Calor Gas shortage - options?

[ProDave]

Just a word of caution for people swapping Calor 4.5 Butane to 3.9 Propane.

The Butane cylinder has a connection that uses a rubber washer to seal the connection. The Propane has a POL connector which is a brass to brass connection and relies on it being an accurate and tight fit. There WILL be some gas leakage with the POL connector.

So a Propane cylinder is ONLY suitable for a properly sealed and vented gas locker.

One would hope on a boat, that your gas locker is properly sealed and ventilated, but it certainly used to be the case that a lot of camper vans had an internal gas locker, e.g. under a seat that was not properly sealed and ventilated and would have been very bad to fit a propane cylinder in there.

 

[Tzu]

I know it doesnt help if your boat-bound but I carried my empty 4.5 Calor Butane round in the car for a couple of weeks then chanced on a Welsh petrol station that had a couple left. I spotted from the road that they had bottles on two different shelves in the cage outside. It was a recent delivery and they knew about the shortages. So some bottles are getting out!

 

[Momac]

One would hope on a boat, that your gas locker is properly sealed and ventilated

By that I assume you mean the gas locker should drain overboard (Propane and Butane gas being heavier than air) and the gas locker should not allow any escaping gas to drain into the boat.

 

[Momac]

Granted there is nothing on the Calor website about it but try doing it and you'll be told "sorry, no can do" by the dealer as they cannot raise a new refill agreement for the replacement bottle

The difference with Campigaz is there is no refill agreement.


All this is motivating people to transfer gas from larger cylinders to smaller cylinders which can't be a good thing.

 

[Bru]

The difference with Campigaz is there is no refill agreement.


All this is motivating people to transfer gas from larger cylinders to smaller cylinders which can't be a good thing.

Too true! As a frequent crier of warnings about doing just that I find myself forced to contemplate doing it myself

 

[Seven Spades]

I do not understand why most boat builders are still supportying the 907. It is far too small and the gas lockers seem to be made around it so it is very difficult to upgrade to a 6kg propane or 7kg Butane.

 

[Momac]

Boat builders have looked at what is available throughout Europe.

 

[ProDave]

By that I assume you mean the gas locker should drain overboard (Propane and Butane gas being heavier than air) and the gas locker should not allow any escaping gas to drain into the boat.

Correct. It is much more important it does this when using Propane.

 

[Bru]

Correct. It is much more important it does this when using Propane.

I wouldn't entirely agree that there *will* be some leakage with the propane cylinders but I do agree that it's much more likely

Despite many years handling gas cylinders, I've twice lost the entire contents of a propane cylinder overboard due to the threads not sealing and if the locker didn't drain properly overboard it could have been decidedly dangerous!

 

[dom]

That was my understanding back in our many years living in Poole when we carried both Calor and Gaz. The local filling centre filled both from very same source.….

Which is exactly what I’ll be doing if all this is true.

Said source being a 48kg propane bottle!
?

 

[dom]

Which is exactly what I’ll be doing if all this is true.

Said source being a 48kg propane bottle!
?

@Robin, If you’re still a permanent live-aboard on the IoW and are passing through either Gosport or Surrey, I’d be happy to fill yours FOC.

We can have a beer while waiting !
??

 

[Robin]

@Robin, If you’re still a permanent live-aboard on the IoW and are passing through either Gosport or Surrey, I’d be happy to fill yours FOC.

We can have a beer while waiting !
??

Thanks Dom and very much appreciated. we have no land transport only taxis and trains and are reluctant to use our diesel stocks in case winter gets super severe, fuel gets even harder to get and the ebberspluttery is called on to run 24/7.

 

[Robin]

Well today we obtained a new Gaz 907 which slotted straight into our gas locker, at present it is only our 'spare' and we still have the one full Calor in use and one empty Calor one if they ever get them up and running again to get that exchanged.

