Do PLBs ...save lives....regularly...? Or...?

[ducked]

At least if you go down while dinghy sailing you have saved £700, and can be buried with your dinghy.

If you dont mind going to landfill there seems no reason why you couldnt be buried with your Westerly Pageant, but it might cost a bit more than 295, or 700

 

[RogerJolly]

If you dont mind going to landfill there seems no reason why you couldnt be buried with your Westerly Pageant, but it might cost a bit more than 295, or 700

That would be great.

When the archaeologist dig you up in a few hundred years they’ll be marvelling at the Tupperware grave goods, so much more practical than that gold rubbish at Sutton Hoo.

 

[awol]

Yes! but if you are not declared "dead", is your estate is entitled to your pension, if you were of pension age when you went down? My other half could do with that, or if not her/my offspring can have a beer or two on me.
So instead of a PLB would not 5 lbs of lead ballast be better. Saves prolonging the agony & stops the body being found too soon- if at all- Batteries not required

You need to have signed a Power of Attorney to allow your relics to use all that pension. In Scotland an "enduring" PoA is useful but does require a degree of trust between the parties - having your house sold from under you could be inconvenient.

 

[boomerangben]

I’m slightly concerned there is a mix of beacon types here. The OP refers to a device that offers (as far as I understand) AIS and DSC coverage but no satellite capability (other than get a gps location). Much of the discussion here is PLB satellite stuff.

AIS and DSC rely on line of sight with rescuer so time to rescue has a significant level of variation but if you are heard and other boats are in the vicinity, this offers perhaps the quickest form of rescue. If there’s no line of sight………..

I know of an instance where a foreign national was injured whilst hiking in Scotland, used their PLB and were rescued within less than an hour. Most of that time was the transit time for the helicopter. So PLBs do work and can give rapid response.

Horses for courses

As for drowning vs hypothermia, it seems you don’t die of hypothermia, you drown because as hypothermia progresses you become unable to protect your airway and drown. Technicality I suppose but survival is the best policy

 

[ylop]

I’m slightly concerned there is a mix of beacon types here. The OP refers to a device that offers (as far as I understand) AIS and DSC coverage but no satellite capability (other than get a gps location). Much of the discussion here is PLB satellite stuff.

I *think* you've misread the OP

 

[Tippy2024]

That would be great.

When the archaeologist dig you up in a few hundred years they’ll be marvelling at the Tupperware grave goods, so much more practical than that gold rubbish at Sutton Hoo.

Thank yoo ! Thats a pleasant prospect... Sailing off into Eternity....with Sailing By in the background..?

 

[Tippy2024]

That would be great.

When the archaeologist dig you up in a few hundred years they’ll be marvelling at the Tupperware grave goods, so much more practical than that gold rubbish at Sutton Hoo.

My father sailed for half a century and never wore a lifejacket, except once in the Pentland Firth. He did use a harness and lifeline. He never fell in (that I know of) and his first boat had no guard rails.

Decades later my understanding is that safety begins with behaviour and extends into various forms of protection. Like the OP, I have some misgivings about using a PLB in anger but I judge its better to be surrounded by lifesaving bits of kit just in case. If you actually get a PLB and/or other location items then you're thinking seriously about adding to you and your crew's safety. You never know what incident or situation is going to befall you.

Better to have a good active safety culture afloat than to follow the old "if not duffers won't drown" approach.

Yes, i am moving towards the safety state of mind pov my thanks - your Dad sounded a pretty cool guy.

 

[Tippy2024]

During two yacht races and their return journeys (Sydney to Hobart and the less well known Melbourne to Hobart) in 2021 fourteen false alarms were generated by electronic items. These included PLBs and DSC. Two DSC alarms were initiated from the same boat by a crewman resting his foot on the radio and inadvertently pressing the hinged cover onto the DSC button. Two of the PLB alarms were investigated by the manufacturer, ACR, who subsequently altered the construction of their PLB to prevent pressure on the face of the unit causing activation. It is not clear how the other ten alarms were initiated.

It appears that the rescue authorities first tried raising the relevant vessels by radio to ascertain whether the alarms were false. Presumably the authorities also phoned the registered contacts of the PLB owners but that would not have helped them establish whether the alarm was false or real. Only one of the fourteen false alarms resulted in an aircraft overflying the yacht, which along with diverting other yachts to the scene, would be the main means of rescue given the absence of an equivalent to the RNLI. This would seem to indicate that the authorities do not immediately dispatch rescue assets on receiving an alarm.

The above information is based on a report which includes some interesting information. To find the report, search for "ORCV SIG Report Inadvertent Distress Beacon Activations"

To me - its not if one item works or not - its are you covering all potential ways to alert others to your predicament ?

I do not have PLB's / EPIRb ... but PLB's do cross my mind ... I admit that despite having been a prof ships officer etc - I rarely wear a LJ on my boat ...

BUT that does not mean I cannot see the sensible side of items.

Coastal - Offshore ... makes me think of : You can drown in a puddle. You don't need an ocean around you.

...i heard once someone say that with a lifejacket on they felt too safe.... LJ offs...more aware..? Could be bravado and a ploy to buy more Gin..?

 

[Tippy2024]

Mine is more of a smaller and cheaper substitute for a full-on EPIRB on the boat, than a body-worn thing. Seemed a good compromise for coastal pottering.

