cheap boat running costs

[homerjay]

hi all

im new, so go easy.

looking at buying our 1st family boat.

done lots of reading and yes i know i need to do a class 2 cert first and learn the marina rules etc, but i just want to know whats financially possible.

im looking at spending about 2k on a bayliner/picton open bow type boat. with 75-125hp outboard engine.

mainly to be used for fishing and skiiing in north wales, but hope fully we'll take it around the place, windermere, lomond maybe.

ive read lots of scary stories about boats costing a fortune to run.

im aware that fuel is expensive and will manage about 4mpg.

but what else is there?

ive got down:
training £500 (2 people on class 2 powerboat)
boat £2000
insurance £300 per annum
fuel £100 per usage
mooring none, kept at home
launching £10 per launch

then finally
maintenance???

do things go wrong a lot?

father in law is a ca mechanic and reckons he good maintain it. could he, are engines just engines?? im not a mechanic!

any thing im missing?

sorry for the long post, im just thinking out loud.

cheers
hj

 

[gravygraham]

Hi HJ, shame you've not had any replies sooner. Some other bits - lifejackets, flares and a hand-held vhf. You're right to get your RYA Powerboat Level II sorted - if you can, get the instructor to hold the course on your boat. It'll be great for familiarising you and getting some experience.

Marine kit does have a habit of costing £'s to maintain. You mention Windermere and Lomond - I have no experience of inland boating but do know that some waters require boats to have a current Boat Safety Certificate.

Good luck, and have fun.

 

[Divemaster1]

Hi and welcome...

Others will mention that anything with the word "marine" comes with an extra price tag ...

Anyway, other things you need to consider is;

1) Trailer maintenance (Salt Water is not good for those...)
2) Presume you have a towbar etc., already ... if not that will set you back a couple of hundred pounds...
3) Presume you are aware of the 60 MPH limit when towing....
4) Extra fuel cost for the car when pulling boat....
5) You will take up two parking spaces with car and trailer, so that may be more costly in some places
6) Presume you get a trailer with the boat, ... but if you have to buy ... that is extra ... and just because it comes with the boat, does not mean it is roadworthy...

Then there is the saftety equipment, such as small aux engine, spare fuel tank, lifejackets, flares, VHF etc.. on top of the toys, such as waterskis, (two towlines), wakeboard, and other toys ...

But it is great fun!!!

 

[Searush]

The sort of boat you are looking at is very exposed for UK use (especially N Wales, Lakes & Scotland) so most of the time you will need decent oilies & several layers underneath. I know all the brochures show girls in bikinis & bright sunshine, but imagine what it would be like sitting on the roof of your car in the rain while driving at 30mph over a ploughed field.

If you rely on good weather for using it - plus when you have the free time & the tides are right, then you may only get to use it once or twice a year!

Try to get something that will sell easily in a year or so, cos if you like it, you will want something with a cabin & more shelter. You will also want to be travelling further afield than you can sensibly in open sports boats & possibly stop out at anchor or overnight.

Always think about how you are going to want to use your boat - that's what dictates the sort of boat you should get, then look at your budget. Starting with the budget means that you may soon be very dissatisfied with what you have bought. It can be worth borrowing over a 3-5 year period if you can then get a boat that you will be happy with for at least that length of time.

 

[lisilou]

Hi HJ. Nothing to add of any help I'm afraid but just wanted to say welcome to the forum and good luck with your search. You won't regret it so enjoy the whole process and just have fun!! (safely of course )
Lisa

 

[Spi D]

Inboard engines are car based, marinised for the harsh environment and use. Tucked away somewhere below you must pay extra attention to fuel fumes (also when filling). Proper ventilation according to instruction manual must be observed. Cast iron block/manifolds combined with sea water (salt) sounds like a corrosion risc - and it is.

When mated to a stern drive (engine fixed mount, sterndrive tilt/turnable) bellows and an universal joint, drive shaft, supporting bearings, water/exhaust connections etc. are used. These parts, and the drive itself, must be serviced anually according to plan. This scheduled cost, also known as the Manufacturers Pension Plan, has a tendency to creep up to £300-500 - plus ofcourse any repairs needed.

In case of severe engine failure or even replacement of the engine it may be neccessary to remove parts of the interior. Selection of a new engine must respect the sterndrive make/model unless you want to replace this as well.

