Disabled access to an unmodified AWB

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CalmSkipper

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Hi

Does anyone have experience or better still tips, for sailing a person with MS or similar condition, totally able in every other way but no use of their legs, on a 36ft AWB? Obvious issues to overcome are;
- how to get on and off
- how to get down below/manouvre down below

The person has an extremely positive attitude to life. I'd love to find a way of helping if possible
 
For getting on and off, you can rig a tackle under the boom and use a lifting sling like this.

Not sure about getting down the companionway or moving about below. Obviously no room for a wheelchair and if they have no use of the legs at all it will probably mean two hefty helpers.

When sitting in the cockpit they will probably need something to stop them tipping sideways or forwards. We take people with that sort of problem on a drascombe and we have plastic helm seats with arms lashed to the side seats to give support.
 
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I've experience with a friend who can't get over the guardrails or even through the granny gate (he has injuries from a few serious accidents combined with quite a lot of excess weight). Fortunately I can get him on board via the stern.

I haven't had to resort to a gangplank/passarelle yet, but I do have to get the boat very close in (to the exent of removing any fender on the stern and hauling her back a bit to close the gap to a few inches).
 
Kevan - I sail with a wife who has MS. She can just about use her legs for standing but not for long and not for all purposes. I have a 31 ft sailing yacht which I keep on a swinging mooring.
Quite what suits your situation is something that I cannot tell you but what I can do is describe some of the efforts we make in the hope that that will give you some ideas.

On each side of my boat I can break the lifelines - they have pelican-type clips for attachment- between 2 stanchions by the shrouds. I think it is important to have a wider opening in life lines than you might get with a conventional "gate". I open the lifelines on the appropriate side.

Unless she is going to use the sailing club launch (which is high-sided) I next put down a boarding ladder which is angled outward from the hull. The ladder should be rigid and not the rope kind. The steps of the ladder are just manageable by my wife whereas she could not lift herself up from the bottom of a dinghy because of the height of the topsides of my boat. The top step is just below the top of my gunwale.

Her strength in her upper body compensates for the lack of strength in her legs. I would imagine that the person you are talking about is similar. She uses that strength to grab the side of the boat, heave herself up onto the steps, and then to hold onto the shrouds in order to lever herself onto the side deck. If her legs are totally useless (which does happen form time to time) she twists around to put her bottom on the side deck with her legs dangling over the side. She then lifts her legs onto the side deck. (That is why it is useful to have a wide opening of the lifelines).

Once on the side deck she either shuffles along it or manoeuvres herself onto the coachroof and then shuffles along that towards the cockpit. Neither is particularly elegant but who cares!

Entry to the cockpit from the side deck on my boat is bit of a mission and often my wife needs help to disentangle her feet from ropes or move her legs for her. Once in the cockpit she can move around easily.

Likewise downstairs in the cabins. There are plenty of handholds and bottom perches to use particularly at a low level. You mention a 36 ft boat which is slightly bigger than mine but I would imagine it also has plenty which can be used.

The biggest problem we have found is going from cockpit down the companionway and vice versa. Fortunately on my boat the first step inside is big, deep and wide (it is part of the cover for my engine). So my wife manoeuvres herself on her bottom from one of the cockpit seats and sits on this whilst she sorts out her legs. She then just drops down into the cabin.

Her wheelchair can dismantle to some extent so we put the small bits onto a quarterberth and the frame is tied onto the coachroof.

When she goes swimming (which she likes to do as often as possible) I use the boarding ladder and rig a block and tackle to lift her out if she can't come up the ladder. It is important that the ladder should go as deep as possible into the water and be well angled out so that it is easier to climb up.

Quite how long we can continue sailing together remains to be seen but for the moment it works. We have just returned from a 6 week cruise in the Netherlands where we had no problems at all.

I hope this helps. A positive mental attitude is all important. With that anything is possible.
Michael Minnitt
 
The only answer is to suck it and see. Whenm I temporarilly lost the use of one leg ( road accident) I found that I could still clamber onto my boat from the pontoon and thence into the cockpit. But going down below was impossible. Steps too steep.

Wheelchair was no problem - most of them fold up anyway.

Dont forget the safety issue should you have problems at sea. I very much doubt if your passenger would be covered by your insurance.
 
Thank you for all the suggestions. Some great advice and ideas here and as pointed out it's probably a case of 'suck it and see'
 
We've seen several Cats converted for wheelchair or other use, very effectively.
Also, didn't the services crew a boat with the ARC a couple of years back, in which every crew member had at least one limb missing? They might have a few good ideas. One more thing, the guy who owns/owned Snow and Rock, Geoff I think his name is, built a boat to sail the world in (Think he lost the use of his legs following a ski accident) He was very active in the 2.4 race fleet at Queen Mary Sail Club and nationaly (also a great boat for budding yacht sailors - very technical, close to the water and with many being converted to hand only operation). Give em a call, they are part of the sailability group mentioned above. You could then compete with each other......

