Club Entropy

[oldgit]

Anybody else get this ?
Is this your experience too?

Not totally wide of the mark ?
Will suggest this applies to all sections of the boating world, however suspect the sailing community is suffering worst, motorboating slightly less so, our club is still gaining the odd member who will not remember the "Suez Crises".
The only real growth has been canal boats, PWCs and man/woman powered craft.
Click on Full Report. Bottom of first Paragraph.

The first step to revival? Lose the velvet rope.​

"If your membership committee still looks like a 1950s golf club, it’s time for a change. Drop the old-school gatekeeping and make it clear that everyone who loves the water is welcome — not just those with pedigree or cash.
Clubs can partner with local schools or youth programs to introduce sailing to kids who’d never otherwise get the chance. Throw open houses and “try sailing” days. Make your club feel approachable.
Trade the navy blazer for flip-flops and a smile — it works wonders."

Not in your back yard ?
These forums are full of anti PWC rants ?
Moboers ranting about dinghy sailors, Thames motoryacht owners whinging about rowers /swimmers/inflatable canoers daring to use their river ?

 

[benjenbav]

It’s the same old story, when any ‘much-loved institution’ disappears from our world. Truth is that not enough folks are sufficiently in love with it to spend their time/money/energy there.

Things move on; things change.

 

[ylop]

Not any club I’ve been a member of - it would have put me off before I got in the door. I was talking to a work acquaintance recently who started sailing last year and was telling me about finding a local club (I sail on the other side of the country). She had approached one who’s opening line was essentially “we are the sort of club where everyone mucks in and helps out, so part of being a member is you are expected to mop the toilets”. She hadn’t even approached another club because it was called “Royal Yacht Club” and (despite being very much upper middle class, middle aged) felt “she wouldn’t fit in”. AFAIK that wasn’t a political point, her perception was that it was the sort of club where people were invited to join rather than turned up.

She’s ended up at a club that’s geographically less convenient but where their membership pitch was about how they could help you get sailing rather than what you needed to do for them!

 

[wonkywinch]

I saw the same at a "Royal" club near me. They put the membership up to over £1,000 a year last year which just isn't worth it. I got the impression it was mostly populated by a load of self serving pompous snobs in their 80's so after 3 years, resigned.

 

[oldgit]

A trouble maker , with a world wide maritime lifetime behind him, dared to suggest that the ATYC might want to think about changing its name to the TMBC to attempt to stem the decline in members and clubs wanting to be associated with it.
You can imagine how that turned out.

Doubt there has been " Y" on the Thames since the early 1900s ?

 

[dunedin]

An American article about certain USA clubs? May apply to a handful in the UK, but not many outside SE.
Dress code and blazers? Only rules on what to wear that I have come across is buoyancy aids when afloat.

Clearly there big challenges for clubs due to the wide variety of other interests and challenges of time.
But also, let’s be honest - the days when club bars were full every evening was largely based on social acceptance of drink driving. People drank and routinely drove home.
Not acceptable nowadays.

 

[BruceK]

My personal experience. The old hands don't want to see change. They invested their life into it and want to keep it how it was. A couple years in the committee trying to sway the committee to no avail. So I resigned and left. Now they have lost the club house. C'est la Vie.

 

[ylop]

An American article about certain USA clubs? May apply to a handful in the UK, but not many outside SE.
Dress code and blazers? Only rules on what to wear that I have come across is buoyancy aids when afloat.

Whilst I’d agree with all of that, I would also say that if trying to recruit you are not targeting people who will know the distinction, so what matters is not that “we” think we are much more open/welcoming but that prospective members do.

Clearly there big challenges for clubs due to the wide variety of other interests and challenges of time.

Yes, although many a YC / SC could go a long way to attracting new members if they just opened up to kayaks, wild swimmers, paddle boarders etc. Over time they might even find some of those people become “sail curious”.

But also, let’s be honest - the days when club bars were full every evening was largely based on social acceptance of drink driving. People drank and routinely drove home.
Not acceptable nowadays.

