Crinan Canal Future?

[steveeasy]

You seem to be describing crinan and the canal in general as though those people never go there. That seems odd to me as it’s not my experience - to get to Cambeltown from Glasgow or Edinburgh you have to drive over the Canal (or Fly, or get the Ferry from Ardrossan when it operates). The Canal and Crinan are already visitor attractions. There’s a handful of other stuff nearby to see too (Beevers, Kilmichael, a trail of small galleries etc).

The Cairnbaan hotel is next to the other “significant” road bridge on the canal, a common stopping point for those taking 2 days to complete the transit. A long low building with the feeling that it has suffered 50 years of under investment. It used to have a very good reputation for food. It is a midge fest though.

Crinan itself will miss out on the bus tour trade by being at the end of a dead end and unsuitable road. I expect the locals prefer that!

Hi
Forgive my ignorance over locations and other details. Just providing some general opinion on the subject which I find of interest.
A fact I am unsure about is if useage has indeed fallen or increased over say last 30 years?.
Passing over the canal by road would not make those travelling by car realise the canal may be accessible. It is also a mistake to assume potential visitors know of the Crinan canal.

The fact the Crinan is only 7 miles long and however many locks makes 4 day trips fit well.

So 10 suitable holiday boats operating from split departure days on four day breaks would cause little traffic. On 100% occupancy over 6 months would generate income in the region of £500,000.
10% say £50.000 could be welcome income to maintaine the Canal.
15 groups a week over 6 months could easily put £70,000 in to restaurants in Crinan and. Cairnbraan. This would significantly support those fragile businesses.
Of course that’s just the tip of the iceberg. Small campsite half way along. Cycle hire. Camping in Crinan. How about a pontoon at Crinan.
The Canal needs a much greater strategic plan to create facilities that do not impact the area but create income needed and jobs.

The country is on fire with tourism growing massively. The Crinan lends itself well and Is I suspect under utilised. It’s an asset to yachties. It really could be so vibrant. Of course if it was not about running costs it could stay the same but I recon the hotels and local businesses would prefer growth.

Steveeasy

 

[RunAgroundHard]

What some people consider “tighfistedness” others consider as budgeting.

 

[ylop]

It is also a mistake to assume potential visitors know of the Crinan canal.

Having holidayed in the area since I was about 9 yrs old, and before I ever sailed a boat I may not be best placed to judge that but people get their tourist advice from many sources Trip Advisor, Instagram, Books, Leaflets in holiday houses/airBnBs/other tourist attractions. My gut feel is that anyone who is holidaying in north kintyre/knapdale will be aware of the canal, and most people in the wider Argyll area would be too.

So 10 suitable holiday boats operating from split departure days on four day breaks would cause little traffic.

On the weekdays I used the canal last summer 10 extra boats would potentially double the traffic. The staff did say it was unusually quiet though. But 10 boats in no great rush could cause all sorts of bottlenecks. WHYW it would be a much smaller %age of the traffic, but probably a much larger impact.

On 100% occupancy over 6 months would generate income in the region of £500,000.

The season is more like 5 months and won't get 100% occupancy. There are private hire operators on other scottish canals. The fact none have set up (successfully) on Crinan probably hints that the figures don't stack up. The Caledonian already makes for a pretty hire boat destination.

15 groups a week over 6 months could easily put £70,000 in to restaurants in Crinan and. Cairnbraan. This would significantly support those fragile businesses.

Do those businesses have capacity for that? many rural hospitality businesses really struggle with seasonal staff.

Of course that’s just the tip of the iceberg. Small campsite half way along. Cycle hire. Camping in Crinan.

SC's have discussed campsites. They face issues on their own land because of it being a Scheduled Ancient Monument. The land reform act means you can camp almost "anywhere" for free, so camp sites need to offer something extra to be viable. There's some land available at auction just round the corner from Bellanoch Marina if you think its commercially viable ;-). They probably could make more of a bike hire facility.

How about a pontoon at Crinan.

There is a pontoon at Crinan - I suspect the boatyard might not be too happy if a public authority starts competing...

The Canal needs a much greater strategic plan to create facilities that do not impact the area but create income needed and jobs.

Are there places for those job holders to live? because a lot of the property (including some that used to be owned by the Canal) are now holiday lets, or retired people.

The country is on fire with tourism growing massively. The Crinan lends itself well and Is I suspect under utilised. It’s an asset to yachties. It really could be so vibrant.

I don't recall anytime in the last 40 years going to Crinan and thinking it wasn't thriving. Ardrishaig is a different story, but actually recently seems to be improving - at least in part due to investment from the Canal. (But you said Campbeltown was thriving and that surprised me - although its been a while since I visited).

