Definition of pontoon mooring please ?

[Jobs a good un]

Morning All

I am looking for advice on the definition of a pontoon mooring our Harbour authority is looking to nearly double our mooring fees because they believe we have a pontoon mooring (The previous club mooring was scrapped by the harbour )
So in our mooring place we have boats doubled up alongside a walkway none of us have the following and there are no fingers to moor on .
1 .Electric on the walkway
2. No water on walkway
3. No security fence or gate
4. The inner boat has to move the outside boat to go sailing so no easy access in & out
5.Our mooring is within a cut and has a operational sluice gate at the end .

Thank you for your views/help

Mark

 

[steveeasy]

I dont think you need a definition of a Pontoon mooring. Ok you have no water, no electricity, I assume you have access from the shore?. Boats raft up and its not an ideal location. You still have though a pontoon mooring.

Its all relative to what you pay and what is in a contract. You also can look at what other rates are to compare with what your Harbour Authority are charging. But by its definition you have a pontoon mooring. Nothing is black and white.

Steveeasy

 

[footsoldier]

Not sure if there is an official definition in law - doubtful - so, I think 'pontoon mooring' is simply a general descriptive phrase.

I am certain, though, that the facilities provided are irrelevant as is the question of rafting - or not. The test surely must be 'is the "walkway" of which you speak afloat and attached in some way to the sea/river bed - if so it would seem to be a pontoon. If you are moored to it, it must surely be a 'pontoon mooring'.

 

[jac]

Facilities are irrelevant. The facilities you mention are probably the difference that make a marina.

I am on a pontoon mooring in the middle of the Hamble. It has no water, electricity or walk ashore but is still a pontoon.

TO me the test would be what do you moor to. If you moor your boat to a floating structure that is at least the approximate length of your boat and that is secured to the land somehow then it's a pontoon and be definition it's a pontoon mooring.

 

[mainsail1]

I am afraid my answer would be "if you don't like it, walk". That is the only language they will understand and if nobody else does the same, then, you know that the deal was not that bad for the money.

 

[Dellquay13]

I’ve looked at a few online dictionaries to confirm, and as I thought, a Pontoon is a platform structure bridging between floating supports.
From Latin (later French) Ponton and probably closely related to the Welsh Pont meaning bridge.
I think your harbour authority have the definition right, unfortunately for you.

 

[Stemar]

I am afraid my answer would be "if you don't like it, walk". That is the only language they will understand and if nobody else does the same, then, you know that the deal was not that bad for the money.

Unfortunately, I have to agree. Complain all you like, but ultimately, your only effective protest is with your feet, if you can find better value elsewhere. If you can't, that suggests the HA got their prices about right.

 

[Praxinoscope]

My sympathies, our local council which operates our harbour has been rapidly increasing our fees over the last few years, and at the same time reducing their activity in the harbour e. g. cross chains are too loose and not tightened or checked, they don't provide water or electricity, both these are supplied by the club, navigation lights have been left broken despite warnings from Trinity House, and so it goes on.
There seems to be a mythology that all boat owners are filthy rich and can afford to pay whatever is levied, but there are now at least 10 boat owners in our harbour considering either finding alternative moorings or just giving up boating.

 

[Rappey]

Its been said that once you add fingers to a pontoon it then becomes chargeable as a marina .

 

[B27]

Pontoon moorings are mostly a device to get more boats in, not a benefit to the boat owner.
If the OP's mooring is 'walk ashore' then the pontoon is a benefit compared to tying up against a wall.

 

[bignick]

Who owns the pontoon? Was it provided by the Harbour Authority?

 

[Bristolfashion]

Well, if the "more money than sense"* brigade who own boats, pay for pontoon moorings (etc) but never use 'em cleared out, occupancy would drop, competition would rise and prices would drop.

Selfish hogging of resources imho.

*Doesn't matter whether it's a big, expensive boat in an expensive location or the opposite

 

[jac]

Well, if the "more money than sense"* brigade who own boats, pay for pontoon moorings (etc) but never use 'em cleared out, occupancy would drop, competition would rise and prices would drop.

Selfish hogging of resources imho.

*Doesn't matter whether it's a big, expensive boat in an expensive location or the opposite

I'm afraid it would make no difference. the boat would still exist so would need a mooring somewhere so overall supply / demand of moorings would not change.

