Dingho wings

Greenheart

Greenheart

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I stepped gingerly onto the Osprey's gunwale in the trapeze harness for the first time during a gentle breeze last October, and realised what should have been obvious - that trapezing isn't actually a terrifying dice-with-death, it's only a more effective, exaggerated way of hiking.

The advantage is so undramatic, I'm aware that the old ineradicable problem of not having enough ballast to keep her upright, will show its face again.

Certainly the trapeze will help. If my 150lbs is almost exclusively to windward of the gunwale, it'll be more effective than the same ballast sitting on the sidedeck. But, maybe I can further increase the leverage of my limited weight, by widening the sidedecks?

The Flying Dutchman appears to have done this, very elegantly...I can't think of another reason why the gunwales bulge slightly...

FD%20sidedecks_zpsptdpb7ii.jpg


...I hadn't planned to be so discreet about it...just a smooth hinged piece of ply which could flip out, to shift my weight another foot to windward...

...while the leeward board flips back in, rather than dragging in the water as the boat heels. Obviously they'd want to lock in position; they might even be linked so that the leeward board flips up when the windward one is pushed out. :) The idea may also owe something to my liking for varnished ply.

Considering the extremity of the wings and racks that seem effective in popular classes, is this a workable idea, or terrible?

Boss_zps60ds6iiv.jpg


Please, don't bother to mention the 'benefits' of pie-eating, or female ballast, alluring though both may be.

Female%20ballast_zps7tuthp9g.jpg
 
Thanks. I enjoy pictures of good-looking dinghies. I suppose it depends on what the class rules say. What about platform shoes?
 
Uffa Fox had a "sliding seat" before the trapeze was invented, a sort of plank which was run out to windward for him to sit on the end of. Sounds like you're heading the same way except combining the two techniques by trapezing off the end of the "seat".

I'm not entirely certain how his worked, but I believe it was one board that slid from side to side. Maybe you could consider a similar design - it will probably be easier to lock in place than something that hinges on the gunwale. I can't immediately see a way to do that and prevent the outboard end flicking upwards and the whole thing folding underneath you as you plummet inboard - except for a species of futtock shroud running down into the water which is hardly elegant.

Pete
 
I never quite understood why water-jackets aren't a good way of increasing crew-weight.

I would have supposed that as long as the additional weight rests at the end of the trapeze wire, the wearer's spine and musculature needn't suffer much.

I'm not going to test it though - although an old-fashioned diver's helmet might help prepare for a serious dunking. :confused:
 
prv said:
Uffa Fox had a "sliding seat" before the trapeze was invented, a sort of plank which was run out to windward for him to sit on the end of. Sounds like you're heading the same way except combining the two techniques by trapezing off the end of the "seat".

I'm not entirely certain how his worked, but I believe it was one board that slid from side to side. Maybe you could consider a similar design - it will probably be easier to lock in place than something that hinges on the gunwale. I can't immediately see a way to do that and prevent the outboard end flicking upwards and the whole thing folding underneath you as you plummet inboard - except for a species of futtock shroud running down into the water which is hardly elegant.

Pete
Click to expand...

Take a look at the International Canoe.... http://www.ullmansails.co.uk/dinghies-intcanoe.htm
 
prv said:
Uffa Fox had a "sliding seat" before the trapeze was invented, a sort of plank which was run out to windward for him to sit on the end of. Sounds like you're heading the same way except combining the two techniques by trapezing off the end of the "seat".
Click to expand...

I don't know about Uffa Fox, but I briefly sailed a Hornet in the 1970s which had such a seat. It was curved to give far-end freeboard to cope with some heel.

The other thing I remember about it was it had a self-bailer which we left open because we were having such a good time and shipped some water. And then forgot to close it when we came back to the dock...

Mike.
 
DJE said:
Or just lash a bit of aluminium ladder across the boat.
Click to expand...

That's the sort of simple answer which I think development classes benefit from.

The Osprey's cockpit is quite deep, and I excuse some of my timidity regarding the trapeze, with the defence that it is a considerable rearward climb out of the cockpit onto the gunwale (with hands already filled with tiller and sheets) compared with flattish designs like the Contender whose helm was always intended to spend much of the time on the wire.

So a structure based on the cockpit floor, which allows a midway step en route to the gunwale, would make for a smoother arrival at trapezing stance.

