dulls
N/A
My cruising chute (it was not a spinnaker anyway) was ok to about a close reach.
Cruising 'Chutes and Spinakers.
- Thread starter Slowboat35
- Start date
TernVI
Well-Known Member
You've probably seen tones of them and called them asy's.
Look at what Hyde call a cruising chute:
Buy Touring Gennaker | Yacht Accessories for Sale | Hyde Sails Ltd
The luff is clearly quite convex.
AntarcticPilot
Well-Known Member
I think that many sail-makers use the terms "cruising chute" and "Asymmetric" completely interchangeably. I have what Jeckells usually called a cruising chute, and the luff is, if anything, curved outward. I have considered trying to set it using the spinnaker pole, but as the reason I got it was to avoid complexities of handling (I usually sail with just my inexperienced wife as crew), I haven't done it yet! I find that the sail sets fine with the wind almost dead aft, anyway.The principal difference between what sailmakers sell as an Asymmetric Spinnaker and what they sell as a cruising chute is in the luff. If you took both sails and laid them out on a lawn, then took some string and ran it from the head to the tack of both sails you would see that on the cruising chute the string would be outside the sail, so the luff is a bit hollow. On the Asymmetric kite the string would still be inside the sail, so the luff projects in front of the sail.
The result of this is that the cruising chute is, as you might expect, somewhat more stable but less powerful. The asymmetric kite will be a considerably more powerful sail, and as you've seen better able to sail lower than a cruising chute.
However, the drawback is that they are not "set and forget" sails when sailing low. A good crew on a J109 can sail as low as 170 degrees with their A2 asymmetric, but to do this takes very careful co-ordination between the kite trimmer and the driver, and the rest of the crew hiking hard to roll the boat to windward and help the sail rotate around the forestay. Like this
The best way to boost your downwind performance with a cruising chute is to pole out the tack of the sail.
flaming
Well-Known Member
Huh...
So my question then would be what makes that a cruising chute and not the A3 it looks like....?
dulls
N/A
That has been my experience. We also had whisker poll and it was very useful on the chute.
TernVI
Well-Known Member
I think people were calling things like that 'cruising chutes' before many racing yachts were using terms like 'A3'.
We had a pretty similar cruising chute last century.
I think the straight luffed cruising chute is the newer invention, but the point is, 'cruising chute' covers a fair range of shapes.
Some of which are much more versatile than others.
Also, what people consider the 'normal' size for a given boat is quite variable, so making blanket statements and comparisons is likely to be open to error.
dulls
N/A
I have spent some time trying to google the differences and i still feel confused about it. I think there are a few interchangeable words.
flaming
Well-Known Member
My Dad's old Griffon had a cruising chute that was hollow luffed, and so did his next boat, so that's mid 1990s. As far as I was aware cruising chutes had straight or hollow luffs and weren't far off triangular in shape, and the A-sails that were developed out of skiffs etc were the first to add luff projection.
Thinking about it, the shapes have been getting better and better, especially in terms of stability, so it does make sense that luff projection would be added for cruising designs that are designed to go a bit deeper downhill.
The straight luff in code zeros etc is a lot more recent. And actually seemingly a passing fad... The newest ones from the likes of North and Doyle now have carbon fillaments in the luff instead of a cable, which allows them to have luff projection to satisfy the mid girth requirements to measure as a spinnaker, but still have a flat shape and sail more like a genoa.
TernVI
Well-Known Member
Sailmakers like Hyde were making one-design asy's for dinghy fleets like the Laser 4000 in big numbers by the early-mid 90s.
One sail to cover a range of courses.
A lot of fairly early cruising chutes looked a lot like those sails.
But a lot of lofts sold a lot of sails which avoided the expense of a full star-cut.
There have been some truly horrible things sold as cruising chutes.
Plus of course some people were looking for a sail that would go higher than their symmetric kite.
And roller furling reaching sails have been around a long time now, particularly in multihulls.
