Whitelighter
Well-Known Member
All decent sized motor boats use domestic appliances.
I can't see what makes them not for for marine use
I can't see what makes them not for for marine use
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Combination oven fitted into galley - air gap
- Thread starter Whitelighter
- Start date
jimmy_the_builder
Well-Known Member
J, your autocorrect has defeated me here, genuinely not sure what you're trying to say?
Whitelighter
Well-Known Member
I think Apple need to make a binatone version of their next phone for people like me with fat thumbs
Hurricane
Well-Known Member
petem
Well-Known Member
Ahh - I see - its an Apple - not fit for marine use
Not fit for ANY use more like!
mjf
Well-Known Member
As JFM says I have some experience
I have done a write up on this now and my insurance co (Pants) is going to use same in their renewal papers etc
I will post it on this forum shortly as I'm on the boat currently and the write up on PC at home.
Nick_H
Well-Known Member
Use on a private pleasure boat is domestic use isn't it? ie. it's not commercial use.
boatmike
Well-Known Member
No if we are going to pick hairs The definition of "domestic" is "relating to the home" From the latin "domesticus derivative Domus or House. Hence Domicile etc.... Use on a boat is "Marine"
However I was not intending an exercise in pedantry, I really feel the original point was about microwave ovens designed to be free standing where the manufacturer expressly states that it shouldn't be built in to a cabinet. There is a further point that if an "integrated" oven which is indeed designed to be built in to a "domestic" cabinet is built in on a boat it should be OK but it certainly gives an insurer an excuse to avoid paying a claim if not sold for this purpose and DIY installed. Personally I would contact the manufacturer and get them to write or e-mail you to say they approve this use if it is installed as per their published instructions.
Not trying to be a smart arse here, I just think the point made by others regarding how slippery insurance companies can be in avoiding paying out claims is valid. Don't give them any excuse!
gjgm
Well-Known Member
Nonsense-that is what the Phantom 4 delivers, surely
At 45mph, so even the roasties will still be crisp.
Nick_H
Well-Known Member
Nor was I, apologies if it came across that way. I thought you were suggesting that Jez may invalidate his insurance if he installs an oven that states it is for "domestic use only". That's an important issue, not a pedantic one.
BTW, my boat has two master 240V switches on the main control panel, one for "air conditioning", and one for "domestic", likewise it has switches for "start batteries" and "domestic batteries".
jfm
Well-Known Member
I can't comment on your particular policy but as regards yacht insurance generally and my own and whitelighter's (he and I happen to have same) I absolutely disagree that. Happy to agree to disagree of course.
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boatmike
Well-Known Member
You don't find out how your insurance company behaves by reading the policy. You only find out when you have a claim and are faced with a "loss adjuster" . I agree not all companies are the same but it is always worth ensuring that anything you fit to the boat is safe. To install something that clearly does not meet the intended use or contravenes the installation instructions supplied by the manufacturer is in the worst case dangerous and at best gives the "loss adjuster" something to use as an excuse. The case mentioned earlier regarding a dehumidifier is a good example. A dehumidifier properly wired with a proper fuse and dumping its overflow into say a sink should be perfectly safe but according to the previous poster was used as an excuse for not paying a claim if I understood him properly. Why give them the opportunity?
jfm
Well-Known Member
You write as if insurance companies have discretion on whether to pay claim. They don't. Sure, they can choose how to behave, but I don't care about that. What matters is whether a policy gives you a right to money or not, and that is a matter for the courts not the insurance company if the latter don't honour their obligations under the policy. Loss adjusters? Haha! Bring 'em on!
I was just disagreeing your words "...certainly gives an insurer an excuse to avoid paying ..." As I say, happy to disagree, and I'm putting my money where my mouth is because I have a boat full to the brim of domestic appliances
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gjgm
Well-Known Member
I think it might be fair to point out that some might be better at wining their case, and many less- or more likely un- -qualified might find themselves coerced into a less than optimal settlement, legal fees probably an influence in some cases.
stelican
Well-Known Member
From reading previous items you have written I had the impression your boat was used for chartering, Would the domestic white goods items on your vessel have warranty as it could be deemed they were being used commercially.
Just a matter probably best to tiptoe around.
Portofino
Well-Known Member
The issue is not in my mind over how the appliances are described -" domestic " or indeed commercial -it's if they have been installed correctly as per and complying with manufacturer instructions .
Loss Adjuster may I stress may attempt to - Refute a fire damage claim from an oven or other fixed heat source if it turns out a DIY monkey incorrectly installed it .
For example somebody wants fit a new a griddle / BBQ in the cockpit of boat that ,s not currently got one ( cos he,s mates boat has one and he fancies one )
So he buys one from t,Internet + some MDF and resin , -knocks up a unit - cuts a hole to fit the "appliance " -runs a wire from some ware -mounts the whole thing next to his gas locker or out board fuel locker or a cupboard full of cleaning solvent . There's inadequate ventilation and heat ignites the new unit which intern ignites nearby flammable substance .
All after its been used when it's supposed to cooling off .All crew ashore in the marina bar .
The boats been modded and the ins Co have not been told
So dispite so called - all risks -do you not think it wise Jez to run the combi oven install by your ins Co 'showing them the make modal and Pics of the install paying particular attention to the ventilation and heat shielding in any ?
I realise accidents are all risk ie a dropped fag or split petrol or other immflamable liquid -or bozo with a gas torch knocks it over - they will pay out .
But a poor instal that's kinda preventable
boatmike
Well-Known Member
I think you are generally agreeing with what I said Portofino. I would do three things actually.
1. Very carefully read the installation instructions and ensure they are complied with to the letter.
2. Contact the manufacturer and ask them "If I comply with your installation instructions is there any reason why your microwave should not be fitted to a boat?" They are obliged to answer if its a health and safety issue and will probably confirm it is OK
3. Contact your insurers and tell them sending them a copy of the manufacturers reply.
Might all seem OTT but will remove all doubt.
1. Very carefully read the installation instructions and ensure they are complied with to the letter.
2. Contact the manufacturer and ask them "If I comply with your installation instructions is there any reason why your microwave should not be fitted to a boat?" They are obliged to answer if its a health and safety issue and will probably confirm it is OK
3. Contact your insurers and tell them sending them a copy of the manufacturers reply.
Might all seem OTT but will remove all doubt.