The ladder idea had crossed my mind; but it struck me that a light ply backing behind the rungs would prevent horrid consequences if I missed my step.
 
The Unicorn catamaran i used to sail in the 70's was designed around a sliding seat - a much simpler system than the Hornet. But they all soon migrated to trapezes.

BTW Dan, I really hope you don't " step gingerly onto the gunwhale" to go out on your trapeze. If you do, no wonder you are looking for alternatives. You sit on the sidedeck, clip on and slide out, letting the trapeze take the weight as your bum goes over the edge.
 
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davidej said:
The Unicorn catamaran i used to sail in the 70's was designed around a sliding seat - a much simpler system than the Hornet. But they all soon migrated to trapezes.

BTW Dan, I really hope you don't " step gingerly onto the gunwhale" to go out on your trapeze. If you do, no wonder you are looking for alternatives. You sit on the sidedeck, clip on and slide out, letting the trapeze take the weight as your bum goes over the edge.
Click to expand...

Kinda like this:
https://www.sail-world.com/photo/191873
 
dancrane said:
I never quite understood why water-jackets aren't a good way of increasing crew-weight.

I would have supposed that as long as the additional weight rests at the end of the trapeze wire, the wearer's spine and musculature needn't suffer much.

I'm not going to test it though - although an old-fashioned diver's helmet might help prepare for a serious dunking. :confused:
Click to expand...

In days of old, a recognized technique for dinghy sailors in heavy weather was to wear a thick woolly pullover and "accidentally" go in the water. The additional weight made quite a difference, I am told! However, I never tried it - didn't race, and preferred to stay dry! And, I am pleased to say, I have never capsized a dinghy.
 
AntarcticPilot said:
And, I am pleased to say, I have never capsized a dinghy.
Click to expand...

Having had a dinghy with twin trapeze and wings (Topper ISO) and trapezed on various other boats, if you've never capsized then you may not have been trying hard enough:encouragement: It's not remotely easy keeping a dinghy upright in much over 20Kts - with gusts on top. If half the fleet gives up, then those left have the incentive to go for it . That often includes being knocked over in gusts and / or at the gybe mark. :)
 
Thanks Pagoda...but I'm not brave, nor ashamed of being slow. I just like seeing the boat performing at her best in the light conditions I enjoy.

"Gingerly" was the way I did it, because it was my first time. I'd never even tried trapezing with somebody else on the helm. So I was wary.

I did try hooking on once previously, with the adjuster-tackle too short, so my backside was elevated well above the side-deck and I felt at once more like a wayward pendulum than a person in control of the boat. It was made worse by the old, (still almost universally popular) steel ring/harness hook, which weren't very easily detached.

After that, I bought the Keyball system from Allen Brothers. It doesn't use a hook and seems extremely simple to use. I immediately lost my stark terror of everything that might go wrong while trapezing.

Allen%20Keyball_zps228ju5gq.jpg


But I still have it all to learn.

I'm thinking that the subtle broadening of the Flying Dutchman's gunwale probably indicates that getting even a few inches further off the centreline, is really beneficial. Perhaps I can make a rather more discreet pair of mini-wings...as long as they don't contribute to capsizing when the leeward one digs in. :rolleyes:
 
pagoda said:
Having had a dinghy with twin trapeze and wings (Topper ISO) and trapezed on various other boats, if you've never capsized then you may not have been trying hard enough:encouragement: It's not remotely easy keeping a dinghy upright in much over 20Kts - with gusts on top. If half the fleet gives up, then those left have the incentive to go for it . That often includes being knocked over in gusts and / or at the gybe mark. :)
Click to expand...
I don't race, so I've never been pushing a dinghy to the limits. As far as I'm concerned, if I capsize, I've done it wrong! Further, I last sailed dinghies on a regular basis back in the 60s, and in those days capsizing was a much more serious affair than it is now - wet suits etc. were not a regular piece of equipment, so if you capsized, you were likely to be wet and cold for the rest of the day!
 
I still think your way, Antarctic, even with the modern wetsuit. Capsizing is a royal pain in the neck.

Not racing means not having a safety crew in a RIB as back-up, and singlehandedly righting a boat originally designed for a crew of three, needs preparation.

The further from the class rules I move, the more people tend to assume I'm trying to 'hot-rod' the boat...

...but in truth I'm just trying to retain the standard boat's great performance, without necessitating more than one person on board.
 
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