Cost of re-rigging a 60ft

[geem]

What size wire? A jump from 12mm to 14mm doubles the cost of wire alone. I would be expect the wire to be at least 14mm. Ballpark £20/30k depending on bottlescrews etc

 

[Kelpie]

What size wire? A jump from 12mm to 14mm doubles the cost of wire alone. I would be expect the wire to be at least 14mm. Ballpark £20/30k depending on bottlescrews etc

Ouch. I feel that my number out of a hat might have been a bit low.
I have re-rigged twice, and got quotes for a third.

1- 27ft, 5mm wire, new bottlescrews, in 2010- £425.
2- 33ft, 7mm wire, new bottlescrews and using swageless terminals at one end, reusing existing swageless terminals at the other: £750 (quote only, in 2016).
3- 39ft, 8mm wire, reused old bottlescrews, added swageless terminals on one end, had to order a second forestay due to being an idiot, pulled all chainplates and replaced one, 2022, £1700.

So to the OP, the devil is in the detail. If your boat has swageless terminals throughout and you are happy to reuse them, and you aren't replacing bottlescrews or chainplates, then it's essentially just the cost of the wire.
At the other end of the scale, you might be replacing absolutely everything, and paying someone to do it for you, and then it's going to be a vastly different figure.
As a project boat I'm going to guess that it's a lot closer to the latter, unfortunately.

 

[savageseadog]

Is the re-rig really necessary?

 

[Tranona]

Is the re-rig really necessary?

If you want to get insurance it is. Insurers are very risk adverse these days and would not like an old 60' boat with rigging of unknown provenance. Equally in my experience having just been through this, riggers are reluctant to give any kind of "good" report if they don't know the provenance either. Of course you can do it yourself but unless you can show date of wires insurers may still refuse.

 

[savageseadog]

From what I see of rig failures, the wire or rod itself, rarely fails unless actually damaged. It's the ends terminations and ancilliaries that fail.

 

[Sandy]

If you want to get insurance it is. Insurers are very risk adverse these days and would not like an old 60' boat with rigging of unknown provenance. Equally in my experience having just been through this, riggers are reluctant to give any kind of "good" report if they don't know the provenance either. Of course you can do it yourself but unless you can show date of wires insurers may still refuse.

I had my rigging done last year at Allspars. Invoice scanned and emailed to my insurance company, thank you sir we will place that on file. No arguments if I ever have a rigging issue on a dark and stormy night.

When I do a long ocean voyage the rigging will be checked and the invoice copied to the insurance company.

 

[Tranona]

From what I see of rig failures, the wire or rod itself, rarely fails unless actually damaged. It's the ends terminations and ancilliaries that fail.

That is true - but when did facts really inform insurer's decisions. The received wisdom is that rigging has a finite life, although nobody has yet come up with any evidence that is the case, nor if it was, what the life is so it is easy to just stick to an arbitrary figure, start using it, then people have to change their wire at that time. Then riggers (inevitably) agree that is a wise thing to do so it becomes "fact" - based on "expert opinion" rather than evidence.

This is the way of the world now - in our context you just have to follow the Studland saga to see how embedded such thinking is in our society. Really pleased I plied my academic trade when serious thinkers like Karl Popper dominated the discourse.

 

[savageseadog]

.........Then riggers (inevitably) agree that is a wise thing to do so it becomes "fact" - based on "expert opinion" rather than evidence.

This is the way of the world now - in our context you just have to follow the Studland saga to see how embedded such thinking is in our society. Really pleased I plied my academic trade when serious thinkers like Karl Popper dominated the discourse.

For "expert opinion" substitute "based on the fact we make lots of money from promoting the myth"

 

[Sandy]

For "expert opinion" substitute "based on the fact we make lots of money from promoting the myth"

Let's call it preventative maintenance that will hopefully save at least one life a year. I know of one poster to this forum in the past who has had a demast at sea. It happened to me in a dinghy decades ago and was no fun at all.

 

[Devon Boy]

Trouble and cost rise with the square (cube?) of the boat length. When you start using the word project, I reckon it just grows another power or two. My 8m job is quite enough, unless there's a good reason for needing - not wanting, needing - a boat that size, my advice would be to stay as far away from temptation as you can.

But then, that's always my advice for any project. If you listen, chances are you haven't got what it takes to see it through. If you have, you'll listen then go ahead anyway!

I love your logic!!

