Can photographs be used to prosecute poor seamanship

Have you personally witnessed an incident where alcohol was a factor

  • Yes

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • No

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Total voters
    0
DAKA

DAKA

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I have been in correspondence recently with some one who made a suggestion that photographs and witness accounts are sufficient to bring a prosecution.

But there are so many issues that a photograph can not show.

Scale speeds

Current

Illusion of moving waves

Distortion of prospective from a Zoom lens

Theoretically if this forums experienced mariners look at a photo we should all estimate the same speed and wash size.

5d614bad5b046665b202c5b5d22f2a4c.jpg
 
Just looking at the photo too fast and too close as it looks like the yacht is anchored. I guessed 10-13knts and 31-51cm, but even at <10knts the wash wouldn't be much different would it. I would have gone past that close at 5-6knts.
 
Do you know what the correct answers are, particularly re.speed?
If yes, it'd be interesting to know, after a fair number of votes...
 
The police use special authentication software just to show that their pictures haven't been altered. I would think you could only use pictures to support witness evidence (and they may create many more issues/challenge points as they remove), rather than them being the sum total of the evidence (as with a speed camera).

For instance the above doesn't show the underwater pic, whether there is a narrow channel (buoys could be just out of shot), whether the "poor seamanship" is in fact whether the raggie is anchored in a restricted channel etc etc etc.

Imagine a picture giving the opposing legal team another 1000 words to argue and incur legal fees over....
 
Another good question would have been to guesstimate the distance of the Mobo from the Yacht.

At least he went behind him. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
[ QUOTE ]
the sea isn't flat so his wash doesn't come into it.

[/ QUOTE ]

So - the sea isn't flat, so it is fine to create wash that is counter to the natural wave pattern and causes additional rolling which cannot be anticipated unless you've seen the wash coming ...

In the photo it doesn't look like the yacht is anchored - I think I can make out a small wake - which could be tide or could be the yacht motoring.
The crossing powerboat isn't on the plane - so isn't going excessively fast, as a result they are creating a reasonable wash.
The photographer is (I assume) on a boat - so that will add to the mix.

The wash from the crossing boat will be perpendicular to the yacht so there won't be significant roll - unless it pushes the stern around so it become broadside ...

IMHO - the powerboat _could_ have given a little more room, but TBH I don't think there is a huge issue in this instance...
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
the sea isn't flat so his wash doesn't come into it.

[/ QUOTE ]

So - the sea isn't flat, so it is fine to create wash that is counter to the natural wave pattern and causes additional rolling which cannot be anticipated unless you've seen the wash coming ...


IMHO - the powerboat _could_ have given a little more room, but TBH I don't think there is a huge issue in this instance...

[/ QUOTE ]

No issue in your 'IMHO' There you go then. No one thinks it's an issue.
 
Well of course you can't conclude what happened just from the photo. It's theroretically possible from that photo that the yacht had the mobo approaching from his (the yacht's) stbd side and yacht should have given way, and that there was a scrape, and that the mobo did a U turn and is coming up to talk to the yot on the yacht's starboard side. We just don't know, purely from the photo

Alternatively IF the yacht is anchored or is the stand-on vessel there seems to be no prosecution issue here anyway. The mobo just seems to be passing too close at what looks like 8-9kts but it looks like a case of bad manners by mobo not danger.
 
(into the bear pit once more....)

No issue in this case I agree. The yacht seems of a reasonable size, the wake will hit it stern to (and it doesn't have an open stern so the helm won't get wet feet!), the yacht is motoring so no issue with shaking the wind out of the sails.

But there are many situations where that wake WOULD be an issue.
If the yacht was smaller and particulary lower and broadside to the wake you might expect to take water over the side from that wake.
If the yacht was sailing in light winds then that wash would easily stop the boat dead and shake all the wind out of the sails requiring them to be re trimmed and requiring the boat to accelerate again. Which is not as simple as pushing a throttle!

So would it be dangerous? Only if the yacht was very small, or, as is often the case with anchored yachts, in the process of pouring out tea!

Would it be antisocial? Of course.
 
I suppose you could've had a third poll.

Who thinks this situation was dangerous.

It could always be down to the angle of the photo. If my memory serves me right a boat ran aground next to a lighthouse (according to newspapers shown in a double page spread) in the CI. When viewed from a different angle it was miles away from said lighthouse.
mobo may be along way off the yacht.
 
Well I don't think you can draw many conclusions from this photo as the perspective will make the 2 boats appear to be much closer together than they really are. The yacht is definitely under way and my guess would be that there was a crossing situation and the mobo has made a turn to starboard as the give way vessel. It definitely looks as though it isn't planing but it's certainly above D speed so maybe 12-15kts
Is it dangerous? No. Is it inconsiderate? No, just another close quarters situation in a crowded seaway
 
Again perspective has shortened the distance between the 2 boats. I would say they are 100-200m apart and the big boat is quite safely crossing in front of the small one without risk of collision, especially since the small looks as if it's doing about 5kts, if that. Obviously the small boat thinks there is no risk of collision either because he doesn't appear to have slowed or altered course
 
[ QUOTE ]
No issue in your 'IMHO' There you go then. No one thinks it's an issue.

[/ QUOTE ]
In this particular case - no, I don't think there is an issue ...

but to shout out "the sea isn't flat" and then do doughnuts in the middle of an anchorage is bluddy rude ... and just shows the ignorance of the skipper ...
 
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