Of course if it was not about running costs it could stay the same but I recon the hotels and local businesses would prefer growth.

People are rightly cautious after hearing of bad experiences with influxes of tourists on Skye and the NC500 which benefit a few but cause problems for many. You are right it needs an overall strategic plan but the canal is just a stripe through the landscape - their remit doesn't extend far.

 

[oldmanofthehills]

What some people consider “tighfistedness” others consider as budgeting.

When others go bust because of your saving a few pennies or non-paying, I call it social freeloading. Thats why all the local shops are shutting down as everyone goes to supermarkets, thats why all the pubs and bars shut down as everyone drinks at home. Folk then bemoan the loss but by then its too late.

I am by no means rich and need to still work in my mid 70s, but my boat cost perhaps £20k and when I die I expect my executers will sell it for scrap, so thats £2k a year depreciation. Then I pay £500 in moorings and £800 for winter storage, plus repairs etc. No doubt thats fairly typical.

So if I can afford £40 a week depreciation and £26 a week ruuning costs plus the cost of a trip to strange parts, then surely I can afford a once off meal for £25 in a local hostelry.

Prolificacy is foolish, but meanness is a vice

 

[ctva]

When others go bust because of your saving a few pennies or non-paying, I call it social freeloading. Thats why all the local shops are shutting down as everyone goes to supermarkets, thats why all the pubs and bars shut down as everyone drinks at home. Folk then bemoan the loss but by then its too late.

I am by no means rich and need to still work in my mid 70s, but my boat cost perhaps £20k and when I die I expect my executers will sell it for scrap, so thats £2k a year depreciation. Then I pay £500 in moorings and £800 for winter storage, plus repairs etc. No doubt thats fairly typical.

So if I can afford £40 a week depreciation and £26 a week ruuning costs plus the cost of a trip to strange parts, then surely I can afford a once off meal for £25 in a local hostelry.

Prolificacy is foolish, but meanness is a vice

Absolute codswallop.

As someone who has a boat there, we pay canal fees. This goes to paying staff who live locally, shop locally, use services locally. We also use local services, shops, the coop, etc..

We also eat out occasionally and use the chippy in Lochgilphead from time to time.

As 'social freeloading' yachties, we are the ONLY members of the public that pay directly for Scottish Canals and the services that they provide, so you can take your sanctimonious VS and...

 

[dunedin]

Cairnbaan hotel now closed. ……

Oh dear, when did the hotel close? We were there last year and tried to use the hotel for a drink but seemed to only be operating certain days, “due to staff shortages”.
It would be a shame if Cairnbaan had no hotel or cafe of any form.

 

[ctva]

Oh dear, when did the hotel close? We were there last year and tried to use the hotel for a drink but seemed to only be operating certain days, “due to staff shortages”.
It would be a shame if Cairnbaan had no hotel or cafe of any form.

Towards the end of the year I think.

 

[oldmanofthehills]

Absolute codswallop.

As someone who has a boat there, we pay canal fees. This goes to paying staff who live locally, shop locally, use services locally. We also use local services, shops, the coop, etc..

We also eat out occasionally and use the chippy in Lochgilphead from time to time.

As 'social freeloading' yachties, we are the ONLY members of the public that pay directly for Scottish Canals and the services that they provide, so you can take your sanctimonious VS and...

If you actually read my post, I wasnt criticising residents for tightness but commenting on visitors and tourists in general. However you seemed to think the cap fitted you?

Generosity of spirit was being recommended, and seeing I am engaged in various social enterprises and develpment projects I would always promote it.

Would be nice to see it on boating forums too

 

[ctva]

If you actually read my post, I wasnt criticising residents for tightness but commenting on visitors and tourists in general. However you seemed to think the cap fitted you?
...

I did read your post and I am a visitor.

We all spend our hard earned cash differently and I would never presume to others like you have with no knowledge of their circumstances.

Businesses generally fail due to not providing what paying customers want.

 

[ylop]

Oh dear, when did the hotel close?

It was before Christmas, perhaps early Dec. Vague statement that closed for forseable future but didn't explain why but I did read somewhere a suggestion that the road closures from landslides between Lochgilphead and Oban had been the final straw. It changed hands not that long ago (maybe just before covid?).

We were there last year and tried to use the hotel for a drink but seemed to only be operating certain days, “due to staff shortages”.

Our experience was similar - but they were open for drinks but not food. But we were the only customer in the bar and felt like we were an inconvenience to the staff. We didn't bother going in on the return trip.

It would be a shame if Cairnbaan had no hotel or cafe of any form.

