Decades after most people, I'm thinking of a GRP boat - can someone recommend a book?

[Kukri]

I am a competent wooden boat owner. I can maintain, modify and do light to moderate repairs on wooden boats from a Firefly to a pre-war gaff cutter. I have done so for, Heaven help me, forty-three years. I've even built a couple.

I am now approaching the point where the long sail to somewhere warm that, like many of us, I have planned since my schooldays, becomes possible, and I have realised that wood is not the best material if you plan to spend time in the Tropics, which I do.

Is there a good book on the care, repair, modification and maintenance of GRP cruising boats that I should read?

 

[jwilson]

Not specific to repairs and maintenance, but if you want to "know your enemy" try Hugo du Plessis "Fibreglass Boats".

 

[theoldsalt]

This is the one I use for reference.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Modern-Boat...sr=1-9&keywords=fibreglass+boat+repair+manual

 

[Kukri]

Thanks very much indeed - have ordered both.

 

[vyv_cox]

I was about to suggest the Streiffert book but I see theoldsalt beat me to it. Quite useful, I have learned a lot from it.

 

[Kukri]

It has a stinker of a review on Amazon! But I ordered it anyway. I've got Nigel Calder, of course.

 

[Kukri]

Hugo du Plessis book arrived this morning - it seems excellent - will be reading on train to meeting this pm.

Thanks for the recommendation.

 

[laika]

"Fibrelass Boats" looked good at first but ultimately seemed to be more relevant to construction than to the kind of minor (and medium sized) repair and everyday maintenance I actually needed to know about. I found the Adlard Cole book of Hull and Deck Repairs by Don Casey to be more useful:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Hull-Deck-Repair-Adlard-Coles/dp/1408100029/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1369307175&sr=8-1&keywords=hull+and+deck+repairs

 

[Kukri]

"Fibrelass Boats" looked good at first but ultimately seemed to be more relevant to construction than to the kind of minor (and medium sized) repair and everyday maintenance I actually needed to know about. I found the Adlard Cole book of Hull and Deck Repairs by Don Casey to be more useful:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Hull-Deck-Repair-Adlard-Coles/dp/1408100029/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1369307175&sr=8-1&keywords=hull+and+deck+repairs

Thank you; I've ordered that as well.

 

[Bosun Higgs]

Dont overdo the book Minn. Fibreglass really is low maintenance - actually nil maintenance day to day. And its easy to repair as well. The only really skilled bit is getting repairs to a saticfactory cosmetic standard and thats much the same with wood. It only comes from practise rather than book knowledge.

So my recommendation would be to get youreself some basic raw materials ( try east coast fibreglass - I've used them and found them very helpful) and then have a play moulding something for the current boat or the home. Maybe start with a flat piece of fibreglass using a sheet of plastic laminate as a mould. Simple:-

1/ 10C temperature and dry environment
2/ coat the mould with realease fluid. Mine is a fetching shade of blue, I paint it on, let it dry and then give it another coat. Water soluble so it washes off
3/ Mix up the gelcoat. Ratio of hardener is important so get yourself a few of those plastic syringes graduated in ml. Paint on the gel coat like you would paint a door except that you want a thick coating
4/ Wait til its gone off but remains slightly surface tacky then paint with a layer of catalysed resin
5/ Into the wet resin lay a sheet or three of chopped strand mat. Make sure its all wetted out. One of those ribbed rollers is handy.
6/ repeat 4 and 5 as necessary to get the required thickness.
7. Go away let it all cure for a day and the seperate the fibregalss you have made from the mould.

These are the basics but there are lots of variations, mostly common sense or to achieve a specific result. The key issues in my experience of the projects I have done are:

1/ correct mix ratio and thorough mixing of resin and catalyst
2/ decent conditions of work
3/ forethought and organisation - for example, getting the glass matt cut to size before your tools, rubber gloves etc are sticky with resin.

No doubt others will add a lot more to the above. But get some practical familiarity before you have to do it in anger a long way away.

P.S. Resin keeps well in the freezer.

 

[davidej]

If I were contemplating bluewater cruising, I would seriously consider steel.

Not maintenance free but keeping rust at bay shouldn't be too trying if it has been properly treated.

Easy and cheap to modify or repair without expensive experts.

Also safest in a grounding situation. I have just been looking at the Marie Celeste, which readers here will know had a collision with rocks and ended up on the beach at Eastbourne in a F8. Its just got a bit of denting which is quite had to spot. Compare this with the boat that went up on the beach at Margate in similar conditions a winter or two ago - reduced to the GRP equivalent of matchwood

 

[Bosun Higgs]

If I were contemplating bluewater cruising, I would seriously consider steel.

Not maintenance free but keeping rust at bay shouldn't be too trying if it has been properly treated.

Easy and cheap to modify or repair without expensive experts.

Not according to a yard owner that I posed the same question to. And TBH not in line with my experience working in the steel industry

 

[Kukri]

Dont overdo the book Minn. Fibreglass really is low maintenance - actually nil maintenance day to day. And its easy to repair as well. The only really skilled bit is getting repairs to a saticfactory cosmetic standard and thats much the same with wood. It only comes from practise rather than book knowledge.

