Dismasted in force 3

[benlui]

Yes, its true, must have been something very wrong with the starboard side stay. Lost the entire rig,sails etc. It was heart wrenching watching them sink into 30m of water after i cut the last line. It happened in West Cork, between Cape Clear and the Calves Islands. Lucky neither of us or our 4 leg sea pall were hurt apart from some cuts etc. Its our first season sailing, already we have had to buy a new engine, and 6 weeks later the rig is all gone but hopefully the insurer will pay for this. Can anyone recommend anybody in the south of Ireland that would replace the rig and sails? I cant help but think after seeing the tangled wreckage how easily this could kill someone if they were in the wrong place on deck at the wrong time! Scary stuff. Worst thing is,, thats it for us now until next season as i don't think anyone will have her ready in time for some sailing before the end of the season grrrrrr
P.S We Just want to thank yacht Yola and the schull to cape clear ferry for standing by and all their assistance it was much appreciated and sure gave us a feeling of being safe.

 

[Bilgediver]

Pleased to hear that no one was hurt during the dismasting and clearing however it is an alarming incident and hopefully the first and last you will experience.

What boat do you sail and do you know which item failed.

sometimes Wire becomes fatigued especially at the entry point to swaged fittings and som types of ball swaged fittings were prone to failure. Another recurring problem is that of roller furling gear opening the lay of the forstay at the top of the mast.

 

[benlui]

Its a Shipman 28, and we are sure it was the starboard side stay connection point to the top of the mast that failed, as this is the only part of the rig we didn't need to cut away. It was amazing too how fast this happened, no warning at all. I'm glad that i had read a lot about this situation over the past several months (just in case) and we were able to free ourselves within 20min even with a blunt bolt cutters. Lesson learned, always have a good bolt cutters on board, as time is everything when you are nearing the rocky shore under drift!! I have some pics of the situation, but am unable to upload them to this site?

 

[tangomoon]

Glad no-one hurt

Pics would be interesting

Join photobucket - put on there - simple - copy img code on photobucket (bit further down from image)

Post on here - paste img code in - there's the pic!

BOL

 

[SpaceCygnet]

I'm based in Dublin and had the rigging on my boat replaced by Irish-Spars last year. They did an excellent job, I would have no hesitation in recommening. They also supply sails as an agency for Kemp Sails.

http://www.irish-spars.com/index.asp

 

[ebbtide]

We had similar in 1988 off the Hamble - gentle breeze, no warning. The boat, a bilge keel Fulmar, had been stored ashore with the rig up though the storm of '87.
Now there's a lesson to be learned . . .

 

[JasB]

Not what you want on your first season, or any season for that matter. Just posting to say good luck with the repairs, and you should feel proud that you were competant enough to handle the situation as you did.

 

[pappaecho]

Bit worrying. Usually the rig is fault tolerant, so if one shroud goes, the rest hold the whole lot up while you get the sails down. I have lost a spreader and the shrouds below it kept the mast up - 20 years ago, and more recently lost the bow chainplate, so completely lost forestay. Again forward shrouds held up mast long enough to get boat downwind. I have now added a second forestay with separate chainplate.

On balance I think you had bad luck!

 

[gcostell]

Would recommend Irish Spars too

 

[lw395]

I'm not sure it's 'usual' for the rig to tolerate loss of a shroud. I suppose some will, some won't, some it depends on circumstances. Luckily its very rare and I hope the op's insurer treats him ok. I'm surprised a mast survived loss of forestay, what happened exactly?

 

[Sailfree]

Sorry to hear your bad news and hope you soon get it sorted OK

There have been a few on here recently considering buying their first boat and asking advice.

This type of post always brings out peoples prejudices comparing newer cheaper AWB's to older "quality" boats etc.

After your experience of 1st season sailing would you do anything differently if you were starting again?

Sorry if the question touches on a raw spot but the best advice from anyone is always based on personal experience and sometimes this has to include bad experiences!

 

[ebbtide]

And I'd like to know if the rig had been completely replaced in a 10-year cycle - isn't that what insurers require?

 

[Dyflin]

Bad luck benlui.