English clubs might be in for a shock if the proposed tightening of the DD rules happens there. It will see a culture where “1 pint (which might actually be 2 or 3 over a few hours)” becomes no longer acceptable.

 

[oldgit]

It took 15 years before enough of our "Ancien Regime" became permanently moored in the great marina in the sky, to win a vote to allow Social Members into the club.
Was assured at the time, should it come to pass, drunkeness and fights would surely follow .
As for the row about allowing credit cards to be accepted at the bar.

 

[Boathook]

English clubs might be in for a shock if the proposed tightening of the DD rules happens there. It will see a culture where “1 pint (which might actually be 2 or 3 over a few hours)” becomes no longer acacceptable.

Be a shame when they "toughen" even more, especially as it seems the drugs and driving is a bigger problem nowadays. Going to hit the rural sailing clubs and pubs badly.

 

[Neil1300r]

Bought a boat 18 months ago. Moored in a marina on the Thames. There is a clubhouse, which I've never been in. To become a member you have to be nominated by 2 members, if you don'tknow anyonehow do I get nominated? . Club has a website thats never updated, and until recently the same for Facebook. So I don't know what events are coming up so I've never seen the need to look at how to join. Club has recently announced it is closing

 

[Seastoke]

My personal experience. The old hands don't want to see change. They invested their life into it and want to keep it how it was. A couple years in the committee trying to sway the committee to no avail. So I resigned and left. Now they have lost the club house. C'est la Vie.

We now have a club house on the coat with berthing and a full membership . You are welcome to join the waiting list , to get on the waiting list and we only let a new member join when the smoke changes coming out of the Vatican.

 

[Alicatt]

We just had our AGM, and no probationary members were there, this is the 3rd AGM we have been to, at the first we were probationary (aspirante) members, now we have another 2 years to go to before we can become full members. Dress code is optional
Our haven is pretty much full just now, so much so that we all were admonished that if anyone buys a bigger boat they may have to seek alternative mooring, we have 600m of jetty and two places for passing boats, the hotel beside the canal also has 2 places for passing boats.

The club has been taking on new younger members, the senior members are hanging up their sextants, there are a good number of the club is in the pensioner age group, ourselves included. The havenmeister is retiring and he has just announced he has sold his boat, he was a live aboard, now he is going ashore for the last time, he was very helpful to us when we were at the start of learning the ropes of canal cruising.
So we have a position open for a harbourmaster and so far no takers, I live fairly close but am not experienced enough, the rest are further away and/or working.

 

[benjenbav]

We just had our AGM, and no probationary members were there, this is the 3rd AGM we have been to, at the first we were probationary (aspirante) members, now we have another 2 years to go to before we can become full members. Dress code is optional
Our haven is pretty much full just now, so much so that we all were admonished that if anyone buys a bigger boat they may have to seek alternative mooring, we have 600m of jetty and two places for passing boats, the hotel beside the canal also has 2 places for passing boats.

The club has been taking on new younger members, the senior members are hanging up their sextants, there are a good number of the club is in the pensioner age group, ourselves included. The havenmeister is retiring and he has just announced he has sold his boat, he was a live aboard, now he is going ashore for the last time, he was very helpful to us when we were at the start of learning the ropes of canal cruising.
So we have a position open for a harbourmaster and so far no takers, I live fairly close but am not experienced enough, the rest are further away and/or working.

I don’t think folks build their lives around community endeavours so much as they once did, these days.

As a boy I sailed with my father. Our family were members of a sailing club of which my father was the honorary treasurer for many years; later rear, vice and commodore.

My father was also a great committee man, fundraising for charity, organising his rural neighbours to buy and refurbish the village hall etc.

This seemed the norm to me. It was just what you did.

And yet, my adult life has revolved around my family unit and my own - selfish, if you will - interests. I have not wanted to participate in the life of any club; nor have I.

Maybe just a subjective example but I’d wager there are increasing numbers of folks like me who just don’t see the attraction in club membership and who neither belong nor want to belong to any such community.

