Combination oven fitted into galley - air gap

It is sourced locally at low cost but (logically) is a Chinese something brand.

Still available at some £74 but you'd have to replace the EU socket to fit your UK(?) standard. Still 240V though.

If you like I'll ship one to you at cost
 
Mrs. Spi aka Helga, wife of Hagar, is contemplating a London visit so if feasible might squeeze one into the carry-on luggage.

Let me know..
 
Whitelighter said:
Hmm, not really keen on that. To help here is the cabinet in question:

36CCE72A-D0C2-4A54-BF2B-1E1D995CCE5B.jpg


The door is removable leaving a finished edge. No idea if the wood is laminate or solid. This is where Ferretti intended a microwave to go.

Dimensions of the opening are 500mm x 325mm. Internal dimensions are 530mm x 340mm.
There is a finished top to the cabinet but you can see there is significant box above it and to the left/right of it. I suspect I can cut away some or all of the internal boxing. Below is the stbd cabin.
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Looks good. you need 600 wide, height 450 and depth 550 to fit a proper oven. such as http://www.johnlewis.com/miele-h610...0a23fd5&s_kwcid=402x387030&tmad=c&tmcampid=73 Looks like will work. You need to get rid of the little shelf above to get round the height restriction; replace with slab of avonite or similar, then use some veneered plywood to make the base and sides. Take the sides out to the cheek at left of pic and the face of the window sill at right of pic - that gives you your 600mm width. For the base of the oven cabinet, have a bit of plywood that sits atop the GRP moulding that is the roof of the cabin. Varnish wood to match. Bring the face of the oven forward, (aftwards), if necessary to make enough depth

The only thing I can't tell from the pic is how much height you can claim without creating a lump under the base cushion of the dinette seat in front. In that case, you could chop into the cabin maybe and might find you do not protrude below the cabin ceiling, due to a void for inset lighting. Otherwise can you make an upholstered box in the cabin roof to cover the oven's 50mm incursion?
 
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I think the height is ok. That door is 325mm and the base of the seat above starts at the bottom
If the white leather trim. So I'd guess another 300mm easily - enough for the extra 150 for the oven. It's just a case of what air gap is required after that.

I'll pop the seat off the dinette above and see what that reveals. Might be a fairly straight forward job. Got a joiner out at some point to turn my drinks cabinet into a home for a lifting TV so I don't see why we can't do both.

The only thing I didn't understand was where you thought the avonite should go??
 
Whitelighter said:
I think the height is ok. That door is 325mm and the base of the seat above starts at the bottom
If the white leather trim. So I'd guess another 300mm easily - enough for the extra 150 for the oven. It's just a case of what air gap is required after that.

I'll pop the seat off the dinette above and see what that reveals. Might be a fairly straight forward job. Got a joiner out at some point to turn my drinks cabinet into a home for a lifting TV so I don't see why we can't do both.

The only thing I didn't understand was where you thought the avonite should go??
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Ah right, excellent, loads of height. Check here - with a proper built in oven you need hardly any air gap - they vent through the front eg this nice siemens one https://products.bsh-partner.com/pi...BS1B.pdf?errorUrl=http://www.siemens-home.com

If you have enough depth under the bum cushion of the dinette seat, then you can fit the oven flush, job done. Just discard the little shelf with the 3 ashtrays and fit oven right up to the wooden cheek piece at the left of picture. No avonite etc needed. The discarded shelf would give you easily enough material/nosing to hide any bits that needed finishing, eg top left in the picture after the oven is fitted

Alternatively, if you have a depth problem then let the oven sit out from the plywood face. Perhaps 150mm or something. THEN put an avonite shelf above it and varnished plywood to its base (using the nosing from the shelf that you'd be discarding) and also varnished plywood (lipped + veneered of course) to the right edge of oven as you look at the picture. The left is ok - the oven would go right up to the wooden cheek piece, and you'd put the top of the oven and the avonite just level with the start of the bullnose top edge of that cheek piece.

This looks very do-able
 
Yes.

I think I was distracted by trying to fit the hole, rather than considering the total space available and making my own hole.
A proper domestic oven like the two you have suggested definitely seems the way forward for the long term and for cruising longer than a weekend.

New job is going in next time I'm out. I have space for a dishwasher and wondering if a draw type might work. Though at the moment that is probably an extravagance too far.

The only other question is power - I haven't thoroughly checked but most of my 220v system has what I think are 13A breakers - would this be sufficient for the oven?
 
good stuff. This is way better than a tinny microwave, and is the way to go for proper cruising and proper roasts and cakes etc

That Siemens is 3kw, pure resistive load so no extra harmonic current like an induction hob, and therefore 13Amps at 230v is fine. Says so on spec sheet linked to above

That Siemens is what I fitted in my 2009 sq58; I really liked it
 
It does look good. I couldn't see on the spec sheet if the Seimans has a microwave function as well? I'll pop into a big currys or JL and have a look, though it might make more sense to buy in Spain.