Try http://www.masts-rigging-ireland.ie/ they are based in Crosshaven

For sails, in the same place (and very well spoken of) McWilliams;

McWilliam, Crosshaven, Co Cork, Ireland.
Phone : +353 (0)21 4831505/4 Fax: +353 (0)21 4831700 E-mail: info@mcwsails.ie

 

[bobdoughty]

Terrible bad luck; it's also my first season back on the water and I've been very conservative about what wind I go out in until I get the mast down this autumn but Force 3...! Good luck with the repairs.

And to Iw395, you can survive the loss of the forestay... just. I was crew on a 35' cat when the bowsprit and a lump of deck ripped right out (OK, we were probably a tad overpowered at the time) but quick thinking by the skipper, a fast jibe followed by letting the mainsheet go and 10 scary minutes on the foredeck and some jury rigging saved the day much to the surprise of both of us. It was only the we found out we'd fouled the prop on a fish trap...

 

[benlui]

I have checked out those sites and spoke to people there who are going to quote for same. Thanks for the comments guys, ill be sure to let ye know how i get on

 

[l'escargot]

[ QUOTE ]
And I'd like to know if the rig had been completely replaced in a 10-year cycle - isn't that what insurers require?

[/ QUOTE ]
Neither of the insurers I have been with have required that.

 

[lw395]

I agree you can survive the loss of forestay, but I wouldn't expect to. In fact I've seen a Contender dinghy survive the forestay pulling its attachment out of the foredeck without a capsize! (The boom is so low it just sat on the aft deck, helm still out on the wire!).
Even if the rig stays up it may be damaged as the loads which broke the forestay go else where. My point was I don't think many rigs are designed with redundant stays, any major stay failure may cause mast failure on most production boats imho.
Forestay failure of a deck stepped rig is probably among the more benign, as the mast will probably lose all preload as it falls back and may be held up by sails, or fall over undamaged as happened to a friend of mine. Probably lucky he didn't have a babyforestay, it may have folded the mast in half.
I reckon prevention is better than survival in this instance.

 

[Gwil]

A simple 10yr replacement rule is just too crude- compare a conservatively specified twin spreader four lowers cutter headed rig with Sta-lok or similar terminals (no lower swages to fill up with salt water...), with a bendy light race orientated heavily loaded example.
As a surveyor I have to look at the rig's history, type of terminal, signs of overstrained ancillary fittings, in short a whole list of variables. Ultimately stainless wire can part with no warning-but almost always at a terminal. So often a careful examination aloft at the beginning of every season and keeping the rig well tuned to avoid shock loads will prevent many failures.

 

[William_H]

So sorry to hear about your rig loss. I have survived I think 5 mast losses over many years. Fortunately always able to retrieve the rig to the deck rather than cut free. And on smaller boats.

This is yet another example of SS wire just letting go. I am more convinced than ever that the 10 year rule is the best for SS wire. Particularly for the side stays. Both intermediate and cap shrouds are critical. Failure of one leads to failure of the mast. It either folds over (cap shroud fails) or crumples intermediate fails) I consider the forestay less critical as the jib halyard will provide some back up and the back stay less critical with mainsheet providing back up.

Yours will add to my knowledge of another 4 similar cases at my club in each case the wire was over 25 years old. I don't believe inspection is of any use in checking condition of the wire.

I havn't personally lost a mast from wire failure. Just spreader base falure, bad mast design and more lately contact with posts. (to explain 5 failures)

Fortunately it is always the windward stays that let go and the mast goes to leeward. So if crew are on the windward gunwhale no worries. There is nothing quite so dismaying as seeing the rig lay in the water.

Sailing is all about crisis management and so apparently you coped well. good luck (at least better than you have had) olewill

 

[benlui]

So sorry to hear about your rig loss. I have survived I think 5 mast losses over many years. Fortunately always able to retrieve the rig to the deck rather than cut free. And on smaller boats.

I'm amazed this has happened you so many times! I hope this is not all in front of me grrrrr. I hope this was the first and the last time, dough reading all the comments on here I will make sure my rig is checked on a very very regular basis! I think the s/s stays are far less than 10 years old, but not 100% and am waiting for the prev owner to confirm. Thanks guys