alt
Well-Known Member
Out of curiosity, in the UK, how much would the above cost?
Assuming the gelcoat is in good nick, no oxidation.
Assuming the gelcoat is in good nick, no oxidation.
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Compound / Polish / Wax a 37' Sports Cruiser
- Thread starter alt
- Start date
jimmy_the_builder
Well-Known Member
I don't suppose this really helps you, sorry, but as it happens we've just done exactly this on my Targa 40 this week. €600 including materials, and this also included cleaning the teak.
BruceK
Well-Known Member
Mine was £430 including cockpits, 3 men 2 days
Fishtigua
Well-Known Member
Just the hull, in good order, around £550/600. Any extras are, y'know, extra.
Fishtigua
Well-Known Member
Oh, and if you own a red hulled Arvor 230 that hasn't seen a lick of polish in 10 years, don't ask for a compound and polish 3 hours before launching as my back and shoulders still ache!!!:
[2068]
...
Somewhere around £500.
alandalus11
Well-Known Member
For a 40 foot sports cruiser, top sides and hull, probably short of £24 with wife and I over a weekend and the boat looks shiny like new.
Elessar
Well-Known Member
might cost you a house though.
BruceK
Well-Known Member
Polishing is a skilled art form imo. I have tried it before and despite best efforts it never looks as good as when a pro does it. In fact the last few hours of work sections look like they would have been better left alone!
alandalus11
Well-Known Member
I leave the polishing till the last few weeks before boat gets launched. Wife is itching to get boating again so is more than happy to help as she knows that the new season is only weeks away. Have to say, polishing is the only thing she enjoys doing and I don't see her the rest of the time when other work needs doing. :encouragement:
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sharpness
Well-Known Member
That is good value. That equates to a payment of £71.60 per person per day.
Marine Reflections
Well-Known Member
Agree with others, you can buy this type of service for around £600 as an off the shelf type of service.
I confess, an off the shelf price is something I personally struggle to offer and I've been providing this service for a few decades more than most.
I've corrected 40ft boats for £500 and also for over £5000.
The aim:
The aim is to create a flat, uniform surface to then further polish up into a high clarity reflection and then offer protection. Broken down into offering a 'compound, polish and wax'.
Looking at the variables for a moment, you have the following:
1, Different levels of gel coat hardness due to properties, quality and age.
2, Different levels of current condition.
3, Different expectations of the finished surface.
4, Different prep requirements.
5, Different weathering on certain areas, requiring less or more attention.
1, Different levels of gel coat hardness:
Gel coat continues to cure throughout its life, the older it is, the harder it becomes. Also, the gel coat is not a standard, advancements in production and additives make it very much chalk and cheese. So for example; taking a standard 1200grit wet n dry to one gel coat will have different consequences to another. This can be thought of in the same manner through all the polishing products and their various grit levels. All gel coat is not equal.
2, Different levels of current condition:
A gel coat's life will differ even on the same model and year due to how it has been looked after. How it has been cleaned, with what and by whom. If it has been heavily oxidised in the past and polished up for sale, the properties have been compromised leading to less durability.
3, Different expectations of a finished surface:
In my eyes, a perfect surface is simply standard. It's how the surface should be. It should have a high clarity reflection in order to offer the most defence on its own, without protection. This can be harder to achieve than most people think, certainly if that surface is now under the scrutiny of good lighting or various guide coats to highlight defects. I've been asked many times to just to (run over it with a polisher) and I've turned them down much to their surprise. The reason is that I'm the last person to have worked on those surfaces, other professionals or clients might ask who did the work and I'd be without a paddle. Sadly, what it takes to create a standard perfect finish requires much more than a few passes with various grit stages despite the principle being the same.
4, Different prep requirements.
Turning up to perform surface correction one would expect a level of prep. I've turned up to boats covered in green crud all over, I've turned up to spotlessly clean ones and many somewhere in the middle.
Decent prep goes further, masking, removal of names, fixtures and fittings.
Considering the impact one grain of sand would have if it got caught up in the polishing head (at any stage) the surfaces need to be 100% grit-free, although you can do this as you go. They also need to be free of old polishes or protective sealers.
I call this getting the surfaces back to raw, it is very important and of course, differs from boat to boat.
5, Different weathering on certain areas, requiring less or more attention:
Again, pretty self-explanatory, some areas will need more or fewer stages due to exposure, how it's been cleaned and so on before it can be ready for protection. I've used sanding discs on some areas only to be starting out on others with very fine liquid and a soft foam pad.
Now, how the above can be offered as a price over the phone is beyond me.
I get to see this day in, day out.
