Cummins QSD 2.8 220 HP on Stern Drives

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z1ppy

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Morning,

We are viewing a boat this weekend that has a pair of these with Axius Joystick

My first thought is "cool, not Volvo D3's 160 / 190 combo) and joystick for easier handling" but my next thought is "thats a lot to go wrong"

I believe this is only one of a few build with this set up which is a concern, why so few? i guess there was a hefty price premium for them to start.

Any experience good or bad with the engines and / or the Axius Joystick setup?

Thanks in advance.
 
z1ppy said:
Morning,

We are viewing a boat this weekend that has a pair of these with Axius Joystick

My first thought is "cool, not Volvo D3's 160 / 190 combo) and joystick for easier handling" but my next thought is "thats a lot to go wrong"

I believe this is only one of a few build with this set up which is a concern, why so few? i guess there was a hefty price premium for them to start.

Any experience good or bad with the engines and / or the Axius Joystick setup?

Thanks in advance.
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Isn't that the product of the Cummins / Mercruiser joint venture that is now wrapped up and offer little or no support?
 
burgundyben said:
Isn't that the product of the Cummins / Mercruiser joint venture that is now wrapped up and offer little or no support?
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The mercruiser dealers I have the displeasure to deal with struggle to answer the phone , order the correct parts .
Not an engine I’d want when it goes wrong . The Axis system was a copy of the Volvo system , I’ve only ever seen 2 boats with it fitted , they did 1 SC 35 and the other was a Prestige . We all know how good the mercury drive is with a torquey diesel motor sat on the front of it .
 
volvopaul said:
The mercruiser dealers I have the displeasure to deal with struggle to answer the phone , order the correct parts .
Not an engine I’d want when it goes wrong . The Axis system was a copy of the Volvo system , I’ve only ever seen 2 boats with it fitted , they did 1 SC 35 and the other was a Prestige . We all know how good the mercury drive is with a torquey diesel motor sat on the front of it .
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I believe it was the other way round, CMD were first to have the joystick control.

If it were me I would find out if there’s a reliable dealer close to where I would use boat and discuss what level of support is available. I guess if you’re after an SC29 it’s going to be this or the D3 which also gets bad reports, can it really be that bad when there’s so many out there in use ? Most importantly is to get engines tested by someone who understands them and can confirm their condition.
 
Boat2016 said:
I believe it was the other way round, CMD were first to have the joystick control.

If it were me I would find out if there’s a reliable dealer close to where I would use boat and discuss what level of support is available. I guess if you’re after an SC29 it’s going to be this or the D3 which also gets bad reports, can it really be that bad when there’s so many out there in use ? Most importantly is to get engines tested by someone who understands them and can confirm their condition.
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Sort of correct with the joy stick , the Zeus system was a joint venture , it didn’t catch on over volvos IPS , sealine started to fit it but it was overtaken by IPS which is real shame because the QSB lump is s great motor .
Buyers simply voted VP when you look at the dealer network it’s a no brainier .
Cummins didn’t stand a chance getting there foot into boat builders with virtually zero back up on top of Cummins and Brunswick falling out of bed with each other . End of partnership and big order book .
 
CX54WEK said:
That engine and drive combination is why the boat is so much cheaper then the VP engined equivalent.
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Just looking online at others for sale and that's the most expensive one available no not sure what you mean ?

With all the negativity about the d3 it looks like a good alternative ?
 
Boat2016 said:
Just looking online at others for sale and that's the most expensive one available no not sure what you mean ?

With all the negativity about the d3 it looks like a good alternative ?
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thats pretty much my thoughts too...

its a late model boat so would expect it to be a little stronger on the price and having seen just about all the ones that are currently for sale, will be interesting to compare...

bottom line is my concern about lack of support for a very complex electrical / mechanical set up that is 10 years old...
 
Boat2016 said:
Just looking online at others for sale and that's the most expensive one available no not sure what you mean ?

With all the negativity about the d3 it looks like a good alternative ?
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The early D3 problems all stem from the same item , the VVT if it’s used at low rpm on inland waterways , if it’s used at sea it gives very little trouble. The other issue it doesn’t like is poor boat building installation where air leaks in fuel lines and partial blockages in relatively new but contaminated fuel tanks , the sc 29 was a prime example where the fuel system was flawed due to poor pipework . I wouldn’t dismiss a SC29 if it’s been used on the coast and can be tested on the coast .
 
Worth considering cases of other boats with minority engine options .
Couple of boats on Thames with out of the ordinary power units.
Noteably pair of Fairline Turbo 36 one with a pair of badged BMW diesels and one with Mercruiser diesels .
Both boats were lanquishing on the brokers lists for ages, especially the BMW boat.
These were not expensive new vessels but 25 year old boats.
Not sure what happened but think they eventually were sold .
 
These are a VM built engine badged as Cummins. As people have said, limited knowledge and spare parts maybe an issue.
 
A while ago I did a lot of research into the QSD because I was interested in an Arvor 280. Despite it being a Italian VM and an orphan of Mercruiser and Cummins it had a surprisingly good reputation. The bad news is that is the QSD4.2, the 2.8 has a less than stellar reputation. However there are not a lot about so a couple of cases is the equivalent of a thousand Volvo’s going wrong.
The 2.8 was fitted to the Arvor 250, my advice would be to go to the Arvor owners forum and poke around. But bear in mind that the Arvor is on a shaft and also a single so a direct comparison is not possible
 
Howard, 220 is a lot of power from a 2.8 litre. We had a 3.6 VM in a Jag with 165 hp. Went well once we had sorted the cooling. I would be concerned about durability.
 
rafiki_ said:
Howard, 220 is a lot of power from a 2.8 litre. We had a 3.6 VM in a Jag with 165 hp. Went well once we had sorted the cooling. I would be concerned about durability.
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The D4 220 is only 2.4 litre and is quite common now, is that really too much to expect from a modern engine ?
 
I have found Cummins customer service to be excellent. They have a user portal where you enter the engine serial numbers and this gives direct access to the spare part listing for each engine. Mine have a few external differences from Thornycroft marinisation, but as long as you are aware of this when sourcing parts, Cummins have been excellent. This is also with 27 year old engines.

That said my base engine is one of the most manufactured diesels ever made - 6BT5.9. I understand this is now the base of the QSB series.

I personally will never own a boat with outdrives. If in the future I want something hanging out the back I would opt for a decent outboard.
 
boat sold before we got there today... all irrelevant now...

search continues... getting bored of looking and already feeling myself loosing interest. how petem managed his search for so long i don't know!
 
z1ppy said:
boat sold before we got there today... all irrelevant now...

search continues... getting bored of looking and already feeling myself loosing interest. how petem managed his search for so long i don't know!
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That's done you a favour. With your track record for changing boats, the last thing you need is some odd ball that won't shift.
 
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