So my recommendation would be to get youreself some basic raw materials ( try east coast fibreglass - I've used them and found them very helpful) and then have a play moulding something for the current boat or the home. Maybe start with a flat piece of fibreglass using a sheet of plastic laminate as a mould. Simple:-

1/ 10C temperature and dry environment
2/ coat the mould with realease fluid. Mine is a fetching shade of blue, I paint it on, let it dry and then give it another coat. Water soluble so it washes off
3/ Mix up the gelcoat. Ratio of hardener is important so get yourself a few of those plastic syringes graduated in ml. Paint on the gel coat like you would paint a door except that you want a thick coating
4/ Wait til its gone off but remains slightly surface tacky then paint with a layer of catalysed resin
5/ Into the wet resin lay a sheet or three of chopped strand mat. Make sure its all wetted out. One of those ribbed rollers is handy.
6/ repeat 4 and 5 as necessary to get the required thickness.
7. Go away let it all cure for a day and the seperate the fibregalss you have made from the mould.

These are the basics but there are lots of variations, mostly common sense or to achieve a specific result. The key issues in my experience of the projects I have done are:

1/ correct mix ratio and thorough mixing of resin and catalyst
2/ decent conditions of work
3/ forethought and organisation - for example, getting the glass matt cut to size before your tools, rubber gloves etc are sticky with resin.

No doubt others will add a lot more to the above. But get some practical familiarity before you have to do it in anger a long way away.

P.S. Resin keeps well in the freezer.

Thanks. Excellent advice. I see a shower tray in my future!

 

[davidej]

I freely admit that I do not have any experience of steel but

in the Uk, 1 in 100 steel?

Holland maybe 1 in 10

Bluewater destinations maybe 1in 4 - not from the UK but south africa brazil etc where GRP skills are hard to find

Anyway my days of dreaming about being a live aboard have passed so this is all from the armchair.

 

[Kukri]

If I were contemplating bluewater cruising, I would seriously consider steel.

Not maintenance free but keeping rust at bay shouldn't be too trying if it has been properly treated.

Easy and cheap to modify or repair without expensive experts.

Also safest in a grounding situation. I have just been looking at the Marie Celeste, which readers here will know had a collision with rocks and ended up on the beach at Eastbourne in a F8. Its just got a bit of denting which is quite had to spot. Compare this with the boat that went up on the beach at Margate in similar conditions a winter or two ago - reduced to the GRP equivalent of matchwood

I work for part of the year in Subic Bay in the Philippines -besides the big Hanjin shipyard there is a local yard building and refitting steel superyachts and another which builds boats in composites including cold moulded wood and carbon fibre - both British run, incidentally. And there is a marina, which, being one of just a couple of typhoon-safe yacht harbours in the country, collects hotshot racers and cruising boats whose owners have run out of money and which are going no further.

Consequently it is quite a good place to study the effects of a tropical climate on boats. I have to say that GRP without "fake teak" decks seems to come off best. Working as I do in merchant shipping I am a bit cautious about inexpert repairs to steel, and even more cautious about thin steel plates. Aluminium alloy would be fine if one could afford it and if one kept out of marinas, but most tropical marinas are absolutely fizzing with stray currents - which was a major factor in my rejecting wood - a material that I know and am competent with.

 

[Tranona]

Lot of that is historic. Holland is very short on trees so never really established a big wooden boat industry, so saw steel as a sensible way to expand their boat building. Also many of the boats are built for use in freshwater inland waterways where steel has a number of practical advantages. This led to expertise in using the material that is perhaps not developed elsewhere.

Steel is popular for bluewater because it can stand bashing on rocks, coral etc., but arguably more because it is possible to build one offs and large structures much more easily, even DIY. It got a good hold on the market when production boats were less suited to that particular use. However, it does not lend itself to series production in that there are few economies of scale and a lot of labour intensive work to fill the empty steel hull.

Although in theory easy to repair steel boats don't stand up too well to hard usage and neglect and need constant small repairs to keep rust at bay - and once it gets hold very difficult to put right. Suggest you look at some 15-20 year old steel boats and particularly at the prices compared with GRP boats of similar type and age. Market prices are a good indication of desirability.

 

[Halo]

Lots of steel boats slowly rusting away in the tropics. Trouble is that there are lots of inaccessible internal spaces in a yacht which deteriorate rapidly once the rust gets going
I know that some of the steel "challenge" boats built for round the world racing have required tons of work to keep them going
For bluewater tropics my feel is Aluminium is best, followed by modern GRP with some osmosis resistance

 

[davidej]

In my meagre experience of bluewater sailing destinations, UK owners seem to be between 55 and 65 years old with a newish £1/2m Oysters replete with watermakers and satellite phones.

Our commonwealth cousins, kiwis, South Africans etc seem to be 20 years younger (often with small children) and have battered looking steel boats festooned with solar panels gas bottles and bicycles.

I know who I would rather be with with when there is a collision with an uncharted rock

 

[Tranona]

In my meagre experience of bluewater sailing destinations, UK owners seem to be between 55 and 65 years old with a newish £1/2m Oysters replete with watermakers and satellite phones.

Our commonwealth cousins, kiwis, South Africans etc seem to be 20 years younger (often with small children) and have battered looking steel boats festooned with solar panels gas bottles and bicycles.

I know who I would rather be with with when there is a collision with an uncharted rock

Sweeping generalisations. Plenty of younger UK people go bluewater, including in steel boats, and bicycles etc. Steel is popular in some countries, as was ferro before because in some countries there is not a ready supply of secondhand boats at modest prices so the best alternative is to build your own or have one built by a small yard.

Worrying about hitting uncharted rocks or other hard bits is only an issue if you spend a lot of time in waters where such things exist. Then of course having a boat that stands up better may be high on the list of priorities, but it is clearly not for the hundreds of people who happily go round the world in production GRP boats - not the tiny minority that you describe.