Client finds a professional polisher (a guy with a machine and products who charges) clients ask 'how much to polish my boat?", professional replies "£600".
Regardless of the quality of the work, how long it takes, the pro knows that they are getting £600 for the job. Providing the client is 'happy'.
Now I can put a bit of product on a pad and go round seemingly polishing the boat. I would have polished the boat, my polisher went all over and it does look shiny, at least for now. Do I deserve my £600?
If so, I can probably provide this type of service in a few hours.
This type of pro comes and goes in all marinas, reputation catches up with them and they are off into something else.
In fact, most of my work comes from correcting this type of service. Deep swirling a 40ft boat is not value for money, it will cost more to correct than the initial cost of the job.
Of course, it is not always the case, I've found guys who are really good at what they do and understand the correction process, yet they are charging peanuts.
So what can you do, how do you know you are actually getting good value unless you know your onions?
Firstly, I'd ask the person performing the work to explain the current condition of the surfaces and how they would go about dealing with each section.
This would tell you a great deal about their understanding of what is going on and hint about how well they intend to perform it.
Ask for a demo patch to be performed on some of the worst sections. This will be good for both the pro and for you. Both can find out what the required stages will be and you will be able to see the end results. You may get this for free, or it may cost you an hour. It will be money well spent.
Lastly, ask about. Yards usually have a few polishers and folk will be only too quick to tell you if they would use a person again.
Tony
I confess, an off the shelf price is something I personally struggle to offer and I've been providing this service for a few decades more than most.
I've corrected 40ft boats for £500 and also for over £5000.
The aim:
The aim is to create a flat, uniform surface to then further polish up into a high clarity reflection and then offer protection. Broken down into offering a 'compound, polish and wax'.
Looking at the variables for a moment, you have the following:
1, Different levels of gel coat hardness due to properties, quality and age.
2, Different levels of current condition.
3, Different expectations of the finished surface.
4, Different prep requirements.
5, Different weathering on certain areas, requiring less or more attention.
1, Different levels of gel coat hardness:
Gel coat continues to cure throughout its life, the older it is, the harder it becomes. Also, the gel coat is not a standard, advancements in production and additives make it very much chalk and cheese. So for example; taking a standard 1200grit wet n dry to one gel coat will have different consequences to another. This can be thought of in the same manner through all the polishing products and their various grit levels. All gel coat is not equal.
2, Different levels of current condition:
A gel coat's life will differ even on the same model and year due to how it has been looked after. How it has been cleaned, with what and by whom. If it has been heavily oxidised in the past and polished up for sale, the properties have been compromised leading to less durability.
3, Different expectations of a finished surface:
In my eyes, a perfect surface is simply standard. It's how the surface should be. It should have a high clarity reflection in order to offer the most defence on its own, without protection. This can be harder to achieve than most people think, certainly if that surface is now under the scrutiny of good lighting or various guide coats to highlight defects. I've been asked many times to just to (run over it with a polisher) and I've turned them down much to their surprise. The reason is that I'm the last person to have worked on those surfaces, other professionals or clients might ask who did the work and I'd be without a paddle. Sadly, what it takes to create a standard perfect finish requires much more than a few passes with various grit stages despite the principle being the same.
4, Different prep requirements.
Turning up to perform surface correction one would expect a level of prep. I've turned up to boats covered in green crud all over, I've turned up to spotlessly clean ones and many somewhere in the middle.
Decent prep goes further, masking, removal of names, fixtures and fittings.
Considering the impact one grain of sand would have if it got caught up in the polishing head (at any stage) the surfaces need to be 100% grit-free, although you can do this as you go. They also need to be free of old polishes or protective sealers.
I call this getting the surfaces back to raw, it is very important and of course, differs from boat to boat.
5, Different weathering on certain areas, requiring less or more attention:
Again, pretty self-explanatory, some areas will need more or fewer stages due to exposure, how it's been cleaned and so on before it can be ready for protection. I've used sanding discs on some areas only to be starting out on others with very fine liquid and a soft foam pad.
Now, how the above can be offered as a price over the phone is beyond me.
I get to see this day in, day out.
Client finds a professional polisher (a guy with a machine and products who charges) clients ask 'how much to polish my boat?", professional replies "£600".
Regardless of the quality of the work, how long it takes, the pro knows that they are getting £600 for the job. Providing the client is 'happy'.
Now I can put a bit of product on a pad and go round seemingly polishing the boat. I would have polished the boat, my polisher went all over and it does look shiny, at least for now. Do I deserve my £600?
If so, I can probably provide this type of service in a few hours.
This type of pro comes and goes in all marinas, reputation catches up with them and they are off into something else.