I’m mostly governed by size due to the number of small ankle biters and the need for a specific cabin arrangement.

One of my children has some additional needs that mean he needs his own space.
Hopefully I can offset some of the cost long term by coding the thing!!

 

[Devon Boy]

The owner of the 50' Kaufman, post 9 above, and I did wonder about buying Pasha together. We went to have a look.

Pacha Sailing

She is the aluminium equivalent of Kukri.

She was a lovely yacht (and still is) but not really the yacht to use for a day sail and not really a yacht to sail short handed. Under our ownership she would have sat idle (the death knell for any yacht) and we gave her a miss. The Kaufman 50 was sold and my friend sails Etchells frequently (he was a skiff sailor). My wife and I sail a 38' cat and are quite happy making passages of 100nm in 10 hours - just the 2 of us. I have crewed on performance cruising cats (Schionnings) where the owners cannot sail them, because they are so big, unless they have crew.

But Pasha was a bit of a project boat, she had many thousand invested in her - and then the owners sold her (never realising the benefits of their investment).

But its good that people derive pleasure from completing a project boat - it takes all sorts - and credit to them

Not for us.

Jonathan

That is a stunning yacht!!


As I have mentioned above somewhat governed by number of kids and some other factors.
Hoping to do some long passages, trans Atlantic, eastern US maybe Canada in a good few years so I would like to think it will get use. 5 year plan is to have something ready to go so we have a bit of time to make it ready.

?

 

[mjcoon]

That is a stunning yacht!!

Even if it has strangely "battoned" (sic) sails...

 

[Stemar]

I love your logic!!

I’m mostly governed by size due to the number of small ankle biters and the need for a specific cabin arrangement.

One of my children has some additional needs that mean he needs his own space.
Hopefully I can offset some of the cost long term by coding the thing!!

With a gang like that, you've justified the need for a boat of that size. If you can find a mooring at a sensible price, I reckon you could get close to justifying the boat on economic grounds as a week aboard could be cheaper than flights and a hotel!

Good luck with it all.

 

[dunedin]

Hopefully I can offset some of the cost long term by coding the thing!!

Worth researching that carefully before relying on that contributing anything to the costs.

I am no expert, but others on here who are have often poured damp waters of reality on these aspirations (unless a typical charter type boat and placed on near full time charter).

 

[Devon Boy]

Worth researching that carefully before relying on that contributing anything to the costs.

I am no expert, but others on here who are have often poured damp waters of reality on these aspirations (unless a typical charter type boat and placed on near full time charter).

I have previously arranged coding for others boats, fitting out ready for survey etc. And whilst there is obviously a cost associated with maintaining the relevant equipment onboard and keeping things current most if not all the equipment I would expect to have onboard if I am planning on taking my family offshore anyway.

 

[geem]

Out here in the Caribbean, a 60ft boat is a very common site. Boats in the 40-50 range are at the smaller end of the spectrum. If you have the skills, the funds and the enthusiasm then I would go for it.
We sail a 44ft boat. It's spacious but by the time you have all your toys, stores, etc onboard, it doesn't feel like a large space. With a large family a 60ft boat makes a lot of sense. Out here in the Caribbean, life is at anchor. No marina costs. We sailed from the UK in July last year and didn't go into a marina until October. It would have been quite possible to not enter a marina at all before arriving in the Caribbean. This can save thousands in marina costs especially in peak season in Spain and Portugal.
Good luck

 

[jamie N]

I used SWR for my Folkboat, and paid below £600.00. The service was faultless, and the wires arrived within the week. The mast was off of the boat at the time, so I did the measuring and fitting of them myself.
I'm over stating it: I ran a tape measure and wrote done the numbers, and once the new wire arrived, I put the pins into the mast fittings.
Not a big deal.

 

[Devon Boy]

I used SWR for my Folkboat, and paid below £600.00. The service was faultless, and the wires arrived within the week. The mast was off of the boat at the time, so I did the measuring and fitting of them myself.
I'm over stating it: I ran a tape measure and wrote done the numbers, and once the new wire arrived, I put the pins into the mast fittings.
Not a big deal.

What LOA is your Folkboat?

 

[dunedin]

What LOA is your Folkboat?

Closer in size to your tender than a 60 foot yacht

 

[ridgy]

I used S3i last time and didn't even have to measure. I just sent them the old ones to copy.

That might not be realistic though on 60' rigging, probably looking at 200kg of weight.