Couple overpower skipper 'trying to sink his boat

[AIDY]

Couple overpower skipper \'trying to sink his boat

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/08/06/nboat06.xml>
Couple overpower skipper 'trying to sink his own yacht' </A>


<hr width=100% size=1>/forums/images/icons/wink.gif <font color=blue> Regards Andy </font color=blue>

 

[kilkerr1]

Re: Couple overpower skipper \'trying to sink his b

The crew really should use quality leaf tea next time, and not bring the skipper this tea bag rubbish...



<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://kilkerr.members.easyspace.com/santateresa_pics.htm>Santa Teresa and other t'ings</A>

 

[StugeronSteve]

Re: Couple overpower skipper \'trying to sink his boat

Maybe the boat was a submarine.

<hr width=100% size=1>Think I'll draw some little rabbits on my head, from a distance they might be mistaken for hairs.

 

[graham]

Re: Couple overpower skipper \'trying to sink his boat

I think the clue may lie in the statement that the skipper was extremely dehydrated.

I have seen the effect this can have on normally sane people.

Sounds like he would be fit and strong ,the couple did well to restrain him without resorting to anything lethal.

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[AlexL]

Re: Couple overpower skipper \'trying to sink his boat

Dehydration can also be a result of high alchohol consumption - which can also have a strange effect on ordinarily sane people!

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[Bergman]

Re: Couple overpower skipper \'trying to sink his boat

Noted that the skipper was from N Wales, like the man the other week firing flares at the lifeboat.

Is there something in the water there.

Must have been alarming for the crew.

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[peterb]

Re: Couple overpower skipper \'trying to sink his boat

Think I'd like to hear both sides before reaching any conclusions.

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[jac]

Re: Couple overpower skipper \'trying to sink his boat

read a bit more about this.

Seems the skipper was very experienced but had been hit by a car a fews days before setting out (no idea if thats relevant or not)

The other two weren't expereinced but had apparently gone for a holiday helping the skipper deliver the boat back to uk.

The "trying to sink the boat" quote seems to have faded a bit as well. The telegraph carried a report from the hearing in spain saying that the two "crew" were a bit worried about the boat in a big storm they were in and wanted to either head for shore or call for help.

The skipper saw no need to do either and kept boat on course for uk. Apparently not worried at all aboyt any danger of boat sinking.

When skipper went asleep they apparentlyu tried to send a mayday and also triggered some sort of alarm (dsc ? Epirb? - telegraph didn;t say what) Skipper woke up and was furious as done contrary to his orders. They then over powered him and waited for rescue.

Make your own mind up from these "facts" as presented by telegraph.

My take on them is new crew get frigtened by some moderate wind that doesn't faze skipper. Crew worried more and not reassured by logic of leaving plenty of searoom and decide skipper is mad. skipper eventually sleeps and mutiny is staged.

If my interpretation and telegraphs reporting is correct what do you do with crew? Personally if is the case would like to see the fined for the "crime" and use the money to recoup rescue costs. To not do so would seriously undermine skippers authority. On most boats cruising round the solent obeying the skipper is all "part of the fun" but i think many novices don;t realise that skipper does have legal responsibilities and rights and a boat can;t be run by committee when it comes to certain situations.

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[floatything]

Re: Couple overpower skipper \'trying to sink his boat

Found these 2 links on another Newsgroup...

http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=3303972


So what's the truth?



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[jac]

Re: Couple overpower skipper \'trying to sink his boat

The sunday times did an update

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.timesonline.co.uk/newspaper/0,,176-1206973_2,00.html>http://www.timesonline.co.uk/newspaper/0,,176-1206973_2,00.html</A>

couple of interesting things in

1) the couple didn't tell the authorities that the skipper was on board after they were airlifted off. He was only discovered when someone came along to tow the vessel in.

2) The crew were begging him to put into a port - paper called the coast " The coast of death" - don't know the area but if it is a notorious one then i don't blame him for staying out.

3) The police have put the incident down to panic. A Guardia Civil spokesman said: “There was no storm that day but large waves for an experienced skipper can be a storm for two people who have hardly ever sailed before.”

