it didnt hasppen every time. Not the fuel filter, it is new and clear. Could it be the fuel pump? Its a Volvo 200and something. Can anyone help an engine dunce?
 
This happened when the little thimble filter in the fuel feed inlet of my injection pump blocked up. I could start the engine and it would rev reasonably when in neutral, put in gear and it would die. After a few attempts it wouldn't even start.

I never knew about the thimble filters - my name s they are tiny and look like a small sewing thimble. But they are very fine and designed to stop pump itself from getting crud inside.

Only a thought. Oh and we couldn't get to ours without taking pump of - it sits right down in the pump union itself.
 
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Probably shook up the tank in the gale, and got crud in the filter again

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Not unheard of in the change over of diesels. I took my boat from Red UK diesel which was 0.1 - 0.2 Sulphur in those days to Baltic where she is now. She was then run on Road Diesel for first short period - engine suffered blocked filters from crud lifted from tank bottom that had been happy for years .. I think that part reason was my thoughts to throw some injector / system cleaners in as well to clear the years of red.

I run all sorts of my own blends through it now and I have no trouble, but I made sure I sucked out tank bottom ! I also have to admit I have a spare inj. pump ready to bolt on, in the shed. Not a job for out there ! But I'm lucky that I'm a sail boat so can make way in a fashion without engine !
 
Are you getting air in the system from somewhere. I did on mine on the primary water filter. The drain plug washer was buggered so air was leaking in, however when power dropped then it recovered. Hoever if it was severe then the engine would possible stop.
 
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This happened when the little thimble filter in the fuel feed inlet of my injection pump blocked up. I could start the engine and it would rev reasonably when in neutral, put in gear and it would die. After a few attempts it wouldn't even start.

I never knew about the thimble filters - my name s they are tiny and look like a small sewing thimble. But they are very fine and designed to stop pump itself from getting crud inside.

Only a thought. Oh and we couldn't get to ours without taking pump of - it sits right down in the pump union itself.

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I also had lots of trouble due to the thimble filter.

I took mine out, and left it out. No problems since then. Think that more recent 2000 series engines do not have a thimble filter.

I know why now...........................
 
Check the exhaust elboe to see if it's blocked. You will nedd to remove it completely to check properly. This happened on my previous boat and when removed there was only a 10mm Ø hole in the centre! Tried chipping out the carbon but screwdriver went through the side so had to get a new elbow. Engine went like a rocket with a new elbow.
 
You said it's a "Volvo 200and something", so I guess it's a 2001/2/3 series engine. I have a 2003, and there isn't a "thimble filter" in it. You'll find there's a coarse plastic filter inside the fuel pump (item 5 in this diagram), but it's highly unlikely to be blocked as it's downstream of the primary filter.

You say the primary filter is "new and clear", but it's impossible to tell whether the filter element is clogged by looking at the bowl, so it would be worth fitting a clean filter just to eliminate that possibility.

There've been suggestions that you should check the exhaust. I think if the engine revs freely out of gear, the exhaust is likely to be OK. The volume of gas expelled is fairly similar whether the engine's in or out of gear.

Lots of boats fitted with Volvo engines also use the Volvo fuel tank plate (a circular green thing, about 7" diameter). The fuel pickup pipe has a fine mesh filter on the bottom, and this can become clogged, leading to the symptoms you've described. If the boat has this system, it's worth checking it.
 
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You said it's a "Volvo 200and something", so I guess it's a 2001/2/3 series engine. I have a 2003, and there isn't a "thimble filter" in it. You'll find there's a coarse plastic filter inside the fuel pump (item 5 in this diagram), but it's highly unlikely to be blocked as it's downstream of the primary filter.

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Hi PVB ! You are correct. It is the Fuel Pump which has the 'thimble' filter.

Like yourself, I thought it would not clog being downstream of the Primary. But it does, and the answer to my problems was chucking it out.

Despite having the stainless fuel tank steam cleaned it still clogged again. Perhaps my fuel lines could be a contributory factor due to their age.

No problems at all last season despite lots of motoring in Holland and across the North Sea.

I will take a good look at the fuel filter on the block in a few weeks time to see how it looks and report back.
 
Like yourself, I thought it would not clog being downstream of the Primary. But it does, and the answer to my problems was chucking it out.

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If your fuel pump filter is downstream from a primary filter and the screen is blocking then the primary filter is not connected up correctly. Most primary filters have four connections. Check you have connected up inlet and outlet correctly and not inlet to inlet or outlet to outlet which will short circuit the filter.

The other two connections will be plugged.
 
so with it out of gear ok ?
had you thought about the gearbox oil it has been very cold

cheers
mick
 
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You said it's a "Volvo 200and something", so I guess it's a 2001/2/3 series engine. I have a 2003, and there isn't a "thimble filter" in it. You'll find there's a coarse plastic filter inside the fuel pump (item 5 in this diagram), but it's highly unlikely to be blocked as it's downstream of the primary filter.

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Hi PVB ! You are correct. It is the Fuel Pump which has the 'thimble' filter.

Like yourself, I thought it would not clog being downstream of the Primary. But it does, and the answer to my problems was chucking it out.

Despite having the stainless fuel tank steam cleaned it still clogged again. Perhaps my fuel lines could be a contributory factor due to their age.

No problems at all last season despite lots of motoring in Holland and across the North Sea.

I will take a good look at the fuel filter on the block in a few weeks time to see how it looks and report back.

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Precisely and the engineer that cleaned BOTH my pumps for same reason reckoned the thimble filter is finer than the fuel filter before it.
I suggested leaving it out and he advised not to. His reasoning being that it's easier to take it out, clean it and put back than to dismantle / clean the pump internals which it is there to protect.
 
Different variations of fuel filter problems seem the more logical. But probably a good idea to check the exhaust too! Thanks again. Something to do this WE...
 
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You said it's a "Volvo 200and something", so I guess it's a 2001/2/3 series engine. I have a 2003, and there isn't a "thimble filter" in it. You'll find there's a coarse plastic filter inside the fuel pump (item 5 in this diagram), but it's highly unlikely to be blocked as it's downstream of the primary filter.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hi PVB ! You are correct. It is the Fuel Pump which has the 'thimble' filter.

Like yourself, I thought it would not clog being downstream of the Primary. But it does, and the answer to my problems was chucking it out.

Despite having the stainless fuel tank steam cleaned it still clogged again. Perhaps my fuel lines could be a contributory factor due to their age.

No problems at all last season despite lots of motoring in Holland and across the North Sea.

I will take a good look at the fuel filter on the block in a few weeks time to see how it looks and report back.

[/ QUOTE ]

Precisely and the engineer that cleaned BOTH my pumps for same reason reckoned the thimble filter is finer than the fuel filter before it.
I suggested leaving it out and he advised not to. His reasoning being that it's easier to take it out, clean it and put back than to dismantle / clean the pump internals which it is there to protect.

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Yes - good point about still using the thimble filter.

Before taking the thimble out I changed all the filters again. This time though, I
used a higher quality filter. I think it's a Delphi which had a finer filter honeycomb than the one's I had been using.

Interesting though that newer engines have a fixed unit that you cannot get into. Will have a good look at the filters when I change them in a month or two.
 
One possibility not previously mentioned is the engine stop control. On the VP 200X series if the stop control is pulled and not returned completely due to a stiff cable or something the engine will start but not pull or idle properly. This could happen intermittently in the way that you state.
 
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