Colregs don't apply to the elite?

[l'escargot]

It doesn't take many incidents to get a reputation - I must have seen hundreds if not thousands of encounters between Wightlink and yachts and only a handful have stood out.

It used to be a common subject of discussion on SB a few years back (Whatever happened to Ian Grant ).

What did happen to him. That was the era I had most dealings with them and Commander Tom ( we know what happened to him ) was QHM.

 

[Cardo]

There can't be (m)any people who sail regularly out of Portsmouth who have not experienced or seen behaviour by Wightlink that contravenes Colregs and is either inconsiderate or downright dangerous (and of course the other way round - yachts getting in the way of the ferries in contravention of the regs).

We had our boat in the Solent for a year and chartered numerous times before then and never had any issues with the Wightlink ferries. They always behaved as expected and avoided us, as expected, when we were sailing.

 

[jerrytug]

We had our boat in the Solent for a year and chartered numerous times before then and never had any issues with the Wightlink ferries. They always behaved as expected and avoided us, as expected, when we were sailing.

I worked for Wightlink the summer the yacht 'Ouzo' was (probably) run down by the Pride of Bilbao, '07 I think, in August, with the loss of all hands on the yacht. It was a discussion point, as in, 'what might have gone wrong* and how to learn from the tragedy', rather than 'stupid WAFIs got what they deserved'.

The Fishbourne car ferries have a superb view from the bridge, and are highly manouverable, in fact they can do 10 knots ahead, 10 astern and 5 knots sideways.

As said above, it doesn't take much for a ranting yachtie to spread undeserved criticism.

* various issues, read the reports etc

 

[rotrax]

Our sailing was done from Gosport (7 years) or Hamble (5 years).

Both Red Funnel and Wightlink are fine in the majority of cases, even when leisure vessels, both power and sail compromise them-a not unusual situation on busy sundays in the summer.

The newer HS cats are so much quieter than the old ones that we soon learned to keep a better lookout for then as the aural approach was no longer any good. The hovercraft is often heard before being spotted though.

First Mate-and I must agree with her-says the most troublesome ones are the Pompey-Gosport green jobs that just whizz out in front of her whenever-or so it seems-we enter or leave port.

We often leave the QHM radio channel open for a while to get a feel for what is coming and going, ditto Southampton port control. This helps.

We were told to expect heavy ferry traffic in the Clyde recently. Compared to the Solent it is almost insignificant.

 

[Serin]

As said above, it doesn't take much for a ranting yachtie to spread undeserved criticism.

Good to have this perspective, jerrytug. I have no experience of Wightlink ferries, but I do believe professional seamen get a lot of undeserved criticism from leisure sailors. For the most part, they behave correctly and professionally and will always stand by to help a leisure sailor in trouble if necessary.

 

[snowleopard]

Even many non sailors know "power gives way to sail"!

One of the biggest problems is those whose knowledge of colregs is restricted to just that and they apply it in all circumstances - even when the power boat is at anchor!

 

[l'escargot]

...it doesn't take much for a ranting yachtie to spread undeserved criticism...

... Or for a bullying skipper to attract criticism for pushing his ferry down the outside of the channel markers, through careful leisure boaters in order to overtake another ferry, whilst trying to claim total rights to the channel because restricted by draught....

As others have said, on the whole they're fine (probably like most leisure skippers) but I have seen numerous questionable actions over the years that I wouldn't expect from such professionals.

 

[bedouin]

We had our boat in the Solent for a year and chartered numerous times before then and never had any issues with the Wightlink ferries. They always behaved as expected and avoided us, as expected, when we were sailing.

You must be the exception that proves the rule - or perhaps your boat is of sufficiently shallow draft that you didn't have to use the swashway to/from your berth every time you went out.

 

[southseaian]

... Or for a bullying skipper to attract criticism for pushing his ferry down the outside of the channel markers, through careful leisure boaters in order to overtake another ferry, whilst trying to claim total rights to the channel because restricted by draught....

You will never see a Wight Link car ferry overtaking an other ferry.
When a departing Brittany Ferry is transiting Portsmouth Harbour entrance and a Wight Link is approaching, the Wight Link is instructed to wait, out of the channel, by the QHM.
Monitor channel 11 and observe from the chart where radio reporting points are for a better understanding.

 

[lw395]

You must be the exception that proves the rule - or perhaps your boat is of sufficiently shallow draft that you didn't have to use the swashway to/from your berth every time you went out.

Unless your boat draws over 4m, you don't need to use the Swashway every time you go out. The shallowest bit of the Hamilton Bank only dries about 0.6 or 0.7m, there is often well over 3m of water virtually everywhere.

 

[southseaian]

You must be the exception that proves the rule - or perhaps your boat is of sufficiently shallow draft that you didn't have to use the swashway to/from your berth every time you went out.

Yachts (say under 50ft) don't generally need to use the transit except near low water. The Wight Link car ferries don't use the Swashway near low water.

 

[l'escargot]

You will never see a Wight Link car ferry overtaking an other ferry.
When a departing Brittany Ferry is transiting Portsmouth Harbour entrance and a Wight Link is approaching, the Wight Link is instructed to wait, out of the channel, by the QHM.
Monitor channel 11 and observe from the chart where radio reporting points are for a better understanding.