 

[Robin]

Despite having gas available today I cooked my signature chicken risotto on the electric hob/teppanyaki thing bought on sale way back as a just in case item. Actually amazed at how good this infrared device is once trial and error overcame the lack of instructions except in Chinese. power can be varied from 200w to 2200w in 200 increments fast to heat on 2200 initially then down to 200 to simmer. Even figured out the built in timer which shuts heat off after chosen time set.

I do so enjoy it when workarounds actually work.

 

[oldmanofthehills]

They do, but for no good reason. Propane is much better suited to our climate.

Also I suspect many are unaware that despite being in blue bottles:

Campingaz, formerly Camping Gaz, is a brand of compressed, mixed butane/propane gas supplied in small, lightweight, disposable canisters and larger, refillable cylinders designed for use as a fuel while camping and caravanning. The fuel gas is compressed to a liquid and sold in characteristic blue metal containers. [Wikipedia]

A 907 refill is £36.99. The 'equivalent' Gaslow bottle is £128 here albeit £167 direct from Gaslow. Working on £1/L refill cost that's about £5 per go, so payback in about 4 refills, 5 at the full price and 8 if you have to buy the filling kit.

We converted our van to propane for winter highland use though I keep butane and camping gaz attachments "on board" in case I cannot get calor propane and have to make do with something else. As you note camping gaz and similar are propane-butane mixed so better at lowish temperatures unlike butane. It has been still known that one had to pee on caz cylinders to get gas to evaporate to start the burner. Not what you want to do in gas locker of boat or van.

No issue getting refills in South west.

I just wish our boat gas locker was big enough for something other than camping gaz 907, and camping gaz seems costly by comparison to calor. Dont miss our old meths cooker on previous boat however. Costly smelly indoors and slow.

I am intrigued by the use of refillable Gaslow instead of calor propane. Does LPG evaporate the same and propane, and where do you get the cylinders filled?

 

[capnsensible]

I reckon you guys must be paying some of the highest charges anywhere for cooking gas. I recognise that where I am, prices are exceptionally low. I can get a 4.5kg filled for less than 9 euros, but that's unusual.

Ive never paid the sort of prices you have now. The nearest I got was filling some 907's in Panama which involved a two hour taxi drive each way through a jungle. ? But that drifts the thread a bit.....

 

[Iliade]

As far as I can discover, autogas (petrol station LPG) can be any mixture of the two, but I'd suggest it is more often mostly propane with butane contamination:

What is Autogas in the UK and Europe & how is it affected by temperature?

Autogas in the UK is predominantly propane. It can vary a little but in the UK Autogas is always the same mixture of gas that comes in a red exchange propane gas bottle, which is usually a minimum of 90% propane and the rest a mixture of butane and other bits of petroleum based products.

LPG (liquefied petroleum gas) vehicles

(4) In this regulation and in regulation 96 ‘liquefied petroleum gas’ means —

(a) butane gas in any phase which meet the requirements contained in the specification of commercial butane and propane issued by the British Standards Institution under the number BS4250: 1975 and published on 29th August 1975; or

(b) propane gas in any phase which meets the requirements contained in the said specification; or

(c) any mixture of such butane gas and such propane gas.

 

[Bru]

As far as I can discover, autogas (petrol station LPG) can be any mixture of the two, but I'd suggest it is more often mostly propane with butane contamination:

It's not "contaminated" with butane, it can legitimately be propane, butane or a mix of both. It's usually mostly or entirely propane but during the summer months especially and if butane is cheaper then a mix is supplied with a higher proportion of butane in it

As I've already posted, there's no easy way of finding out the proportions of the mix as even the staff on the forecourt won't know

 

[lustyd]

Ive never paid the sort of prices you have now.

We voted for freedom and by George we're going to pay for it regardless of the costs!

 

[Kukri]

I am another 3.9 kg propane user. Nothing bigger fits and the bottle handles must turn down. I put a one turn wrap of gas-type PTFE tape on the thread of the connector.

I also gave a 1950s vintage white enamel Taylor’s two burner paraffin cooker which sits happily on top of the very lovely GN Espace cooker in the event of “no gas”.