Do I need a chartplotter

To my mind the big advantage of Paper Charts is the massive 40 inch screen size. No affordable electronic device on a small boat gives you that kind of convenience.
 
Mark-1 said:
To my mind the big advantage of Paper Charts is the massive 40 inch screen size. No affordable electronic device on a small boat gives you that kind of convenience.
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Although I agree with you, a rapid zoom function does a lot to mitigate the inadequacy of a plotter screen.
 
john_morris_uk said:
It certainly is better and I wouldn't be without it.

However the point I was making was that people get addicted to the accuracy and believe that the screen can't ever lie. Some then sail off to waters that aren't as well charted and start hitting things. "But the plotter said I was in clear water."
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If they're not as well charted, then the paper versions won't help either? It's all very well to know exactly where you are, but if there isn't an accurately mapped representation of "where you are" then you need to be careful, paper or plotter. In the 70s/80s the cry was "It wasn't on the chart!!!"

I would agree that plotters can be seen to lull people into a false sense of security, but innacurate or poor charts can do the same thing.

Every navigator needs to be aware of the shortcomings of their tools and have situational awareness, that has always been essential and if you are of that mindset then plotters are extremely useful and I prefer them over the manual alternative because I'm more fallible than a well programmed microprocessor which will complete repetitive tasks more quickly and more accurately than I ever will.

I personally don't think plotters or technology are a problem at all, it's humans that are the problem and how they choose to use (or mis-use) the tools at their disposal, not to mention whether they understand them or not.

I think the biggest criticism I would level at a plotter is the zoom level/detail issue. Not all hazards are visible at all zoom levels, so when passage planning on any plotter it is essential to zoom in and check the entire track at a zoom level which shows all chart details. My plotter will check this automatically when I set a waypoint and a track to the waypoint - but you have to trigger it by pressing the "GoTo" button. If there is any problem along the track it will go red (you can zoom in along the track to find where the problem is), if it's ok it will go green. In both cases, it will still export the track anyway, and the autopilot will follow it, even if it's flagged as red so a level of common sense is needed.

The most recent incident I can think of where this problem was the cause of a major incident was the Team Vestas Wind hitting a reef that was clearly charted, but not apparent at all zoom levels of the C-Map electronic charts they used - not to mention a number of other issues like the routing software not having depth alarms for the yacht track set, or displaying on the B&G multi-function display.
 
johnalison said:
Although I agree with you, a rapid zoom function does a lot to mitigate the inadequacy of a plotter screen.
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Yeah. Plus all those beautiful acres of lovely screen real estate are perhaps not within sight of the steering position, which will often make scrolling around an electronic chart the lesser ball-ache overall.
 
I didn't have one for years (using GPS and paper charts). A few years ago I installed Opencpn on a laptop to act as an AIS receiver and it was brilliant. Got fed up with carting the laptop back and forth also the space it takes up on the chart table and the power consumption. So now I have one of these mounted above the chart table.

http://www.pipo-store.com/pipo-x10-tv-box.html

With a 12V adapter to run off the boat batteries.

http://www.power4laptops.co.uk/p/pipo/x10/compatible+laptop+power+dc+adapter+car+charger+544519#.V8gFBTUUOgA

And I still have room for a paper chart on the table.
 
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If anyone feels I am hijacking this thread please tell me and I will go off elsewhere.

I too am a dinosaur and manage to find my way around the Caribbean on paper charts, a simple GPS and the mark one eyeball. In fact now most often just the eyeball as I tend to be in familiar territory and know which bit of the next island to aim for.

But I am planning to visit the South coast of Cuba and felt that a chart plotter might be a worthwhile investment. I had just about settled on just having one down below on the nav station and was going to use an existing laptop with OPENCPN or maybe buying a dedicated tablet again with OPENCPN. When along comes someone with this suggestion.

http://www.pipo-store.com/pipo-x10-tv-box.html

What is the benefit compared to a simple tablet like this.

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Vulcan-Electronics-Omega-VTA08900-with-WiFi-8.95-Touchscreen-Tablet-PC-Featuring-Windows-10-Operating-System/46664039

Are there any hidden 'gotchas' with OPENCPN?
 
Assuming of course that you already have paper charts, compass, sighting compass, tide tables etc, nobody "needs" chartplotters. But having been using one for a few months, it doesn't half make thing easy. .
 
Q: "Do I need a chartplotter"

A: "He who would keep himself busy let him equip these two things: A ship and a woman. For no two things involve more business once you start to fit them out, nor are these two things ever sufficiently adorned, nor is any excess of adornment enough for them." - Plautus (200 BC)
 
TQA said:
...

http://www.pipo-store.com/pipo-x10-tv-box.html

What is the benefit compared to a simple tablet like this.

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Vulcan-Electronics-Omega-VTA08900-with-WiFi-8.95-Touchscreen-Tablet-PC-Featuring-Windows-10-Operating-System/46664039

Are there any hidden 'gotchas' with OPENCPN?
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Main advantage of the Pipo tablet is the housing with lots of connectivity (3 USB ports, RJ45 port, HDMI port) which will be useful for some of the projects I have planned. Also a decent 10" screen. At the moment I have a mouse on one of the USB ports, chart stick on another and NMEA to USB adapter from the AIS transponder on the third. I find the mouse much easier than the touch screen.

Opencpn is great (especially for AIS) as long as you can get suitable charts. For USA I believe the government charts are available free. For UK and France I have a decent set of raster charts on a USB stick which cost me about £40. I don't know about Carribean charts but look on the Opencpn web site and see what you can find.
 
