Crusader Magic Furl Cruising Chute

[Sailfree]

When ordering boat I specified Spinnaker but with just wife on 43' we never use it.

Now wish we had gone for cruising chute fitting. The crusader system would appear to solve problem. Anyone with experience of using one shorthanded on similar size boat.
Not seeking info on flying spinnaker as it's a non starter with wife. We would fly one when racing Wayfarer even in marginal conditions but big difference between 16' boat and 43'

 

[rudolph_hart]

We had a cruising chute, made by Dolphin, which was well made but was a bit of a handful, even when using the snuffer/sock which came with it.

So we had Crusader fit it with a Magicfurl, which made a huge difference. You don't actually save any bits of string, as you're swopping a snuffing line for a furling line.

Even though Crusader were much less expensive than other systems, It's quality kit & Crusader make a good job of fitting it. One tip: ensure the furled sail is hoisted then swigged up so the dyneema furling 'foil' is tight

Chute dimensions were 13.6 x 7.65 meters.

 

[PaulRainbow]

I have a North cruising chute in a snuffer on a 33ft boat. I can deploy and recover it single handed.

Ignore the first couple of minutes, as once setup it packs away in the bag with all of it's lines.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lp4ZtBNvgPo

 

[Sailfree]

I have a North cruising chute in a snuffer on a 33ft boat. I can deploy and recover it single handed.

Ignore the first couple of minutes, as once setup it packs away in the bag with all of it's lines.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lp4ZtBNvgPo

Thanks but difference in sizes and forces involved in a 33' boat to a 43' are a lot different (and costs!!) plus the magic furl comes with all the fitting but concerned by Rudolf Harts comment as only fixing point is cheek of anchor roller and I think that rotates - not sure how much with anchor stowed.

 

[rudolph_hart]

but concerned by Rudolf Harts comment as only fixing point is cheek of anchor roller and I think that rotates - not sure how much with anchor stowed.

Are you saying that your anchor stowage/roller is one of the canting self/stowing type? If so it might not be suitable & you might consider a demountable bowsprit (e.g. Selden).

On my boat, there is a padded s/steel ring at the bottom of the pulpit, through which a spinnaker pole can protrude forward about a meter to form a bowsprit. The aft end clips to a bracket on the inboard edge of side-deck.

 

[Tranona]

Thanks but difference in sizes and forces involved in a 33' boat to a 43' are a lot different (and costs!!) plus the magic furl comes with all the fitting but concerned by Rudolf Harts comment as only fixing point is cheek of anchor roller and I think that rotates - not sure how much with anchor stowed.

You need the tack about 30cm forward of the forestay and very firm. The ultimate solution is a Selden retractable bowsprit, but there are other ways of achieving it such as adding a hole to one of the cheeks of the stem head fitting if there is room. On my boat i will add a bracket with an eye to the bow step which has a solid brace down to the stem head fitting.

So the actual arrangement will depend on the individual boat.

 

[dom]

...concerned by Rudolf Harts comment as only fixing point is cheek of anchor roller and I think that rotates - not sure how much with anchor stowed.

How long is your spi pole? Have you thought about dropping it right down its mast track, then lashing it to bow fitting, and finally lashing a frictionless ring to its end for the assy tack line? It is incidentally best not to use spi pole end fitting for tack line as direction of stress isn't quite right.

 

[Sailfree]

Are you saying that your anchor stowage/roller is one of the canting self/stowing type? If so it might not be suitable & you might consider a demountable bowsprit (e.g. Selden).

On my boat, there is a padded s/steel ring at the bottom of the pulpit, through which a spinnaker pole can protrude forward about a meter to form a bowsprit. The aft end clips to a bracket on the inboard edge of side-deck.

Could get it drilled and stop it being the canting type.

Other solution is to fix something to project forward from the adjacent empty anchor slot

 

[PaulRainbow]

Could get it drilled and stop it being the canting type.

Other solution is to fix something to project forward from the adjacent empty anchor slot

That's what i did. Local stainless firm made me a bowsprit and a couple of brackets.

 

[jeanpaulcopie]

When ordering boat I specified Spinnaker but with just wife on 43' we never use it.

Now wish we had gone for cruising chute fitting. The crusader system would appear to solve problem. Anyone with experience of using one shorthanded on similar size boat.
Not seeking info on flying spinnaker as it's a non starter with wife. We would fly one when racing Wayfarer even in marginal conditions but big difference between 16' boat and 43'

You could use the ATN Tacker. No spinnaker pole, no bowsprit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zt_G0uVc5iY

 

[Tranona]

You could use the ATN Tacker. No spinnaker pole, no bowsprit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zt_G0uVc5iY

That works on a very different principle from the Magic Furl (or similar systems such as Selden make) and has the advantage that it can be set up before you go sailing with the sail furled and then operated from the cockpit. No bowsprit required although one is often used.

You can see the videos on the Crusader website which clearly show the advantages of their system over the one you suggest.