Secondly - what is the threshold for "never being used" of an AWB. Is it going for a cruise of more than 2 weeks? Is it being used for 1/2 day every weekend? How many full weekends a year? How do you handle someone who used it a lot last year but had a medical issue this year.

As long as people pay the bills then all good. The issue for me is the abandoned boats that pay nothing.

 

[oldmanofthehills]

Morning All

I am looking for advice on the definition of a pontoon mooring our Harbour authority is looking to nearly double our mooring fees because they believe we have a pontoon mooring (The previous club mooring was scrapped by the harbour )
So in our mooring place we have boats doubled up alongside a walkway none of us have the following and there are no fingers to moor on .
1 .Electric on the walkway
2. No water on walkway
3. No security fence or gate
4. The inner boat has to move the outside boat to go sailing so no easy access in & out
5.Our mooring is within a cut and has a operational sluice gate at the end .

Thank you for your views/help

Mark

You dont say which harbour or what fee. If near solent and is £200pa and they want to raise it to £400pa, I would snap their hand off. If however its £4k pa, I wouldnt

 

[B27]

Well, if the "more money than sense"* brigade who own boats, pay for pontoon moorings (etc) but never use 'em cleared out, occupancy would drop, competition would rise and prices would drop.

Selfish hogging of resources imho.

*Doesn't matter whether it's a big, expensive boat in an expensive location or the opposite

Most of the people who hog moorings but don't use their boats seem to start off with good intentions, then progressively use their boats less and less. They only give up the mooring either when they die or decide it's a big expense they can do without. Cheap moorings don't help that problem.

 

[B27]

I'm afraid it would make no difference. the boat would still exist so would need a mooring somewhere so overall supply / demand of moorings would not change.

Secondly - what is the threshold for "never being used" of an AWB. Is it going for a cruise of more than 2 weeks? Is it being used for 1/2 day every weekend? How many full weekends a year? How do you handle someone who used it a lot last year but had a medical issue this year.

As long as people pay the bills then all good. The issue for me is the abandoned boats that pay nothing.

Are there really that many abandoned boats on good moorings which pay nothing?
There are a lot of neglected boats where the owner still pays the bill.
Every club I've been a member of has the facility to get rid of boats not paid for in the dinghy park.
I believe our harbour authority much the same. There may be a few wrecks in the shallows, but I think the perception of tens of thousands of abandoned boats may be wrong.

 

[B27]

You dont say which harbour or what fee. If near solent and is £200pa and they want to raise it to £400pa, I would snap their hand off. If however its £4k pa, I wouldnt

A lot of harbour authorities are cliques of locals voting to keep their own bills down.
Some are stupidly cheap, with waiting lists measured in decades.
Sometimes subsidised by visitors or property interests like car parks.

 

[Bristolfashion]

I'm afraid it would make no difference. the boat would still exist so would need a mooring somewhere so overall supply / demand of moorings would not change.

Secondly - what is the threshold for "never being used" of an AWB. Is it going for a cruise of more than 2 weeks? Is it being used for 1/2 day every weekend? How many full weekends a year? How do you handle someone who used it a lot last year but had a medical issue this year.

As long as people pay the bills then all good. The issue for me is the abandoned boats that pay nothing.

Accept all of that - but the boats either side of me at the yard had been unvisited for 15 years, one was up to the coming full of water but they were still paying the bill. Hogging a limited resource is selfish. There are a couple of , literally, half sunk boats on pontoons here.

Surely there are a few to scrap and a few that could be moved away to long term storage.

 

[Bristolfashion]

Are there really that many abandoned boats on good moorings which pay nothing?
There are a lot of neglected boats where the owner still pays the bill.
Every club I've been a member of has the facility to get rid of boats not paid for in the dinghy park.
I believe our harbour authority much the same. There may be a few wrecks in the shallows, but I think the perception of tens of thousands of abandoned boats may be wrong.

You don't need tens of thousands - there are two half sunk boats in this end of the marina that I've spotted - surely, at the very least, these could be scrapped or moved to off water / yard storage? Then there are 2 spots for someone who might use a boat or visit. Perhaps, even, heaven forbid, encouraging a young person to take up sailing.

 

[Bristolfashion]

In Australia around Sydney, to keep a mooring one had to have a boat on it - this led to some appalling wrecks of "mooring minders" - boats that didn't move for 20 years (and couldn't anyway) - last I heard, the harbour authority were intending to make being away from the mooring for a certain period a requirement - which created an awful stink amongst those greedy to hold on to the mooring.