Outboard engines are complete units, specifically designed for the purpose (not much car engine about it), normally made of special grade alloy. No fixed-to-moveable connections as the whole unit turns when you turn the wheel. Access for repair is very good and replacement is bolt off - bolt on. The lower leg of an outboard is principially identical to a sterndrive.

Outboards normally have better weight/performance ratio and boats with this tend to cost a little more.

Outboards are popular among thieves, as are sterndrives.

 

[MBM_Greg]

Welcome to the boating world! Your costs seem about right, but the main cost is the engine. I would suggest always getting it winterised and serviced in the spring. It should be fine, but things can go wrong. I know of someone who had an engine rebuild for around £600, but it took four months!

Things like steering can go, throtle cables, trailer wheel bearings and so on. With a small boat like a picton you save with marina costs and being an outboard it will never be stupid costs, as you can replace the engine if you have some really bad luck!

 

[rbcoomer]

Not sure if it will help or put you off, but I spent around £1400 on top of the boat itself getting ready for first use! Around £600 was on sorting out the boat itself and trailer, the balance was 'getting on the water' - things like ropes, fenders, anchor & chain/warp, VHF, paddles, boat hook, flares, lifejackets, engine service & impeller, a cheap fishfinder/depth sounder, insurance and some other odds and ends! Insurance will probably be less than you budgeted based on that value - I'd say about £150, but don't under-insure. In addition to the things mentioned above and in earlier posts, I'd get a chart of the area you plan to boat in (and familiarise yourselves with it before you go!), a compass and perhaps a hand-held GPS if your phone doesn't have a GPS function. Dry clothes and a waterproof bag are good as is a torch - even if you don't plan to be out at night!

I've since added a 2hp auxiliary purchased from a boat jumble for £100 and a chartplotter that I'll ultimately transfer to my 'project' boat I'm now doing almost all of the maintenance myself, but you probably still need to budget a minimum of £400 a year for maintenance, insurance, replacements etc etc...

As said above however - you won't regret it - it's very addictive!!!

 

[PCUK]

Get your dad the right manuals and he'll soon know it all inside out. An engine IS an engine as you surmise. Just the bits hanging round it that make it look complex. Have a great time!

 

[gjgm]

A good point about an outboard is that if it does blow up, it is at least easy to buy and bolt another one on. I would guess this will be with a two stroke, which will be simpler, but more noisy and more thirsty. As implied elsewhere, the fibreglass part of the boat isnt worth alot (and is reasonably easy to fix), but engines and trailers can get epensive to fix, so pay attention to that.
There is nothing wrong with small open boats, but they suit some waters better than others. I think this is ok on a lake, or VERY sheltered coastal waters, but it will get pretty hairy in other than very calm days, I think. Have a look at what boats are in and about the boat yards, and you will get an idea of what "works". They may not always look such fun, but you might be able to use them alot more days.
Waterskiing? You also need some sort of lifevest,wetsuit,skiis towrope, and if in the sea, some very calm days ! And a towhook if the boat doesnt have one.
A boat on a trailer makes alot of sense, but if your main use will be locally, do spend some weekends about the slipways talking to people. People just love to talk about their boat, so you can pick up plenty of local knowledge and experience for free. It might also change what sort of boating is practical, and, maybe, what sort of boat doesnt make sense. There is often alot of bias against bowriders. They have their time and place and you can have alot of fun ( and contrary to "expert" opinion, they dont fill up and sink every time you use them!)

 

[clydeoutboardservices]

Hi

your dad being good with engines is a great start as there are some very handy sites if he will do the engine upkeep himself i.e www.boats.net.


if you are going out in the sea also think about a back up engine and remember to start it to check its ok every time you go out. For the sort of boat you are looking at think £250-£600.00 for the spare engine and bracket with £600 being new and £250 being old but working.

I would also add a depth gauge or fishfinder at £50-£100. It does not need to be fancy and a 2nd hand black and white one will do.

good luck

 

[Franknstein]

Dont mean to jack this thread, but lots of mention of flares...
perhaps someone could advise which flares the OP should be getting for his intended use?

 

[rbcoomer]

Dont mean to jack this thread, but lots of mention of flares...
perhaps someone could advise which flares the OP should be getting for his intended use?

