DIY Copper antifoul

[PuffTheMagicDragon]

In the parallel thread to this one someone with ties to aquarius coatings states that the reason 'the others' failed in their attempts was because their epoxy was too impermeable to water.

I don't think the epoxy erodes so much as water gets in to it and the copper corrodes. When it does that the low strength epoxy allows the copper to become exposed.

So if the epoxy is, by inference, slightly permeable to water it can't be waterproof.

The way I think it works is this. There is a large percentage of included solids (copper)in the matrix (epoxy). This means that the amount of epoxy between adjacent copper particles is relatively thin. Thus, when the exposed copper is oxidised and eventually dissolves away, the surface that is left is composed of an epoxy matrix with very thin walls surrounding voids. It is thus very friable and will erode away with relative ease, especially with a flow of water over it. Think of a block of concrete with the aggregate removed.

This might also explain the improvement in performance after a couple of months' use in the sea and also after rubbing down lightly with wet-and-dry.

 

[Tim Good]

What happened to this thread! It seemed to be all warming up with a couple of parties promising results from tests and the OP to report back from his DIY patch up?

 

[autarh]

any news on this subject ?

 

[EwanClark]

Given that it's illegal to make your own unlicensed biocide and apply it your boat, maybe those that have braved the DIY route have decided it better to keep a low profile!

The current price for a half-litre (1.5kg) repair kit of genuine Coppercoat is £37.50 plus delivery and Vat.

 

[autarh]

Dear Ewan,
First- Stop bulling people on international forum's.
Second - Serbia are not EU/NATO/USA/UK member, your low do not apply on Serbian territory , so we can do it.
Third - relax bro... i am not planning to open CopperCoat2.com ... just wanted to paint my boat...

Also if we change process we are not even copying the "original"... In Serbia Cooper is used for last 1000 years as fungicide we call it blue-stone. Only trick is to find epoxy that likes water and i found something pretty similar in Serbia...

As i have heard the origin of coppercoat comes from some old sea wolf that has first try that in his marina, and then used it for friends and family .... After his death company emerges...

For anyone interesting here are the prices in Serbia :
1kg Cooper fine powder = 8 EUR (Mining and Smelting Basin Bor, if u bay small quantities)
I am still waiting for epoxy price, but concerning £37.50 as Ewan has offer there is no reason to import it from Serbia and make your own DIY project ...

Also i would probably buy your product , because i need small quantities (4-5kg) , but then i have to calculate custom tax and bunch of other papers because u do not have representative in Serbia ... Come here open company, manufacture it in Serbia, and i will be the first that will support u ...

So again , any news and experience on this from anyone ?

 

[Tranona]

No need to knock Ewan just because he posts in reference to the European environment rather than Serbia! Doubt anybody in the marine trade sees Serbia as a viable market, so your DIY activities have little relevance to any one outside your country.

 

[PuffTheMagicDragon]

So, could someone explain how it is illegal for me to mix my own paint, for my own use, from readily available ingredients and apply that mixture on my own boat?
Chapter & Verse, if you don't mind.

 

[autarh]

No need to knock Ewan just because he posts in reference to the European environment rather than Serbia! Doubt anybody in the marine trade sees Serbia as a viable market, so your DIY activities have little relevance to any one outside your country.

If this is only EU forum than OK, i was wrong, and i am sorry , u should post that so anybody can read, ... i was under influence that .COM is international tld... If it is not EU forum , than it is not polite to push EU lows...

My objection to Ewan is only for that , i said i would buy his product but there is no official way to do that ... So what should i do? Put HEMPEL hard racing or mix may own "CooperCoat Serbian Edition - 3kilos Copper on 1kilos epoxy" : )... i really do not have options here...

Serbia is not big in marine trade when u look on first sight i agree on that. But if u consider sanction that Russia implement on EU member state , and put in equation that Serbia CAN export to Russia, and that we and Russians have 1 % tax policy on almost everything (no other custom tax)... than i guess it gets interesting ? Right ? Right.

I am in marine industry of serbia for a long time...

@PuffTheMagicDragon
it is completely legal in this case... only problem is biocide issue, but we in Serbia do not have that issue, after EU/NATO bomb us on 1999 with radioactive uranium bomb, there is nothing "biocide" that can fu*k as after that ...

 

[macd]

...after EU/NATO bomb us on 1999 with radioactive uranium bomb, there is nothing "biocide" that can fu*k as after that ...

If anyone's startled by that last allegation, there's plenty on t'interweb about it. Much, inevitably, comes from local sources and reflects local feelings. This comes from the US of A:
http://www.nytimes.com/2001/01/07/w...kan-bombing-alarms-europe.html?pagewanted=all

Autarh: no, it's not an EU forum. In fact, after June it may not even emanate from an EU country
The forum's is, however, hosted by a UK-based (but American-owned) magazine. The majority of its posters probably originate from the UK, so the tendency is naturally to focus on events and issues from that part of the world. But you're right: the web is global.

 

[RichardS]

I am in marine industry of serbia for a long time...

Wecome to the forum Autarh ...... but please try to be a bit less aggressive towards Ewan. He has proven to be a helpful voice on the forum.