What with this and my TV lift my cabinet maker mate is going to be busy
 
A cautionary tale for those who Do It Themselves:

A tame boat surveyor was telling me (in general terms) about an insurance claim for which he'd been engaged as an SME. Simply put, the boat owner had lodged a claim for fire damage. The source was traced to a misbehaving dehumidifier. The surveyor reported that the dehumidifier was a household/domestic unit and, thus, was NOT designed to cope with what was being asked of it when placed inside a MoBo. The insurance claim was denied and lead to hot, salt tears down the road.

...............so, you might want to consider having the new fit assessed by a marine electrician. Can't hurt.
 
Baseplate said:
A cautionary tale for those who Do It Themselves:

A tame boat surveyor was telling me (in general terms) about an insurance claim for which he'd been engaged as an SME. Simply put, the boat owner had lodged a claim for fire damage. The source was traced to a misbehaving dehumidifier. The surveyor reported that the dehumidifier was a household/domestic unit and, thus, was NOT designed to cope with what was being asked of it when placed inside a MoBo. The insurance claim was denied and lead to hot, salt tears down the road.

...............so, you might want to consider having the new fit assessed by a marine electrician. Can't hurt.
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Not doubting your story, but it is typical of the ignorance you see in insurance claims. The mistake the guy made was not DIY installing a dehumidifier, it was DIY handling an insurance claim. From the brief facts you give, I think I'd have won that argument with the insurers

I'm quite sure that my boat is insured against fire, including fire caused by my own negligence, and with no exclusion on account of the fact that appliances are domestic. Come to think of it, all of my appliances are domestic (ovens, fridges, freezers, hob, extractor, ironing machines, vacuum cleaners, toaster, kettle, waste disposal unit, coffee machine, washing machine, tumble drier) as they are in many many boats. Whitelighter has the same policy as me.
 
jfm said:
Not doubting your story, but it is typical of the ignorance you see in insurance claims. The mistake the guy made was not DIY installing a dehumidifier, it was DIY handling an insurance claim. From the brief facts you give, I think I'd have won that argument with the insurers

I'm quite sure that my boat is insured against fire, including fire caused by my own negligence, and with no exclusion on account of the fact that appliances are domestic. Come to think of it, all of my appliances are domestic (ovens, fridges, freezers, hob, extractor, ironing machines, vacuum cleaners, toaster, kettle, waste disposal unit, coffee machine, washing machine, tumble drier) as they are in many many boats. Whitelighter has the same policy as me.
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You're missing my point, I think.

Chap uses a domestic dehumidifier on a boat. A fire initiates. Chap approaches his insurers to claim for said fire. Insurers engage a SME to determine amount of loss and cause of fire. SME establishes that the domestic dehumidifier is the cause of the fire and, thus, the insurers refuse the claim.

The surveyor's comment to me (in essence) was that domestic dehumidifiers are NOT ideal for boats (in a house, the unit will reach a point when it will stop due to less moisture compared to a boat: with a boat, it's doing it's best to empty the marina).

I've always applied the same rule of thumb when buying a car. If the general chat is along the lines of, 'Oh, I've always serviced it myself', then that is usually my cue to move off in the general direction of 'Away'.
 
I don't think I am but I'm happy to agree to disagree.
I do agree the general thought that dehumidifiers are not great left unattended on boats; the nearby presence of the sea puts the crummy ones on the edge of running too much exactly as you say. Poster mjf on here is expert on that. But avoidance by an insurer of its liability under a contract is another matter altogether.
 
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I get it -I read it as the said " domestic appliance " was not fit for purpose on a BOAT -cos it can,t shut off -due to the water in the air -so sets fire .
I don,t read it as all domestic appliances like a kettle et al .

Oven install done DIY into a tight wooden space -potentially opens up a refuted claim if ins Co starts digging over fire damage caused by it .
Would help if Factory fit or accredited installer fitted .
Just say----- ing :)
 
Portofino said:
I get it -I read it as the said " domestic appliance " was not fit for purpose on a BOAT -cos it can,t shut off -due to the water in the air -so sets fire .
I don,t read it as all domestic appliances like a kettle et al .

Oven install done DIY into a tight wooden space -potentially opens up a refuted claim if ins Co starts digging over fire damage caused by it .
Would help if Factory fit or accredited installer fitted .
Just say----- ing :)
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And that-clumsily-was the point that I was trying to make. Personally, I would never consider fitting a unit such as a combi oven, given that my DIY skills are on a level with a small guppy.
 
A fitted combi oven like the ones JFM suggested come with a 3 pin 13A plug, and are designed to go into a cabinet.

Not really sure what an expert would add, and even the meakest of DIYers can surely put a plug in the wall???
 
There is indeed more to it than just plugging it in. The manufacturers of FREE STANDING microwaves are very clear in that they are not meant to be built in and if such a device was installed specifically contravening the clear instructions stated for air clearance there is a real risk that it could cause a fire and it is quite possible that the insurance would not cover it. The only microwaves that are designed to be built in to a cabinet are called INTEGRATED and even then there is a debate to be had regarding their suitability for marine use. I looked at the installation instructions for the one we just installed in my son in laws house and it specifically states that it is designed for domestic use only. I think we would be on firm enough grounds using a free standing MW on a worktop etc especially if only plugged in when in a marina or harbour etc but installing anything not stated by the manufacturer as "fit for purpose" in a boat is in my opinion risking a battle with insurers at least if anything were to happen.......
 
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