This could be steveeasy's big chance: Outstanding Opportunity at the Iconic Cairnbaan Hotel | Graham & Sibbald

 

[RunAgroundHard]

When others go bust because of your saving a few pennies or non-paying, I call it social freeloading. Thats why all the local shops are shutting down as everyone goes to supermarkets, thats why all the pubs and bars shut down as everyone drinks at home. Folk then bemoan the loss but by then its too late.

I am by no means rich and need to still work in my mid 70s, but my boat cost perhaps £20k and when I die I expect my executers will sell it for scrap, so thats £2k a year depreciation. Then I pay £500 in moorings and £800 for winter storage, plus repairs etc. No doubt thats fairly typical.

So if I can afford £40 a week depreciation and £26 a week ruuning costs plus the cost of a trip to strange parts, then surely I can afford a once off meal for £25 in a local hostelry.

Prolificacy is foolish, but meanness is a vice

I don't believe your assertion is correct. I am not here to support other business for the sake of it. You post a black and white picture, but it is not like that. Tourists will spend some money locally, they always do. Businesses close for many reasons associated with changes to the business environment. Tourist spend will not change that if margins are tight and overheads unsustainable.

 

[oldmanofthehills]

Businesses generally fail due to not providing what paying customers want.

Partly true and pp service drives away trade.

However the real problem across Britain as any fool can see, is that the British public want everything cheaper despite having some of the cheapest food in europe (but not the best), so the big boys undercut small traders. Probably its so the public can buy their giant flatscreen TVs but who knows?


Then you have ready mortgage driving up property prices some 20 years ago, needing ever bigger mortgages for any purchase and the repayments being beyond the ability of many a small business. For instance 120 years ago practically every small street in my district had a pub, off licence or cornershop. But then house prices were £250 and mens wages £157pa so it didnt take selling much beer to pay mortgage or lease.

We sold ourselves to the devil a couple of generations ago

I am not here to support other businesses but am always pleased to do so within reason. Help others and you may get a reward in this world.

I dont envy those whos income depends on tourism as we head deeper into the slump

 

[awol]

Oh dear, when did the hotel close? We were there last year and tried to use the hotel for a drink but seemed to only be operating certain days, “due to staff shortages”.
It would be a shame if Cairnbaan had no hotel or cafe of any form.

Maybe time to break the habit of a life-time and carry your own bottle on board?

 

[awol]

.

 

[dgadee]

It was before Christmas, perhaps early Dec. Vague statement that closed for forseable future but didn't explain why but I did read somewhere a suggestion that the road closures from landslides between Lochgilphead and Oban had been the final straw. It changed hands not that long ago (maybe just before covid?).

Our experience was similar - but they were open for drinks but not food. But we were the only customer in the bar and felt like we were an inconvenience to the staff. We didn't bother going in on the return trip.

This could be steveeasy's big chance: Outstanding Opportunity at the Iconic Cairnbaan Hotel | Graham & Sibbald

Not a lot of money. Does it need work? Not been there for over a decade.

 

[awol]

Id also agree about boats needing 2-3 on board. Sailboats behave so differently compared to a longboat and it would be nr on impossible single handed and clearly the canal can not have staff on hand to help especially in early April when it’s quite.

Single-handed ? Been there, done that ......... but that was the year of manned locks. 2023 needed a pilot to keep the "team leader" happy.
If the lines are long enough and there are 2 winches in the cockpit only one on board is needed.

 

[ylop]

Not a lot of money. Does it need work? Not been there for over a decade.

Well its probably not had much spent on it in that time! So yes it could do with some TLC, but I'd have thought it was feasible for someone to buy it and have it open for the season if they can get staff etc.

 

[steveeasy]

I did read your post and I am a visitor.

We all spend our hard earned cash differently and I would never presume to others like you have with no knowledge of their circumstances.

Businesses generally fail due to not providing what paying customers want.

I must state it indeed was me who referred to tight fisted yachties. It was however very much tongue and cheek meant in jest.

Steveeasy

 

[dunedin]

Maybe time to break the habit of a life-time and carry your own bottle on board?

Our boat was at Ardfern - it’s been a while since we transitted the Canal (it’s been the Mull recently).
We were on the bikes at the time.

 

[steveeasy]

Well its probably not had much spent on it in that time! So yes it could do with some TLC, but I'd have thought it was feasible for someone to buy it and have it open for the season if they can get staff etc.

Single-handed ? Been there, done that ......... but that was the year of manned locks. 2023 needed a pilot to keep the "team leader" happy.
If the lines are long enough and there are 2 winches in the cockpit only one on board is needed.

Went thru last year with 1 crew member it was such fun. Next time I go thru I’m going to slow it down. Just looked back at my movie and we met some great people outside the cairnbaan hotel, such a great spot. Looks like they made a real effort with music on each week. Small businesses are very difficult now.

Steveeasy