Worst thing is its the skipper who now has to pay a £2000 bill for the "rescue."
whilst i agree that it might be harsh expecting the authorities to pay shouldn't it be the crew. I know the skipper is legally responsible etc but in a case like this.....

I wonder if he has a case to sue them for the money?

<hr width=100% size=1><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by jac on 09/08/2004 10:22 (server time).</FONT></P>

 

[peterb]

Re: Couple overpower skipper \'trying to sink his boat

What is the penalty for mutiny nowadays? And is the case tried in the flag state or the port state?

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[Jools_of_Top_Cat]

Re: Couple overpower skipper \'trying to sink his boat

has to be the flag, the law was broken on a british flagged vessel in international waters.

<hr width=100% size=1>Julian

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.topcatsail.co.uk>

</A>

 

[Jools_of_Top_Cat]

Re: Couple overpower skipper \'trying to sink his boat

he should have shot them

then at least we would have seen old law in action

<hr width=100% size=1>Julian

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.topcatsail.co.uk>

</A>

 

[doris]

Idiot skipper \'s own fault.

Maybe I'm old fashioned but I thought that the skipper's duty on a boat is always the well being of the boat and crew. This man took a small totally novice crew out into the ocean and proved to be completely incompetant as to looking after their mental state, never mind his own. Any experienced sailor on this BB must be able to remember their first offshore blow....if they say they were not worried they are either lying or void of any imagination, stupid maybe. The guy deserved all the fines he gets for whatever reasons and maybe next time he will act more responsibly and not cause SAR sevices' time to be wasted.

<hr width=100% size=1>Real men do it 2handed.

 

[tcm]

Re: more info needed

hm, from the limited (and often simply incorrect) info released initially, i'd want to know more details.

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[jac]

Re: Idiot skipper \'s own fault.

I Agree about him looking after their mental state they did seem to panic.
BUT

1) that doesn't excuse them trying to take over the boat then tying up the skipper. He is after all the expereinced one and legally in charge
2) at some point people have to take responsibility for their own actions. They decided to mutiny. No-one made them
3) He specifically tried to prevent them calling out SAR as it wasn't needed. There is no real case for him to be penalised as he had as much part in them being called out in error as you and I

Put yourself in his position. You have two crew who think its too rough and demand you head for the coast so you can all be "safe". You as skipper with responsibility for their welbeing realise its dangerous to close what is probably a lee shore and want to stay out at sea, only to find your crew turning on the engine and heading in when you're off watch and then setting off an epirb when the skipper wakes up.

No wonder the poor chap was exhausted and dehydrated. Had to handle the boat on his own cos the crew couldn't be trusted and then they left him tied up alone on board for several hours after they were evacuated.

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[stephenmartin]

Re: more info needed

I too would like to hear the full facts......

On my first channel crossing to Fecamp we lost an engine and ran into a F7 and finished on a night/morning crossing.....a rough unpredicted sea is terrifying....the only thing that frightens me now is a F8/9....

The crew eventually dreamt up a story to justify why they should not stay even suggesting that I was incompetent and in-experienced....I got the boat there....got it fixed and got it home to Brighton....all very safely.....A very steep learning curve which indeed builds good characters....

What did I learn......CHOOSE YOUR CREW VERY CAREFULLY......your life depends on them......most boats will take anything the sea can throw at them except a duff crew....once the crew has lost it you are DOOMED.....Needless to say that crew are no longer friends of mine....

The skipper/spanish should proceed against the crew for attempted murder....They should be liable for all rescue costs....IMHO of course

<hr width=100% size=1>Don't make the same mistake twice...Make a different one

 

[doris]

Re: Idiot skipper \'s own fault.

I take your points but IMHO he cocked it up much earlier by letting it get the state it did. Had he been on top of things earlier then the spiral would never had started, he appears to have just left thongs and tried to bully the crew without them ever believing him. I am the least PC person around but the days of the Chain Gang approach, once on board have, gone.

<hr width=100% size=1>Real men do it 2handed.

 

[CharlotteRusse]

Re: Idiot skipper \'s own fault.

"I take your points but IMHO he cocked it up much earlier by letting it get the state it did. Had he been on top of things earlier then the spiral would never had started, he appears to have just left thongs"

I've tried leaving 'thongs' on the boat as well, never had the desired effect though.

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