Picture it being used in similar circumstances to this Lyme Bay rescue.

Wouldn't be surprised if there wasn't many more false alarms than true ones though.

Be good to get some horses mouth information - you'd think someone from the RNLI would be across these forums.

I am getting sound advice, and also guidance on getting buried in my boat in landfill. But I agree having some RNLI input would be...interesting... thank you RogeringJolly

 

[Mark-1]

What do you define as guaranteed response time? Time from you activating the device to lifeboat crew paged?

I can't define it, and guaranteed is definitely the wrong word to use but when I tried to think of a better word when someone else picked me up on it and I couldn't.

I suspect we all have a feel for what I mean, though.

 

[ylop]

I can't define it, and guaranteed is definitely the wrong word to use but when I tried to think of a better word when someone else picked me up on it and I couldn't.

I suspect we all have a feel for what I mean, though.

The latest, most expensive, PLBs have a "return link service" which lets the ground station send an acknowledgement back to you to confirm it has received the distress alert. But that doesn't mean help is on its way - it just means the message has got to someone who is able to decide what help they can offer. The expectation is that you will get an RLS response within 30 minutes.

Marketing from the PLB manufacturers seems to suggest in may be more like 10-20 minutes: "Return Link Service or RLS enables newly approved EPIRB, PLB, and ELT allowing for a confirmation signal (Example: blue light flashing) or message if the beacon has a digital display that the distress signal from the beacon has been received and localized by the Cospas-Sarsat system and forwarded to government authorities for action. It does NOT mean that a rescue has yet been organized/launched, only that the distress alert has been received and routed to the appropriate government agencies. The RLS confirmation signal or message should typically be received back to the RLS beacon between 10-20 minutes as Search and Rescue is working to facilitate your rescue."

A VHF or 999 call will be faster. In the solent using a H/H DSC you could have been plucked out the water in that time.

 

[Mark-1]

A VHF or 999 call will be faster. In the solent using a H/H DSC you could have been plucked out the water in that time.

That's the conclusion I've long since drawn, and all the nonsense spouted about this topic hasn't convinced me otherwise. They're awkward to carry though, so I wish it wasn't so.

 

[William_H]

PLB in Oz is now promoted and in fact has saved lives of those bush walking or traveling in remote areas. ol'will

 

[Petertheking1982]

My two cents....if playing in local harbour / beach / bay then mobile in waterproof case (as long as you have reception!). If going out more than couple of miles and other traffic within line of sight then VHF. If venturing further offshore or remote areas (no other boats or coast vhf stations) then plb / epirb. For uk coastal cruising all 3 could be useful in different situations. For wearing on my person PLB is very convenient.

No mention yet of the newest mobile phones (apple and android) with satellite messaging capability? Only text messaging at the moment, but could be a game changer.

 

[RunAgroundHard]

... No mention yet of the newest mobile phones (apple and android) with satellite messaging capability? Only text messaging at the moment, but could be a game changer.

It is to a degree, not available everywhere. A service that most folks don't need to do anything to get on a compatible mobile, it is just there when out of cell range. While the emergency satellite messaging service might remain free, there will be an introduction of charging at some future point for additional functionality via satellite.

Like all things, learn how to use it before you need it. Bobbing about in the water is not the time to wonder what to do.

Use Emergency SOS via satellite on your iPhone – Apple Support (UK)
Android and iPhone satellite connectivity: What is it and what are your options right now?

Example Instructions for iPhone

Connect to Emergency SOS via satellite on your iPhone
If you need emergency services and you don’t have a cellular or Wi-Fi connection, you can use Emergency SOS via satellite.
Try calling 911 or emergency services. Even if your normal cellular carrier network isn’t available, iPhone will attempt to route the 911 call through other networks, if available.
If the call doesn’t go through, tap Emergency Text via Satellite to text emergency services. You can also go to the Messages app and text 911 or SOS, then tap Emergency Services.
Tap Report Emergency and follow the onscreen instructions.

 

[[70521]]

No mention yet of the newest mobile phones (apple and android) with satellite messaging capability? Only text messaging at the moment, but could be a game changer.

I wonder how those will work if you have a low Glasgow Score?

At least with my PLB3 it should automatically deploy when the lifejacket inflates.

 

[Petertheking1982]

At least with my PLB3 it should automatically deploy when the lifejacket ininflates.

That's great. I haven't seen a PLB epirb that auto deploys with life jacket inflation Do you have a link / brand I can look at so i can update my knowledge?

 

[[70521]]

That's great. I haven't seen a PLB epirb that auto deploys with life jacket inflation Do you have a link / brand I can look at so i can update my knowledge?

rescueME PLB3

 

[lustyd]

It might auto deploy but it’s very unlikely to be a completely hands off experience. The antenna will need to be raised above waves and the device probably removed from the lifejacket for proper positioning. AIS will probably work straight off but the PLB portion probably needs more care.

 

[[70521]]

It might auto deploy but it’s very unlikely to be a completely hands off experience. The antenna will need to be raised above waves and the device probably removed from the lifejacket for proper positioning. AIS will probably work straight off but the PLB portion probably needs more care.

May I suggest you look at the website, especially the videos, and come back with your thoughts about how the device works when correctly attached to a lifejacket.