Have you ever been outside of Portsmouth Harbour? You will in other places. The incoming ferry at Wooton travels down the outside of the channel as the departing ferry leaves in the channel, it then enters the channel further down at the final channel marker. Likewise they cross within the Lymington channel at the dog leg at Short Reach. You won't see Britanny Ferries in either of those places though....

 

[Tidewaiter2]

Have you ever been outside of Portsmouth Harbour? You will in other places. The incoming ferry at Wooton travels down the outside of the channel as the departing ferry leaves in the channel, it then enters the channel further down at the final channel marker. Likewise they cross within the Lymington channel at the dog leg at Short Reach. You won't see Britanny Ferries in either of those places though....

And can't you just tell the short range thinkers, raggie and mobo, as they hammer flat out past you inbound from Jack in the Basket, or the Tide guage, to arrive at those pinch points as the two ferries occupy all the available water,. Ah, the sound of synchronised 5 blasts in the morning

 

[l'escargot]

And can't you just tell the short range thinkers, raggie and mobo, as they hammer flat out past you inbound from Jack in the Basket, or the Tide guage, to arrive at those pinch points as the two ferries occupy all the available water,. Ah, the sound of synchronised 5 blasts in the morning

Along with a planing Moth, 5 Oppies and a paddle boarder... I do think there is an argument for going back to the incoming boat standing off at the entrance to the channel at Wooton and the same at Lymington now they have the larger ferries.

 

[lw395]

Have you ever been outside of Portsmouth Harbour? You will in other places. The incoming ferry at Wooton travels down the outside of the channel as the departing ferry leaves in the channel, it then enters the channel further down at the final channel marker. Likewise they cross within the Lymington channel at the dog leg at Short Reach. You won't see Britanny Ferries in either of those places though....

Yes, Lymington makes Portsmouth look like a safe warm place sometimes!
Crossing ferries in the entrance, muppets in powerboats, muppets in yachts and dinghy racing starting and finishing in the river.
Plus the odd rowing club if you want to play the joker....

 

[Tidewaiter2]

Along with a planing Moth, 5 Oppies and a paddle boarder... I do think there is an argument for going back to the incoming boat standing off at the entrance to the channel at Wooton and the same at Lymington now they have the larger ferries.

The Solent Watchkeepers Carol;
(Chorus)
On the first day of Summer, my bridge lookout called to me
All in the Fairway,
just off Ballast and Gunwharf Quay
and QHM had just gone to 'tea'
Along with a planing Moth, 5 Oppies and a paddle boarder...

One Brittany Ferry inbounder,

two Gosport ferries swerving,

Three Admiral's Cuppers racing,

(Chorus)On the first day of Summer, my bridge lookout called to me
All in the Fairway,
just off Ballast and Gunwharf Quay
and the QHM had just gone to 'tea'
Along with a planing Moth, 5 Oppies and a paddle boarder...

four Gigs a rowing,

five dredgers dredging,

six Bosuns tacking,

seven Ribs a speeding,

eight Princess's posing ,

nine Keel boats "racing",

ten Bavarias inverting,

eleven small fisher craft a sinking,

twelve "STARBOARD" Sunsail 40's colliding

(Chorus)
On the first day of Summer, my Bridge lookout called to me
All in the Fairway,
just off Ballast and Gunwharf Quay
and the QHM had just gone to 'tea'
Along with a planing Moth, 5 Oppies and a paddle boarder...

 

[bedouin]

Yachts (say under 50ft) don't generally need to use the transit except near low water. The Wight Link car ferries don't use the Swashway near low water.

That pretty much demonstrates that you are not as familiar with the area as you claim.

Most of the Hamilton bank inside the outer swashway has a charted depth of about 0.6m (that includes the inner swashway) so if you want a minimum of 1m under your keel then you need about 2.4 m of tide to cross it - that is about half tide.

 

[southseaian]

And can't you just tell the short range thinkers, raggie and mobo, as they hammer flat out past you inbound from Jack in the Basket, or the Tide guage, to arrive at those pinch points as the two ferries occupy all the available water,. Ah, the sound of synchronised 5 blasts in the morning

Yes I did leave Portsmouth Harbour once but quickly returned when I met open water.
By the way the two examples you put forward refer to ferries going in opposite directions, not overtaking each other.

 

[lw395]

That pretty much demonstrates that you are not as familiar with the area as you claim.

Most of the Hamilton bank inside the outer swashway has a charted depth of about 0.6m (that includes the inner swashway) so if you want a minimum of 1m under your keel then you need about 2.4 m of tide to cross it - that is about half tide.

Not the bits that dry out a few times a year!
Locals call the Hamilton Bank the shallow bit just west of the main channel. The bit that dries and immediately around it.
The whole triangle from the entrance to Gilkicker to the fort is pretty shallow, apart from the outer swashway.
A 2.2m draught is marginal on the outer swashway at LWS, the deepest water is somewhat inshore of the monument/'granny farm' transit.
I have had a slightly unpleasant incident with a Wighlink ferry ignoring rule 13 in the swashway.
It's best to be fully conversant with the LNTM's if you are going to take issue with Wightlink or the ModPlod IME.
Things may have changed a little, I try avoid Portsmouth these days.
You see Sunsail aground there a few times most years.
The car ferries use the swashway except close to low water springs.

 

[lw395]

Yes I did leave Portsmouth Harbour once but quickly returned when I met open water.
By the way the two examples you put forward refer to ferries going in opposite directions, not overtaking each other.

Why would two Wightlinks overtake one another?
They generally arrive in the order they leave!