Multihulls and cruisers both operate outside the RRS definitions of headsails and spinnakers.
One sail to cover a range of courses.
A lot of fairly early cruising chutes looked a lot like those sails.
But a lot of lofts sold a lot of sails which avoided the expense of a full star-cut.
There have been some truly horrible things sold as cruising chutes.
Plus of course some people were looking for a sail that would go higher than their symmetric kite.
And roller furling reaching sails have been around a long time now, particularly in multihulls.
Multihulls and cruisers both operate outside the RRS definitions of headsails and spinnakers.
TLouth7
Well-Known Member
My cruising chute definitely has a convex luff and is designed to project somewhat to windward allowing a reasonably broad reach. Compared to an asymmetric designed for the same angles it has far narrower shoulders; indeed I would expect an assy to have its shoulders wider than its foot.
Remember that the appeal of a traditional cruising chute is that it covers a wide range of wind angles, so a hollow luff that can't get below 120-130 degrees would be pretty useless.
We pole out the tack sometimes, but it does make gybing a complex affair. Can also pole out the clew in order to run goosewinged; this is easy to do so works for shorter legs.
Remember that the appeal of a traditional cruising chute is that it covers a wide range of wind angles, so a hollow luff that can't get below 120-130 degrees would be pretty useless.
We pole out the tack sometimes, but it does make gybing a complex affair. Can also pole out the clew in order to run goosewinged; this is easy to do so works for shorter legs.
Kinsale373
Well-Known Member
On a related subject. I hoisted our Asymetric Crusing shute in gusty conditions travelling back from west Cork yesterday. It lasted long enough to get a nice photo then split right across the sail !
Is it worth trying to repair ? Do these repairs last?
I purchased it second hand from Sail Exchange ( yes, I have seen the many threads on the site relating to JP and Sail Exchange). I'm wondering if the sail had degraded over time. Does this happen ? It looked ok but was it "rotten"- how would you tell?
I have the sail and snubber kit. I presume I can get a sail made and use my existing snubber kit? Whats the right weight fabric for a Crusing 37 foot boat sailed light handed .
Regards, Kinsale 373
Is it worth trying to repair ? Do these repairs last?
I purchased it second hand from Sail Exchange ( yes, I have seen the many threads on the site relating to JP and Sail Exchange). I'm wondering if the sail had degraded over time. Does this happen ? It looked ok but was it "rotten"- how would you tell?
I have the sail and snubber kit. I presume I can get a sail made and use my existing snubber kit? Whats the right weight fabric for a Crusing 37 foot boat sailed light handed .
Regards, Kinsale 373
wully1
Well-Known Member
I often leave the mainsail in the stack pack and use the main boom with a snap shackle and block to Pole out the cruising chute then pole out the genoa conventionally to run goose winged.
TernVI
Well-Known Member
I once did that to an old 505 kite. My Mum sewed it back together and it survived many more races.
The tear probably started from a bit of damage.
Spinnakers are almost always worth repairing if you can DIY or get it done cheaply enough.
If you can buy a better one for less than the cost of the repair don't fix it.
Never hurts to have a spare or training sail!
Buck Turgidson
Well-Known Member
I can fly my Momentum ASpin from about 50° apparent all the way down to a dead run in light airs. It's got a definite convex luff and I trim it as I would a normal spinnaker easing until it starts to curl then sheet a bit and trim as the boat accelerates. Love it!
flaming
Well-Known Member
A couple of years back we blew out a kite such that essentially all we put back into the bag was 3 corners connected by some tape and an assorted collection of cloth. Packed it off to the sailmakers without much hope, but it came back in good enough condition to still get used for races. More than good enough for cruising uses.
dulls
N/A
Lovely video. How do you post a video and did you reduce it in size?
Buck Turgidson
Well-Known Member
hosted on vimeo then used the insert media function which is in the dropdown next to the smilie icon.
