Cabin heater for a 28’ on swinging mooring

[armchairsailor]

I live through the week on a 28’ boat, sleeping 3-4nights on it at a time on the mooring. It looks like at one time there was a kerosene stove on the bulkhead, and there’s still the 1” flue through the cabin roof.

I’m thinking of reinstalling a heater to make life a little more civilized for the winter but am in two minds over propane versus kerosene as I’m concerned about condensation and general dampness becoming a problem.

I’m pretty sold on a cosy cabin setup as I don’t want to be cutting larger holes in the boat, but am swithering between the smell of diesel and dripping windows.

I’ll have to fit propane in any case to get my cooker going, so had thought I’d kill 2 birds with one stone by going with gas appliances throughout but now I’m not so sure. I’m looking to see if people have had experiences with both, and what their thoughts are. Thanks.

 

[Kelpie]

I might not be understanding you correctly, but why would one fuel cause more condensation than the other? Would they not both be vented anyway?

IMHO there is no easy/cheap solution to off grid heating a small boat.

 

[Poignard]

I have a 28' yacht and a very old Taylors paraffin heater which generates a lot of heat. I don't use it very often and never whilst we are sleeping but it seems to be quite economical to run. It doesn't need an electrical supply and the fuel doesn't take up much space, unlike the charcoal heater I used to have.

 

[armchairsailor]

I might not be understanding you correctly, but why would one fuel cause more condensation than the other? Would they not both be vented anyway?

From what I've gleaned you get moderate venting with a cozy cabin heater - it's only a little better than using the cooker, and one of the by-products of burning gas is water - hence the condensation problem. The boat's too small to install a Newport, which has the vented flue (both air in and exhaust out through a lined flue) and is a closed system and totally dry. Hence my thought of using oil-based heating instead as the "upgrade" to propane may not actually be without inherent problems.

I've found a taylors diesel stove, so that is one option to be considered.

 

[Capt. Clueless]

I'll follow this carefully, My boat is also the same size, and heating is on the list for winter night stay overs.

 

[Andibs]

My new to me boat has a bengco charcoal stove on it. Wonderful and also a "dry" heat so reduces condensation

Andy

 

[Kelpie]

From what I've gleaned you get moderate venting with a cozy cabin heater - it's only a little better than using the cooker, and one of the by-products of burning gas is water - hence the condensation problem. The boat's too small to install a Newport, which has the vented flue (both air in and exhaust out through a lined flue) and is a closed system and totally dry. Hence my thought of using oil-based heating instead as the "upgrade" to propane may not actually be without inherent problems.

I've found a taylors diesel stove, so that is one option to be considered.

I thought the Cozy was properly vented. Maybe not?
Propane and diesel will both produce water vapour. Charcoal is inherently drier. But it's all moot anyway because you really need to vent any combustion appliance to avoid CO buildup.

 

[pandos]

My new to me boat has a bengco charcoal stove on it. Wonderful and also a "dry" heat so reduces condensation

Andy

Great job, a fellow forumite in Switzerland has one of these and it keeps the boat up to comfortable levels in minus 10c...... but beware the carbon monoxide if things go wrong......

 

[armchairsailor]

I thought the Cozy was properly vented. Maybe not?
Propane and diesel will both produce water vapour. Charcoal is inherently drier. But it's all moot anyway because you really need to vent any combustion appliance to avoid CO buildup.

The cozy has a burner open to the air at the bottom - there will be inevitable escape of vapour, rather than it all going up the flue. In a similar way, the diesel/ kero burners are open and need to be pre-heated with alcohol prior to being fired up with the pressurised burner. If it doesn't work out perfectly, you'll get fumes all over the cabin, and have to start again with the whole lighting process. This way you get the stink of the diesel. But there's not as much moisture - hence my quandary.

The newports in comparison are sealed units with the cheery little gas fire-type windows in the front - dry heat from clean propane, but I'd have to hack a bigger hole in the deck and I'd need it to be lower down the bulkhead than it could be... A charcoal or wood stove would be fantastic, but similarly wouldn't fit, sadly.

