Chinese Gybe

awol said:
"English" perhaps. The rest of us are nae sae daft!
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Or if people what to run around Cowes telling everyone else about messing up like that, perhaps it should be a 'Solent Gybe'.

The rest of us tend to keep quiet about such things and just keep practicing until we get them right.
 
TimBennet said:
Or if people what to run around Cowes telling everyone else about messing up like that, perhaps it should be a 'Solent Gybe'.

The rest of us tend to keep quiet about such things and just keep practicing until we get them right.
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Not really much of an option to keep quiet about it when everyone in the pub witnessed it.
 
Looking at the video, you can't see the helmsman's face. Can just make out the shoulder flashes on his waterproofs, though.

I don't suppose it might be someone with whom you are acquainted? If it is, pass on my compliments for having the quick thinking to use the sea to absorb the energy from what would otherwise have been quite a nasty impact.

An odd place for the camera, too. Almost as though it is keeping an eye on the helmsman's trousers, particularly for moments like these.
 
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JumbleDuck said:
A Solent Gybe
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They happen outside the Solent and ouside England.

An accidental gybe under spinnaker is the only usage of Chinese Gybe I've ever heard ouside the ybw forums* and I've heard it used like that going back 15 to 20 years. I've never been on a racer that has broached to leeward except under spinnaker but I guess it is possible.

The term is not used for a poorly executed gybe, only an unintentional one. Crash Gybe is the term I'm familiar with for a boat deliberately gybing without being ready.

I really can't imagine a Bermudian main being so poorly set up that you end up with part of the main on either side during an intentional gybe. A gaffer is more plausible.

And I've never witnessed a Chinese Junk gybe, whether well executed or not.

* I guess there are people on here who still pronounce the vegetable cowcumber.
 
I was always taught that a Chinese Gybe was the head-and-foot-on-opposite sides variety. It was explained to have something to do with junk rigs.
I think I did manage to get my little 8' gunter-rigged sailing tender to do something like that, but didn't quite get it to do a proper split-gybe.

Of course, like most people I have never seen one for real, so obviously this colourful term has now found other use.

ooh - I just remembered seeing something on a French website: "Empanne Chinois" or something. Let me try and find it.

It will probably have to change again if the Chinese come to have more influence in the sailing world, as they saw on Dong Feng.

And let me be the among the first to point out that I have never heard of a vegetable called cowcumber. Or even cucumber.
 
Well, I didn't manage to find the photo I was looking for. It was of a torn mainsail, with the top half one side and the bottom half and boom on the other. Caption was "empannage Chinois"

But this French forum http://forums.voileabordable.com/read.php?8,17142,17151#msg-17151 seems to mirror the discussion on scuttlebutt, noting the fact that the original "true" usage has been debased.

Ho hum.
 
All right! I know everyone else has lost interest, but here's the photo I was talking about.

I don't think it really counts as a Chinese Gybe if you have to rip your mainsail in half to accomplish it, but at least it shows commitment to the maneuver:

https://plus.google.com/+AhmetCullu/posts/TjK3VP6tyRm

On second thoughts ... not sure they did rip the sail. It looks pretty modern, too. Not a Gaff or Bamboo in sight.
 
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lampshuk said:
All right! I know everyone else has lost interest, but here's the photo I was talking about.

I don't think it really counts as a Chinese Gybe if you have to rip your mainsail in half to accomplish it, but at least it shows commitment to the maneuver:

https://plus.google.com/+AhmetCullu/posts/TjK3VP6tyRm

On second thoughts ... not sure they did rip the sail. It looks pretty modern, too. Not a Gaff or Bamboo in sight.
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Junked rig?
 
flaming said:
It did. But I'll tell you now that if you walk into a pub in Cowes or Hamble and say "we did a big Chinese today" everyone will be picturing the video I posted, not assuming you sail a gaffer. The meaning has shifted over time and common usage.
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I have to say I thought it was boom on one side, head of the main on the other. Not uncommon with running backstays. I didn't know the language had moved on, but then I haven't raced with a native English speaker on board for many years.

Nice driving, by the way, when the kite went in the water. A lot of people would have driven right over it.
 
Babylon said:
Junked rig?
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:D

lampshuk said:
... But this French forum http://forums.voileabordable.com/read.php?8,17142,17151#msg-17151 seems to mirror the discussion on scuttlebutt, noting the fact that the original "true" usage has been debased ...
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Given that, and the historical tendency for countries to name diseases, vices etc. after their nearest neighbour, perhaps we’ll see in due course the emergence of ‘Un empennage Anglais’ and ‘A French gybe’?
 
flaming said:
In common parlance in racing circles the meaning has changed quite a bit. To be a gybe broach. So not a helmsman accidentally turning a boat that is still in control through a gybe, but the result of what happens when the rudder loses it's grip and the boat rounds down. Normally under kite. Normally reasonably impressive to watch... Like the second gybe in this video....
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Thanks for the link.

Note to self: If flaming ever invites me out for a sail, politely decline.
 
JumbleDuck said:
It sounds to me as if "Chinese" has been used fairly consistently, if a little Lounge-ly, over the years to mean "wild, uncoordinated, disorganised, not as planned", much as in the regrettable popular phrase "a Chinese fire drill". A balls-up, basically.
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A bit like 'French' then... used to mean something that is fake/faux... like 'french cricket' or 'french knitting' or 'french pansy' or 'french letter' ?
 
lampshuk said:
All right! I know everyone else has lost interest, but here's the photo I was talking about.

I don't think it really counts as a Chinese Gybe if you have to rip your mainsail in half to accomplish it, but at least it shows commitment to the maneuver:

https://plus.google.com/+AhmetCullu/posts/TjK3VP6tyRm

On second thoughts ... not sure they did rip the sail. It looks pretty modern, too. Not a Gaff or Bamboo in sight.
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Yes but that boat has a micro gaff main
Huff of arklow had a real one built into her main in the 60s!
 
flaming said:
In common parlance in racing circles the meaning has changed quite a bit. To be a gybe broach. So not a helmsman accidentally turning a boat that is still in control through a gybe, but the result of what happens when the rudder loses it's grip and the boat rounds down. Normally under kite. Normally reasonably impressive to watch... Like the second gybe in this video....

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So what do you have to do to get back upright again when that happens ?

Boo2
 
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