I bought a 'coastal flare pack' - I think about £60 from memory. You get a mix of hand-held flares, smoke and 'parachute flares' - I can't recall the mix, but a couple of each I think. They're suitable for attracting attention when in sight of land only however - although I doubt the o/p will be going out further than suitability of these. I expect someone with more knowledge than I will be better placed to advise! Perhaps worth talking to the RNLI if/when they get the boat as they can offer a free boat safety assessment I think? If intended boating area is particularly remote, then perhaps more would be required? Either way, I still wouldn't be without the VHF and would only resort to flares once S&R are actually looking for you - unless a) you don't have a VHF or not working/out of range, AND b) you can be pretty sure that someone is around and will see your distress signal!

 

[Franknstein]

Thanks for that ^
Gosh - 78 quid for a coast flare pack... maybe next season - I will rely on my handheld radio and flapping my arms about this time

 

[gjgm]

Personally, if I was going out for a bit of local fishing and waterskiing, I wouldnt bother with flares at all. I would love to hear how many people have actually used one.
I used one at an RNLI open day session, and that has put me off ever using one on a boat unless my fingernails were the last thing above the sea surface.
Lets keep it real; he is talking about a small sportsboat which by limitation is going to be very inshore, and lakes.
Six sensible safety steps here :
http://www.rnli.org/safetyandeducat...-advice.aspx?gclid=CIy21LaU3bECFUYPfAodQHYAgg
though I have never ever done number 6 myself.

 

[Spi D]

...People just love to talk about their boat, so you can pick up plenty of local knowledge and experience for free. It might also change what sort of boating is practical, and, maybe, what sort of boat doesnt make sense.

Indeed. Visit marinas and talk to owners, even of boats you consider outside your initial scope.

Remember that any feature of a boat that is not practically useable is to be considered 'non existant':

Eg. these do not count:
Cuddy cabin that you can enter on hands and knees only
PortaPotties with no privacy
Sunbeds sized for kids
Canopy that is too low to sit upright under
Windscreen to low to provide shelter
Stowage with bad access

2k won't buy a yacht, but your money should get you the best possible boat for your needs

 

[rbcoomer]

The worst part is they're only good for about 5-6 years I think - then you have to get them disposed of and buy new... If you're ever unlucky enough to need them however, I'm sure you'd think it was the best £78 you ever spent!

Their necessity or otherwise depends a lot on your boating and circumstances I guess? For me as an inexperienced, non-swimmer with young family, I'll mitigate any risk I perceive as tangible. Our boating is not high-risk watersports, but I do aim to push the boundaries a little on distance given the size/type of vessel (14' open sportsboat) and weather/sea conditions can change quite rapidly in this area. Thus I'm more comfortable if prepared for as many 'what if' scenarios as is reasonably possible. I've been quite surprised by what some people regard as choppy, so perhaps I'm less risk averse (or more insane) than I thought? Either of which suggest that our level of preparation is probably wise!

(P.S. Should add that this was in response to the £78 for flare pack!)

 

[Solitaire]

The worst part is they're only good for about 5-6 years I think - then you have to get them disposed of and buy new... If you're ever unlucky enough to need them however, I'm sure you'd think it was the best £78 you ever spent!

Their necessity or otherwise depends a lot on your boating and circumstances I guess? For me as an inexperienced, non-swimmer with young family, I'll mitigate any risk I perceive as tangible. Our boating is not high-risk watersports, but I do aim to push the boundaries a little on distance given the size/type of vessel (14' open sportsboat) and weather/sea conditions can change quite rapidly in this area. Thus I'm more comfortable if prepared for as many 'what if' scenarios as is reasonably possible. I've been quite surprised by what some people regard as choppy, so perhaps I'm less risk averse (or more insane) than I thought? Either of which suggest that our level of preparation is probably wise!

(P.S. Should add that this was in response to the £78 for flare pack!)

There are 3 different flare packs. Inshore, for use up to 3 miles and consists of 2 orange smokes for use in day light in good visibility, and 2 red flares for use at night and in poor viz (fog). They are handheld and I advise keeping a set of gloves, gardening will do, but I use welders gloves as they also protect your wrists/ lower arms. Flares spit out hot debris and the red flare heats the tube right down to the handle. Cost round £40.

The next is the coastal pack, which is as above but with 2 parachute flares. Parachutes go up to around 1000 feet and can be seen in good viz up to 30 miles. Cost around £85.

Now to the granddaddy costing around £200. The offshore pack. Here there will be four of everything, although the orange smoke is normally of the cam type which is thrown into the sea.

As to shelf life, this is 3 years.