Cruising Association/Knox Johnson open letter re 90/180 day problem
- Thread starter Twister_Ken
- Start date
Sy-Revolution
Active member
Here's hoping.
Appleyard
Well-known member
In other words "It ain't wot we vo'ed for !!" "we only vo'ed to keep them foreigners ah t" Well ,get used to it!
Gibeltarik
Active member
Er - No - we voted to stay in the EU with its Freedom of Movement for work, education and tourism. Quite happy for others to share the same freedoms. BUT - Sovereignity is all even if trade is strangled to some.
goeasy123
Active member
Err... Robin, what about us other 3rd country sailors??
Sandy
Well-known member
Just read the letter, utter tosh!
The 90/180 limit will not threaten the future of anything, people just need to understand the rules and adjust their plans accordingly like they do in the rest of the world and the rest of the world does in the Schengen Area.
I'd love to see the justification of that statement.Sir Robin Knox-Johnston said:
The 90/180 limit will not threaten the future of anything, people just need to understand the rules and adjust their plans accordingly like they do in the rest of the world and the rest of the world does in the Schengen Area.
syvictoria
Well-known member
Of course it threatens the future of cruising for British sailors - when compared to the freedoms of the recent past! Yes, people can just 'adjust their plans accordingly', but it is inconvenient, often expensive, and often undesirable for personal reasons, and so some will as a consequence simply opt to stop cruising when they cannot face (or afford) to amend their plans to the required degree. That's not to say that there are a lot of people so severely affected by the changes, but it is undeniable that cruising sailors are no longer able to amble around the EU on a tight budget in the way that they were up to only two months ago.
And yes, I know, other third country nationals, bla, bla, but they haven't spend years or even decades planning and dreaming, just to have the goalposts moved. Their difficulties are long established.
And yes, I know, Brexit has happened, suck it up. Yes. But please, let's have a little compassion and solidarity for those who didn't support or vote for Brexit and whose future plans and dreams have been right royally s***wed by the removal of FoM solely at the hands of our own government and their inability/unwillingness to negotiate a better (or earlier) deal.
And sailors are not alone in their frustration and disappointment...
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Gibeltarik
Active member
Hear hear - well said
Poignard
Well-known member
Until we became subject to the 90/180 limit I could come and go to my boat in Brittany as and when I liked. And that is what I did.
No forms to fill in, no Schengen calculator; just book a ferry and go.
I could sail back to the UK, or any other EU Member State at will wihout any liability for VAT.
Also, very importantly, I could carry boat's gear, tools, new items I had bought, food etc without needing to have invoices showing their cost etc.
In short I, and thousands of other owners of cruisers, have lost a freedom to do as we please; a freedom that hurt nobody.
How can that possiblty be justified?
Flynnbarr
Well-known member
Hear Hear-well said.
Caladh
Well-known member
The thing here is, you’re not going to convince any Brexiteer on this forum of that.
Poignard
Well-known member
That is true, at least not the trolls who only sail on English lakes, or don't leave UK waters, or don't sail at all.
But even if I can't convince any of the fools who voted for Brexit they were wrong I will never stop telling them so.
goeasy123
Active member
Can we be constructive here? Can I ask the forum.....
Is it realistic for the CA to be successful in getting more than 90/180?
What do they have to do to succeed?
What are the major hurdles to overcome? Are there any absolute deal stoppers?
Is it realistic for the CA to be successful in getting more than 90/180?
What do they have to do to succeed?
What are the major hurdles to overcome? Are there any absolute deal stoppers?
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Sandy
Well-known member
No
They need to convince people in power that cutting off the UK from its nearest neighbours is a disaster.
The vote to leave the EU.
Dealstopper, fish.
nortada
Well-known member
Goeasy123 thank you for guiding this thread back to the matter in hand and away from the endless Brexit debate and Guys, whilst on the subject, please help to keep the Brexit debate in the right place, rather than in Liveaboard Link.
Goeasy123, whilst it would be very much in my best interests if Schengen were to change to 183/365 days, I fear the Covid fiasco, has further hardened attitudes; so what to do
Continue to lobby anybody who will listen - more out of hope than expectation. One group that could help the cause are the mobile-home owners who like to winter in Southern Europe.
Unfortunately, the police in the Algarve have just initiated an ongoing crack down on wild camping which will further dissuade campers coming this way.
goeasy123
Active member
in answer.... I think the conversation lacks vision. All countries involved can benefit from tourism, where there are decision makers and influencers that will drive a positive agenda. Instead of building a case around something that can be sold to 'them', I see a lot of bleating about a plight and going cap in hand for a free hand out. The current strategy (or lack thereof?) is playing into the hands of the other influencers that oppose what could be achieved.
syvictoria
Well-known member
The fact that the UK has already granted other countries 180 days when visiting the UK, which I understand can be doubled to 360 simply be leaving and re-entering/reapplying for a visa, thereby leaving us little to negotiate with...
Caladh
Well-known member
Yes this strong argument can be forcefully put to our local MP’s and something our useless RYA can be lobbying for.
AndrewB
Well-known member
The case for this is dead on its feet unless enough EU countries - e.g. Greece, Spain, Portugal, think they are going to lose serious revenue by limiting our length of stay to 90 days. And I doubt whether they will.
We are now in the same position that Americans, Canadians, Australians etc have been in for many years. Countries that allow EU residents to stay 180 days with the possibility of extension, while in exchange the EU offers just 90 days at a time with little possibility of extension. Why would the EU make an exception for us?
We are now in the same position that Americans, Canadians, Australians etc have been in for many years. Countries that allow EU residents to stay 180 days with the possibility of extension, while in exchange the EU offers just 90 days at a time with little possibility of extension. Why would the EU make an exception for us?
goeasy123
Active member
As I said....can we be constructive here?