Cost of extras on a new boat

[Zing]

Was having a look at the new Leopard PC today and i was stunned by the cost of some of the individual extras
Leopard 40 Powercat

I see they discounted the price equal to a third of the extras value. My understanding is the mass production builders aim for a low headline price to get your attention, with low dealer margins, then offer massive margins to their dealers in the options items, who have to then work for their income by flogging hard the extras once you have bitten the hook.

It would be interesting to see what discount you got if you struck out all options.

 

[Stemar]

A lot of those extras involve wiring and other work that's far easier and neater to do during the build, rather than having to pull stuff apart afterwards - you probably don't want to do that on a £1M boat. Yes the prices are a bit (a lot!) ouch for those of us who are used to counting the pennies, but maybe not so much for the purchasers, who will expect everything to be right from the word go.

All the same, not for me, even if the price was pocket change. It really is hard to make a motor cat look good, especially when you want to squeeze all that accommodation in. I like the idea, but I want something with class.

F'rinstance:

A bit more than a million, (4 times as much) but that's a nice boat

 

[Tranona]

I see they discounted the price equal to a third of the extras value. My understanding is the mass production builders aim for a low headline price to get your attention, with low dealer margins, then offer massive margins to their dealers in the options items, who have to then work for their income by flogging hard the extras once you have bitten the hook.

It would be interesting to see what discount you got if you struck out all options.

Nothing unusual about that. When buying a new boat you largely ignore the details of how the price is built up with the mixture of base price, options and delivery/commissioning plus possibly a part exchange. The only thing that matters is the final cost to you of getting the boat to the spec you want in commission where you want it. In both the new boats I have bought prevailing exchange rates also played a part. For example the first one was bought in DM (remember those) and I "saved" enough by buying a forward contract at the best exchange rate to pay for the instrument upgrade package. In the second there was a big difference between the exchange rate when the UK list was set and the time that I ordered the boat (which was built specifically for my order) The dealer bought a forward and we shared the saving. As a little sweetener an extra pair of winches were added free as my pen was poised over signing the contract. Add to that the allowance for my old boat was substantially more that the net price I would have achieved for selling it myself. Overall the final cost was equal to about a 20% discount on the list price.

There is nothing out of the ordinary about this kind of deal when a builder comes to you (through the dealer) saying they have an empty build slot in 3 months time and would be happy to do a deal. It is different now (as it has been in the past, for example when I bought the first one) where most builders have anything up to a 3 year order book. I expect the rebate on offer for the Leopard is because it is a new boat and they are struggling to get it going in the market

 

[Daydream believer]

A lot of those extras involve wiring and other work that's far easier and neater to do during the build, rather than having to pull stuff apart afterwards - you probably don't want to do that on a £1M boat.

Obviously my boat was at the very bottom of the scale but I was pleased to see that the builder had included all the wiring for the normal extras, within the loom. ie fridge, shower, autopilot,charger, helm instrumentation, mast, VHF etc etc. So installation did not involve much wiring in the first instance. It was only later when I wanted to change worn out kit that issues arose. Now my boat is littered with draw cords.
I would have imagined that further up the scale, a builder would put power supplies to various vantage points, to assist "after build" installation, by the dealers. There must be enough leaway in the price for them to do that.

 

[Laysula]

My boat, Bavaria 350, was £ 69,000 new in 1997 the extras were another £20,000 on top. Some of the extras even at todays prices were eye watering.

 

[LittleSister]

A bit more than a million, (4 times as much) but that's a nice boat

Pity about it having the wrong anchor, though.

 

[peter gibbs]

I can understand why posters think the 40PC is ugly. Maybe it is. I'm sure most people who see my FP Greenland 34 think the same. On the other hand most people who come onboard marvel at the amount of living space and usable deck space we have. I'd bite your hand off for a 40PC but I'm too tight to spend that type of money. I'm on the look out for a s/h Leopard 43PC or FP MY 44 -owners versions- and hoping prices may drop a bit heading into the winter. Still those of you who read the Euromillions thread will know I'm soon due a big win so, who knows.

Too long the new boat market has been characterised by selling prices to recover manufacturing and design costs, and desirable toys to deliver the profit. Older sailors recall the car market went through this tunnel decades ago. Buying good condition used is of course the answer for the prudent yacht. Let the easily impressed take pole position on the one way economic trip that is boat ownership!

 

[capnsensible]

Well they need to sack their blind dog a bit sharpish.?

You won't get anywhere trying to tell people what they should or shouldn't like.

But I sure you know that and just being flippant.....

 

[Daydream believer]

You won't get anywhere trying to tell people what they should or shouldn't like.

But I sure you know that and just being flippant.....