 

[The Q]

The two clubs I belong to have no dress code, a third club I visit, only has a no soggy clothing in the carpeted bar area rule.
The summer club and the club I visit have moorings for motorboats as well as sailing.
My winter club has near doubled its membership in the last 3 years. The summer club has been on a slow increase since they started a sailing school 15 years ago.
Both summer and winter clubs are self help no staff, the club I visit regularly does have staff and triple the fees..
Both summer and winter clubs have social events which you may wish to attend, the next is Burns night, no dress code but you are encouraged to wear tartan..
The summer club has Barbeques, and other events through the season .

The summer clubs members ship fees are £200 ish for a family.
Our total fees for this year at that club.
Are for membership, a 27ft motor boat, a 16ft mini keel boat, and a rowing boat. Are £1460.. (moorings are for a year).

 

[Neil1300r]

We just had our AGM, and no probationary members were there, this is the 3rd AGM we have been to, at the first we were probationary (aspirante) members, now we have another 2 years to go to before we can become full members. Dress code is optional
Our haven is pretty much full just now, so much so that we all were admonished that if anyone buys a bigger boat they may have to seek alternative mooring, we have 600m of jetty and two places for passing boats, the hotel beside the canal also has 2 places for passing boats.

The club has been taking on new younger members, the senior members are hanging up their sextants, there are a good number of the club is in the pensioner age group, ourselves included. The havenmeister is retiring and he has just announced he has sold his boat, he was a live aboard, now he is going ashore for the last time, he was very helpful to us when we were at the start of learning the ropes of canal cruising.
So we have a position open for a harbourmaster and so far no takers, I live fairly close but am not experienced enough, the rest are further away and/or working.

3 years to become a full member? Do you get a special blazer badge then, so members start talking to you properly? That would be a hard no from me

 

[Alicatt]

3 years to become a full member? Do you get a special blazer badge then, so members start talking to you properly? That would be a hard no from me

5 years to become a full member
It is a good informal club and they do organise a lot of club outings, the costs of the club plus the mooring is way less than just getting a mooring at another marina. We don't have fuel or a pump out, but the club is expanding it's facilities.
While we were in the first year of prospective membership we did not get to see the accounts etc. or vote on what the club wants to do, now we do have that access and a voice in the decisions of the club.

 

[ylop]

It is a good informal club

5 years to become a full member

While we were in the first year of prospective membership we did not get to see the accounts etc. or vote on what the club wants to do, now we do have that access and a voice in the decisions of the club.

Wow - I'd love to see your idea of a formal club!

 

[ylop]

I don’t think folks build their lives around community endeavours so much as they once did, these days.

Largely, I think you are right, but there are still pockets of people who do stuff out of "community spirit". The trick for a club is to work out how you attract those people and extract money from the rests to help them do what they want to do! IME a passionate leader who can communicate a vision can make a huge difference. Too many club presidents/commodores (not just in sailing) have got there because nobody else wanted to do it or because they served their time on the committee and people thought it was their turn.

Maybe just a subjective example but I’d wager there are increasing numbers of folks like me who just don’t see the attraction in club membership and who neither belong nor want to belong to any such community.

Your money would be safe! This is exactly the challenge that all sports clubs face. Often the only reason people join is because they "have to" to access some facility - whether its a tennis court, moorings or mountain hut or because to compete seriously you need to be a member for license/insurance type reasons. Its a failing of many clubs to sell the advantages (if there are any) of being a member.

In a quite different sport I spent a lot of time with a working group from the national governing body trying to help them tackle exactly this issue - people want to "pay to play" not join the club and volunteer. Despite all the evidence being quite clear, the solutions were just too radical and there was insufficient momentum to support moving away from the status quo.

 

[doug748]

American yacht clubs tend to be very exclusive and way more expensive than any in the UK. I would guess we only have about 10 clubs that are super sniffy another 10 that are rather posh and 1350 that are doing the best to look after the membership and grow the best way they can

I probably know Plymouth best, we have one Royal which has struggled a bit for historical reasons and about 8 others that are doing ok, thrive at the weekends and as for dress code prefer you not to use the bar when naked beneath the waist.

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