 

[jeanpaulcopie]

That works on a very different principle from the Magic Furl (or similar systems such as Selden make) and has the advantage that it can be set up before you go sailing with the sail furled and then operated from the cockpit. No bowsprit required although one is often used.

You can see the videos on the Crusader website which clearly show the advantages of their system over the one you suggest.

I am aware of that, but I sail single handed and find the ATN sytem quite efficient and easy to set up with autopilot or windane (I have a hydrovane)...and much cheaper a system all together. And I must say that in unsettled weather , channel crossing for instance, I don't like the idea of having a rolled up assymetric spinnaker 50cm +/- just in front of the genoa. My view of course!

 

[neil1967]

At the risk of a bit of thread drift, what practical advantages does the ATN tacker confer over and above having a block at the bow (shackled to the base of the forestay), slightly forward of the pulpit leading to the tack of the cruising chute which flies perhaps 30cm over the pulpit? This is the arrangement I have, which seems to work well - what would I gain from using a tacker?

 

[Tranona]

I am aware of that, but I sail single handed and find the ATN sytem quite efficient and easy to set up with autopilot or windane (I have a hydrovane)...and much cheaper a system all together. And I must say that in unsettled weather , channel crossing for instance, I don't like the idea of having a rolled up assymetric spinnaker 50cm +/- just in front of the genoa. My view of course!

Given the different principles there are arguments for and against both systems. However starting from nothing the furling designs have the advantage of being easier to operate, particularly furling and there is no need to have it up all the time. Sensible to only set it up if forecast conditions are suitable for using it. Just as easy to set up when on passage anyway.

As ever it is personal choice but furling systems seem to be taking the market.

 

[dom]

Given the different principles there are arguments for and against both systems. However starting from nothing the furling designs have the advantage of being easier to operate, particularly furling and there is no need to have it up all the time. Sensible to only set it up if forecast conditions are suitable for using it. Just as easy to set up when on passage anyway.

As ever it is personal choice but furling systems seem to be taking the market.

True, I set a #4 blade-jib using a Facnor furler and dyneema halyard and like it. I however use an old-fashioned snuffer for the asymmetric and it's okay, but on boats I have sailed the furling system is far better; by a country mile I would say. Were I going for a flatter Code 0 (not a rating constrained effort) I'd definitely go furler.

The problem with the furling ones is going really deep, which cam be a problem for non-planing cruising boats where sailing the angles is not so great. By attaching my tack to the spi pole and pulling around a bit, I can however get a useful 15 degrees further down.

I wonder has anybody tried setting a furler asym from the end of a spi pole?

 

[Sailfree]

Couple of questions bearing I already have an unused spinnaker and a snuffer so using the ATN tacker seems a very cheap option but appreciate what are the advantages of the Magicfurl over the ATN and how far does anyone think you have to sail off the wind to get an efficient sail from either system.

The ATN boot is £120 while the magicfurl would be some £3500 complete so really trying to evaluate differences in performance and in controlling - including dropping!

Really looking for why not to try the ATN system. My biggest concern is a spinnaker wrap (which I had once on a 38'!) and shorthanded it was very difficult to drop it. Wonder how easy the ATN system is to drop as wind gets stronger - looks easy on demo video in light winds.

 

[PaulRainbow]

You dismissed my suggestion of something along the lines of my North sail with snuffer in post #4, so how do you see the ATN system as being different ?

 

[dom]

...something along the lines of my North sail with snuffer in post #4, so how do you see the ATN system as being different ?

Coo, when I were a lad, we would have drilled a few golf balls and strung them together for something like that. We called them parrel beads.

I hope that ATN baby comes with the snuffer as well and is not simply that little piece of webbing !!

 

[knuterikt]

True, I set a #4 blade-jib using a Facnor furler and dyneema halyard and like it. I however use an old-fashioned snuffer for the asymmetric and it's okay, but on boats I have sailed the furling system is far better; by a country mile I would say. Were I going for a flatter Code 0 (not a rating constrained effort) I'd definitely go furler.

The problem with the furling ones is going really deep, which cam be a problem for non-planing cruising boats where sailing the angles is not so great. By attaching my tack to the spi pole and pulling around a bit, I can however get a useful 15 degrees further down.

I wonder has anybody tried setting a furler asym from the end of a spi pole?

Yes, the furler sits on an adjustable tack line. I attach a braze to the furler with a soft shacle, the braze through spin pole yaw. Slack tack and pull the braze.

 

[Sailfree]

You dismissed my suggestion of something along the lines of my North sail with snuffer in post #4, so how do you see the ATN system as being different ?

Thanks for your suggestion but you are suggesting a new cruising sail plus sniffer.

I have nofitting in the bow for a cruising chute but the magic fuel will come with everything and yes a new sail. Hence the interest in setting up an ATM system which uses my existing spinnaker and sniffer into a cruising chute. See the video it uses the existing furled Genoa as a cruising chute forestay.

Just trying to get others experience and how far off the wind I need to be for either system.