Caught me out again

 

[AngusMcDoon]

All the same, not for me, even if the price was pocket change. It really is hard to make a motor cat look good, especially when you want to squeeze all that accommodation in. I like the idea, but I want something with class.

Which is better, sailing a fugly boat but looking out at the pretty ones, or sailing a pretty boat and getting your eyeballs insulted looking at the fugly ones?

I inclined to believe that the former option is better. Everyone else can have the pretty boats for my ocular enjoyment and wince at my fugly one.

 

[LittleSister]

The other aspect of 'extras' is how well specced the basic boat is. It's not just how many optional 'nice to haves' are included in the basic spec, but also whether the basic fittings such as winches, engines, etc. are the bare minimum or adequately sized.

Friend bought a brand new boat, and paid rather a lot extra for bigger winch and engine sizes, and various other upgrades, having been a bit sceptical of the adequacy of the standard fittings he'd experienced on the demonstrator boat. I think he later replaced the masthead halyard block and a few other bits, having come to the conclusion they weren't really up to the job for the size of boat.

Didn't put him off, though. He later bought another, larger, boat of the same brand.

I suspect that he, and many other buyers, enjoy the musing about which extras to get as an important part of the 'buying a new boat' experience.

It's not something I'll ever need to worry about!

 

[Tranona]

I suspect that he, and many other buyers, enjoy the musing about which extras to get as an important part of the 'buying a new boat' experience.

It's not something I'll ever need to worry about!

That is exactly right. Basic specs have improved significantly over the years, but there is still a lot of choice, and increasingly so particularly in the non essential areas. For example on my Bavaria (smallest, cheapest and most basic) there were 4 choices of fabric, 4 choices of wood finish and 3 of flooring. Other extras were mostly in packages which were well thought out. Almost every boat has engine options and with some the standard is marginal, but the upgrade was modestly priced (£1200 from memory). I was surprised how close I got to my "ideal" spec with factory fit options and the only significant bits fitted locally were a galvanic isolator, audio (I did not want the expensive factory fit Fusion), battery monitor and remote control for the windlass and bow thruster. I perhaps made a mistake on the sails as the upgrade package cost almost as much a having equivalent sails made here and no allowance available for not taking the standard sails.

 

[Refueler]

... when it comes to 'extras' to add to a new boat ..... lets be honest - its like cars .....

Buy new and spend a fortune on options / extras kitting out.
or
Buy a near new that's already been kitted out and accept that you are not first owner - but save a substantial amount of money that can be used on other items etc.

I think I need to explain a little there ....

When I say 'kitted out' ... I mean that original first owner has had the options / extras fitted by manufacturer .... as well as any others he may have fitted himself.

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

But anyway moving on ...

There is one aspect of options / extras fitted during build of the boat ... later servicing or repair ... It can be a real pain when cables are led behind manufacturers fitted panels etc.

One well known brand of boat I sailed on - developed a fault in its switch panel. The amount of work it took once back at Marina to fix what was in reality a small fault was mind-blowing. We took longer to remove as carefully as possible panels to get at the fault - than actually fixing the fault itself. Getting the panels back in place and aligned was a jigsaw puzzle in itself as well.

 

[Supertramp]

Sometimes comparing buying new vs used is like comparing apples with oranges. A new version of a boat, especially an older, good quality make, can be 2 to 3x the cost used. But often the real choice made is between a smaller new boat (with extras) versus a larger, old boat (with repair costs). A new 10m boat versus a used 12m for example. Depends what you are looking for, your time and DIY ability.

That said, the cost of extras is a major factor, new or used.

 

[johnalison]

That is exactly right. Basic specs have improved significantly over the years, but there is still a lot of choice, and increasingly so particularly in the non essential areas. For example on my Bavaria (smallest, cheapest and most basic) there were 4 choices of fabric, 4 choices of wood finish and 3 of flooring. Other extras were mostly in packages which were well thought out. Almost every boat has engine options and with some the standard is marginal, but the upgrade was modestly priced (£1200 from memory). I was surprised how close I got to my "ideal" spec with factory fit options and the only significant bits fitted locally were a galvanic isolator, audio (I did not want the expensive factory fit Fusion), battery monitor and remote control for the windlass and bow thruster. I perhaps made a mistake on the sails as the upgrade package cost almost as much a having equivalent sails made here and no allowance available for not taking the standard sails.

I haven’t looked at recent offerings but boats are often sold as basic or with something like a ‘boat show’ spec. Our HR came as ‘Scandinavian spec’ with things like fridge, heating, fully-battened main etc included but not VHF or instruments. Back in ‘87 we bought a Sadler 29 with a similar offer but in that case we were at the limit of our budget and had to negotiate as many items to be left off as possible and still retain the offer price, leaving me to fit things such as a boarding ladder. I managed to get a ladder that was far superior to the standard one at half the cost.