 

[oldmanofthehills]

The fitting of charcoal heaters is an issue due to size, and also the difficulty of getting the damn things to light.. Wood is nice but the stoves are still larger and you risk soot on your spars. If there is a reasonable chimney a propane heater should be fine though I'd get a pair of CO monitors and ones with digital display.

Obviously if you had enough power for its circulating fan for 3 days the best solution is a Propex heater with both air intake and exhaust outside the boat. And you can mount it under the bunk and just have hot air come out by your feet. However unless you can top up batteries when you berth shoreside that probably not viable

 

[dansaskip]

My boat is 28ft and I have a Dickinson diesel heater (Newport) which is very effective. It does need prewarming (I use impregnated paper prewarmers) and it has an small electric fan which aids the starting procedure and ensures no fumes in the cabin but is not needed once the stove is going.
Advantage is that the fuel is easy to get and carry.
You would need to enlarge the hole for the flue I guess, probably to about 3 inches.

 

[armchairsailor]

Don’t the Newport’s need a 4’ flue?

 

[dansaskip]

Don’t the Newport’s need a 4’ flue?

Just checked the manual and the flue size is 3inch diameter with a recommended length of 3ft

 

[armchairsailor]

That would necessitate an extra chunk above deck when in use then. I’d have to place it on the bulkhead as there is only about 14-18” clearance from the top of the unit to the ceiling. Hey ho... There’s never a perfect solution is there?

 

[Normalfornorfolk]

Nigella Lawson and a big duvet would do it for me.

 

[armchairsailor]

...and they say boats are high maintenance...

 

[tcm]

Tell Nigella to bring along a dehumidifier? IMHO a primary cause of “jeez it's freezing” is due to moist air and hence damp fabrics in small boat.

Look, if you really feel like that about the boat Nigella then ok, best you ship off? I’m sorry you feels strongly about the flippin anchor design, sheesh! Very sad, and you only stayed a weekend! Aw. But leave the dehumidifier and i’ll call it Nigella as a nice memory, okay? mwah xxx

 

[Brent Swain]

I have lived aboard, mostly in the Salish Sea, for over 40 years, and I find that almost all living aboard outside suburbia, use strictly airtight wood stoves. Many have gone from diesel and propane to wood, and would never go back. The fuel is free, in endless quantities. Nothing dries a boat out quicker. As none are available for sale, most have to build their own stoves, or hire a back yard fabricator to build one. The endless supply of pulp mill type 316 stainless scrap is the best material for a wood stove, and stove pipe.
Spray foam insulation in a boat is also critical, for comfort here.

 

[Gerry]

Wood burner-wonderful dry heat. You only need a tiny one and they dont burn very much-you can collect the wood yourself and save cash. We have the larger model of this https://cubicminiwoodstoves.com/collections/cub-cb-108/products/cb-1008-br-cubic-mini-wood-stove it's keeping the boat toasty warm and wonderfully dry.

 

[Brent Swain]

Wood burner-wonderful dry heat. You only need a tiny one and they dont burn very much-you can collect the wood yourself and save cash. We have the larger model of this https://cubicminiwoodstoves.com/collections/cub-cb-108/products/cb-1008-br-cubic-mini-wood-stove it's keeping the boat toasty warm and wonderfully dry.

Nice looking stove!
You don't need the 20 inches of clearance they state. With proper shielding, 3 inches is plenty. We recently had a great discussion on that, on the origami boats site.
If you put a one inch space behind a sheet of aluminium or stainless, and fill that space with fibreglass house insulation, you have the same thing as Selkirk chimney. Very little heat gets past it. Aluminium, being a much better conductor of heat, is far more effective in dissipating heat than stainless. I have sat next to a super hot stove, and the aluminium sheet 4 inches from it was cool to the touch.
The bigger the sheet , the greater area the heat is dissipated over, and thus the cooler. That only works with aluminium.