Baggywrinkle said:
If they're not as well charted, then the paper versions won't help either? It's all very well to know exactly where you are, but if there isn't an accurately mapped representation of "where you are" then you need to be careful, paper or plotter. In the 70s/80s the cry was "It wasn't on the chart!!!"

I would agree that plotters can be seen to lull people into a false sense of security, but innacurate or poor charts can do the same thing.

Every navigator needs to be aware of the shortcomings of their tools and have situational awareness, that has always been essential and if you are of that mindset then plotters are extremely useful and I prefer them over the manual alternative because I'm more fallible than a well programmed microprocessor which will complete repetitive tasks more quickly and more accurately than I ever will.

I personally don't think plotters or technology are a problem at all, it's humans that are the problem and how they choose to use (or mis-use) the tools at their disposal, not to mention whether they understand them or not.

I think the biggest criticism I would level at a plotter is the zoom level/detail issue. Not all hazards are visible at all zoom levels, so when passage planning on any plotter it is essential to zoom in and check the entire track at a zoom level which shows all chart details. My plotter will check this automatically when I set a waypoint and a track to the waypoint - but you have to trigger it by pressing the "GoTo" button. If there is any problem along the track it will go red (you can zoom in along the track to find where the problem is), if it's ok it will go green. In both cases, it will still export the track anyway, and the autopilot will follow it, even if it's flagged as red so a level of common sense is needed.

The most recent incident I can think of where this problem was the cause of a major incident was the Team Vestas Wind hitting a reef that was clearly charted, but not apparent at all zoom levels of the C-Map electronic charts they used - not to mention a number of other issues like the routing software not having depth alarms for the yacht track set, or displaying on the B&G multi-function display.
Click to expand...

We are not in disagreement. I do wonder if psychologically people are suckers for the digital read out. It's well known in lab work where a digital display is trusted absolutely as if it can't have any errors.
 
+1. I switch off everything but the log and the gps (I carry paper charts) when offshore as I don't have unlimited battery capacity. I admit to using something like this when approaching the coast and even day sailing in the Solent when I want to impress guests but on my own I can make do with the Roberts Tidal Chart of the IoW together with "local knowledge". The "local knowledge bit is currently being challenged by QHM's buggering about in the Portsmouth Harbour Approaches, but WTH!
 
john_morris_uk said:
We are not in disagreement. I do wonder if psychologically people are suckers for the digital read out. It's well known in lab work where a digital display is trusted absolutely as if it can't have any errors.
Click to expand...

We are in agreement. With paper charts the process of updating focused people on the age and therefore accuracy of charts, it was easy to see if they'd ever been updated. in the digital world people may well assume things are better than they actually are after experiencing auto-updates on apps and software.It is definitely a human trait to 'trust' authority in the form of printed material too though ..... I don't trust anyone, least of all myself.
 
Baggywrinkle said:
We are in agreement. With paper charts the process of updating focused people on the age and therefore accuracy of charts, it was easy to see if they'd ever been updated. in the digital world people may well assume things are better than they actually are after experiencing auto-updates on apps and software.It is definitely a human trait to 'trust' authority in the form of printed material too though ..... I don't trust anyone, least of all myself.
Click to expand...

Surely most plotter owners are aware that chart cartridges should be updated?
 
Baggywrinkle said:
Health Warning: Navigating with paper charts will probably be touted as perfectly adequate by some members of this forum, and the need for any kind of electronic aid questioned, for me however paper charts are the last resort after all 7 other Plotter and GPS capable devices on board have either failed or run out of power (You do need to be able to use paper though). I sailed with my parents in the 70s and 80s, navigating for my Mum (I was 10 at the time) when we took a week long sailing course on our boat. Paper charts, fixes taken from lighthouses, buoys and landmarks, constant referals to tide tables, almanacs and pilot book, we even had an RDF - I don't give a monkeys what anyone says, the opportunity for human error is ever-present .... and what a right royal pain in the a**e it was compared to what is available today, even if it was interesting - you'd either have to be mad or a masochist not to use modern technology IMHO.
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I agree entirely—modern technology is far better. I hear some people cross the Channel in little plastic boats with a metal stick in the middle and bits of flappy stuff—when the fast catamaran ferry does it in three hours with a well stocked bar and reclining seats in an air-conditioned lounge, why would you bother?

Humour aside, I find traditional nav to be rather enjoyable—if occasionally challenging—given that I spend enough time fiddling with electronics away from the boat. It could perhaps be argued that anyone indulging in a sport described by Ted Heath as "standing under a cold shower, tearing up five [make that fifty?] pound notes" has a touch of masochism or madness about them, but it's hardly any worse for paper charts! I carry a tablet with MX Mariner on it for occasional use when I require a second navigational opinion—it locates me to within a few metres at the touch of a button and plonks a little red boat on a beautifully non-creased chart—but on a couple of recent trips, after the charging socket had broken (now fixed it), I found the paper-based nav much more fulfilling anyway. I also carry a secondary GPS, which I have thus far not really required, and have GPS on my phone should it come down to that.

Much like sailing, paper-based traditional nav is not the most time-efficient way of doing things, nor the cheapest, nor that commercially used on modern ships—but it hasn't stopped me yet!
 
pvb said:
Surely most plotter owners are aware that chart cartridges should be updated?
Click to expand...

'Surely' aside, my Navionics charts running on a Raymarine system has a right old hissy fit if I don't update it monthly! :D
 
I've gathered an impression that navigating by a smart phone (as I do) is seen by some as unseamanlike and gets scowled upon by some even though for the sort sailing I do it's proved effective and reliable. I'll eventually get round to fitting the chartplotter as it just seems right, but not sure why.:)
 
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