In fact, most of my work comes from correcting this type of service. Deep swirling a 40ft boat is not value for money, it will cost more to correct than the initial cost of the job.
Of course, it is not always the case, I've found guys who are really good at what they do and understand the correction process, yet they are charging peanuts.
So what can you do, how do you know you are actually getting good value unless you know your onions?
Firstly, I'd ask the person performing the work to explain the current condition of the surfaces and how they would go about dealing with each section.
This would tell you a great deal about their understanding of what is going on and hint about how well they intend to perform it.
Ask for a demo patch to be performed on some of the worst sections. This will be good for both the pro and for you. Both can find out what the required stages will be and you will be able to see the end results. You may get this for free, or it may cost you an hour. It will be money well spent.
Lastly, ask about. Yards usually have a few polishers and folk will be only too quick to tell you if they would use a person again.
Tony
Greg2
Well-Known Member
Quite an insight Tony - thank you for taking the time to share it. Very easy to go for the lowest price without appreciating the complexity and work involved to get a proper job done. Makes me realise what an amateur I am when doing our boat! 
alt
Well-Known Member
Thanks everyone. For the first time ever, decided to just pay someone to do the job.... don't have the patience anymore to DIY.
sharpness
Well-Known Member
Just so there is a comparison to prices mentioned, how much did the job cost?
alt
Well-Known Member
600 euro in West of Ireland inc materials. Not cheap but the guy is a perfectionist (I've seen his work) so didn't haggle
SEARANGER ANCASTER
Well-Known Member
Did it myself , compound , then polish then wax. Takes a good few hours over a couple of days . I tend not to get pulled into this revolution of "detailing" and "paint correction" and all this expensive black art talk that gets banded about by car cleaning companies and now boat cleaning outfits as well. At the end of the day if the car or boat is clean , shiny and got a bit of protection that will do me. After all they are just that , cars to be driven and boats to be sailed and not "concourse" items just for show.
Just my opinion , if you choose to spend thousands to have the paint corrected , clay barred , detailed or any of that bollocks , then crack on , fill your boots.
Just my opinion , if you choose to spend thousands to have the paint corrected , clay barred , detailed or any of that bollocks , then crack on , fill your boots.
alt
Well-Known Member
To be fair, to get the getlcoat pristine again, I know it needs a compound / polish / wax (3 stage) - I was planning on doing this myself until I caught up with a guy locally who I know would do a good job. We discussed the stages, what pads would be used and what compound / polish / wax would be used. I know for sure that this would take me 3 days (one stage per day) and I would be aching after. So, when I got the quote, I felt it was more worth my while to pay someone to do it rather than 1) take 3 days off and 2) be in agony afterwards.
stelican
Well-Known Member
Quite agree with you it is alot of unnecessary work just to have the boat clean and protected. Still some people fall for it the same as other expensive quotes for the same end result, But as Alt said you don't ache for days afterwards!
Marine Reflections
Well-Known Member
Quite right, it's not for everybody and circumstances differ.
Some, like yourself, just want to keep on top of things and will do the basics to ensure the boat (or car) doesn't fall behind too far cosmetically that they can't easily recover from.
I don't think you've been pulled into this 'revolution' just yet, but you have corrected your surfaces, then polished with a finer product to recover from the correction and then finally offered a layer of wax to interact with the elements.
I'd say you were on a slippery slope!
You don't need to understand why, how or when you should clay bar a surface (as it's been mentioned) but I can assure you it's not some mystical black art, it's just rubbing a surface with a lump of clay that pulls off bonded contaminates so they don't get caught up in the polishing stages and make surfaces look as though they've been washed with a brillo pad for your efforts.
Some don't buy into it because they don't need to and/or don't want to, others see it perhaps as a snake oil type of stage or 'unnecessary work' and they are being fleeced, but that doesn't make it any less of a viable pre-stage when polishing a surface that has bonded contaminates.
Wiping a surface free of old waxes prior to polishing can also be seen as 'unnecessary work'.
Just these two very quick stages alone will reduce a polishing pad from gripping the surface and there will be less of a fight, meaning less fatigue, as well as eliminating one of the main causes of swirl marks and micro scratches.
For some (including me) we need all the help we can get in making tasks like a polish up as easy as possible and as productive as possible, why some might even be looking for awesome results.
It's all in the details....detailing.
I do understand just how confusing and frustrating cleaning, detailing, restoration and correction can be, certainly when we are just after the same end result, a clean, scratch-free surface that is well protected.
Manufacturers seem to do it on purpose, which brand, which products, which stage, this gadget goes with these pads or your boat will sink and folk are fed up with it all.
I do try to make sense of it all and contribute to this forum.