Whatever happens, Good luck and keep trying. Living life to the maximum is a lesson many people, without those challenge to cope with, would be well pressed to learn.
 
Foxy said:
One more thing, the guy who owns/owned Snow and Rock, Geoff I think his name is, built a boat to sail the world in (Think he lost the use of his legs following a ski accident)
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Geoff Holt

His house (well, one of them, anyway) is just downriver from our mooring, and his cat is moored at the bottom of the garden. Impressive looking thing, but it's not exactly an "unmodified AWB" :)

I think he lost the use of his legs as a result of a diving accident, rather than ski-ing but I take my hat off to him for what he has achieved, however he came to be confined to a wheelchair.

(Edit: Correction: I think the boat belongs to someone else - a guy called Mike Brown, who is also wheelchair bound - and it may be his house on the river as well, but it's definitely the boat Geoff Holt is going to use, 'cos it's got his name plastered down the side :)).
 
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Kevan said:
Hi

Does anyone have experience or better still tips, for sailing a person with MS or similar condition, totally able in every other way but no use of their legs, on a 36ft AWB? Obvious issues to overcome are;
- how to get on and off
- how to get down below/manouvre down below

The person has an extremely positive attitude to life. I'd love to find a way of helping if possible
Click to expand...

Under the DDA ( Disability Discrimination Act )you marina has an obligation to provide a hoist otherwise the person is being discriminated against ;)
 
snowleopard said:
Have you thought about contacting RYA Sailability?
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I was more than a little disappointed when I contacted them with a similar problem and got what amounted to a brush off. They seemed keen to encourage dinghy-type activities but had little or no interest in bigger craft.
 
disabled sailors & partners

Totally agree with the comments about the RYA, total and utter waste of time (RYA sailabilty total con) they are not interested, my wife got the brush off from them 2 years ago over disabled sailing. Regarding the DDA act unless you can find a solicitor to act for you forget it, they are not interested.we have been battling discrimination for over 2 years with a certain harbour commission and yacht club on the east coast not too far away from Colchester. The Harbour commission even banned my wife from using their pontoon/jetty in her electric wheelchair, insisting that she transfer to a manual one pushed by someone unknown!!! I was told to get my wifes wheelchair off the yacht clubs jetty and that cripples should not go sailing. I have had my yacht damaged to the tune of £6000, urinated and deficated in the cockpit,by persons unknown, rubish burnt in the cockpit. My yacht moved and left within inches of another vessel causing damage. Even to the point of being yelled at to my face "we don't want your kind of scum here".
Thats want you get on the East coast if you have someone disabled with you.
Cannot names names or places as it is all in the hands of the legal people but it just drags on & on NOBODY is really interested they just make noises
 
sail045 said:
Totally agree with the comments about the RYA, total and utter waste of time (RYA sailabilty total con) they are not interested, my wife got the brush off from them 2 years ago over disabled sailing. Regarding the DDA act unless you can find a solicitor to act for you forget it, they are not interested.we have been battling discrimination for over 2 years with a certain harbour commission and yacht club on the east coast not too far away from Colchester. The Harbour commission even banned my wife from using their pontoon/jetty in her electric wheelchair, insisting that she transfer to a manual one pushed by someone unknown!!! I was told to get my wifes wheelchair off the yacht clubs jetty and that cripples should not go sailing. I have had my yacht damaged to the tune of £6000, urinated and deficated in the cockpit,by persons unknown, rubish burnt in the cockpit. My yacht moved and left within inches of another vessel causing damage. Even to the point of being yelled at to my face "we don't want your kind of scum here".
Thats want you get on the East coast if you have someone disabled with you.
Cannot names names or places as it is all in the hands of the legal people but it just drags on & on NOBODY is really interested they just make noises
Click to expand...

Brittlesea then
 
sail045 said:
Totally agree with the comments about the RYA, total and utter waste of time (RYA sailabilty total con) they are not interested, my wife got the brush off from them 2 years ago over disabled sailing. Regarding the DDA act unless you can find a solicitor to act for you forget it, they are not interested.we have been battling discrimination for over 2 years with a certain harbour commission and yacht club on the east coast not too far away from Colchester. The Harbour commission even banned my wife from using their pontoon/jetty in her electric wheelchair, insisting that she transfer to a manual one pushed by someone unknown!!! I was told to get my wifes wheelchair off the yacht clubs jetty and that cripples should not go sailing. I have had my yacht damaged to the tune of £6000, urinated and deficated in the cockpit,by persons unknown, rubish burnt in the cockpit. My yacht moved and left within inches of another vessel causing damage. Even to the point of being yelled at to my face "we don't want your kind of scum here".
Thats want you get on the East coast if you have someone disabled with you.
Cannot names names or places as it is all in the hands of the legal people but it just drags on & on NOBODY is really interested they just make noises
Click to expand...



Don't disbelieve ... if true - that is disgusting and deserves everything you can throw at it ...
 
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