I sail in the Adriatic and am reasonably familiar with the countries bordering it but I am intrigued by the marine industry of Serbia. I was not aware that Serbia had any marine coastline on the Adriatic so I'm interested in where you sail from?

Richard

 

[KevB]

any news on this subject ?

What you are thinking of trying has been tried many times by people on this forum and it doesn't work. Do a search for copper and tcm and look back to about 2002 till present.
Get the proper stuff.

 

[Nicholas123]

What you are thinking of trying has been tried many times by people on this forum and it doesn't work. Do a search for copper and tcm and look back to about 2002 till present.
Get the proper stuff.

It is hard to imagine that the owners of copper coat have some sort of unique magical formula & nothing else will work even supposing that you think it works in the first place & there seems to be some doubts about that,given what I have read on here.Why try to stifle the debate & limit initiative when others may well have an alternative? Dos'nt seem reasonable to me.
Maybe even look up at the title of the thread

 

[Nicholas123]

So, could someone explain how it is illegal for me to mix my own paint, for my own use, from readily available ingredients and apply that mixture on my own boat?
Chapter & Verse, if you don't mind.

:encouragement:

 

[autarh]

Ewan please accept my apologies!


This is completely off topic... but i know it is strange to u, so let me explain
@RichardS
Serbian coast line changes every couple of decades... it does not depend on tides, it depends on politics.. Let we see just last 100 years
1916-1920- whole Montenegro and part of Albani (kingdom of Serbia)
1921-1941-From Trieste Italy to Drac Albania (kingdom of Serbs, Croats, Slovenina)
1941-1945-No Coast line
1945-1991-From Trieste Italy to River Bojana (Albanian Border)
1991-1994-From Split Croatia to River Bojana (Albanian Border)
1995-2005- From Prevlaka Croatia to River Bojana (Albanina Border)
2005-present-No Coast line

Whenever Germany is strong we do not have access to the sea : D

As u can see we currently do not have coast line , but that will surely change in one moment. I am sailing on river Danube when i am at home (last year i have sailed from Belgrade to Black Sea 1164 km, on river we mark in KM ), or in Greece where i spend my summers with family ( Sporades ).

"marine industry of serbia" that is little bit strong statement... Serbia did have a great maritime industries up to 1991 but now after 5 wars we do not owe any kind of industry : ( , we mainly produce river boats for personal use, and couple of shipyards produce 100m+ river cruise boats for foreign partner's... But because of our connection (russia and asia ) lot of big maritime companies have some kind of offices or representative in Serbia... (re-export with 1% customs tax)..

how big our industry was please check this link :

http://magazines.marinelink.com/Mag...content/competitive-yugoslav-shipyards-200585
quote:
"The Yugoslav shipbuilding industry has maintained its third place position in the world market, behind Japan and South Korea, for three consecutive years."

that is past.. so let we see tha future, can anybody says any experience with DIY coppercoat ?

 

[autarh]

It is hard to imagine that the owners of copper coat have some sort of unique magical formula & nothing else will work even supposing that you think it works in the first place & there seems to be some doubts about that,given what I have read on here.Why try to stifle the debate & limit initiative when others may well have an alternative? Dos'nt seem reasonable to me.
Maybe even look up at the title of the thread

Only trick is in Epoxy it should be "washable" (sorry on my bad english, i can not find proper word) ... i have talked with some folks from industry ... i have found and order a quantity of similar epoxy and will do a kell on my boat for test ... (sea trials)
also i will try to put it one of the worse place in Belgrade just for test (after one year u get a 30 cm "Beard" under boat) one plate with copper coat... (river trials)

 

[RichardS]

This is completely off topic... but i know it is strange to u, so let me explain
@RichardS
Serbian coast line changes every couple of decades... it does not depend on tides, it depends on politics.. Let we see just last 100 years
1916-1920- whole Montenegro and part of Albani (kingdom of Serbia)
1921-1941-From Trieste Italy to Drac Albania (kingdom of Serbs, Croats, Slovenina)
1941-1945-No Coast line
1945-1991-From Trieste Italy to River Bojana (Albanian Border)
1991-1994-From Split Croatia to River Bojana (Albanian Border)
1995-2005- From Prevlaka Croatia to River Bojana (Albanina Border)
2005-present-No Coast line

Very interesting .... thank you.

Richard

 

[Nicholas123]

Only trick is in Epoxy it should be "washable" (sorry on my bad english, i can not find proper word) ... i have talked with some folks from industry ... i have found and order a quantity of similar epoxy and will do a kell on my boat for test ... (sea trials)
also i will try to put it one of the worse place in Belgrade just for test (after one year u get a 30 cm "Beard" under boat) one plate with copper coat... (river trials)

The word you are looking for is soluble.

Since the original poster talks about getting 500g of copper powder for under £10 why would the binding agent need to be epoxy with all the pre surface treatment necessary? I would have thought a decent paint substitute could be found similar to ordinary anti fouling & it would'nt be hard to improve on 70 quid a tin,you could even throw in a few other ingredients to help the anti foul along :encouragement:

PS: I have already discovered a "home made" remedy for prop anti foul that I am very pleased with.